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And negotiations with trump tower moscow? >> no doubt about it. as matt says, you read the body of the appointment of mueller and that is any links between the campaign and russia, what he has been directed to answer. and it did begin and comey knows this as a counterintelligence operation that he first announced to the congress. that's what it says in the appointment of mueller. that's the one that's being continued. i think he wants to give mueller breathing room and not prejudge in any way, but all of the things we've been hearing that have been developed over the last year plus go to that ...

Quickly. that was already known by the time the special counsel had already -- had started his operations. so he would sort of jump ahead by a light year on the investigative process which is why he unspooled very quickly these administration people who were having contact with foreign intelligence officers, foreign diplomats, foreign contacts in the old-school counterintelligence operation, like you played in one clip where he said, people that you call nontraditional agents and assets would make contact with american citizens and then manipulate them. this campaign from the very beginning, t...

Attention to the white house and saided following. it is not clear whether robert mueller is still pursuing the counter intelligence matter. no public evidence has emerged that mr. trump secretly conspired or took direction from the russian government. what are we to think, what's the hunch as to why you do a counter intelligence operation? >> it is not a criminal investigation. it is not designed diet or charge anybody with a crime. it is designed to get information to prevent a foreign enemy from intruding on american interests. that's why it should never be conducted by a special counsel, a...

That's critical, not about prosecutions. the fact that the president of the united states became a target of a counterintelligence operation is really something that at this point is not surprising but that we should still be stunned by. >> jeffrey goldberg, i want to read you something else from tom's column because i'm sure you'll agree with it. "finally, it's exhausting but nonetheless necessary to point out again the titanic hypocrisy of the republican party and of trump apologists in the conservative media." tom and i both former republicans and tom and i like so many americans aghast at ...

Counterintelligence operation especially on the president of the united states without layers and layers of review. and that's done to protect everybody involved. there has to be -- i'm convinced there's even more. there's signals intelligence. there's intelligence from our allies, human intelligence, and more information before the fbi could take the dramatic step of opening up a counterintelligence operation against the president of the united states. and then we have to look at it, now you have these and we find something. where are we? what's ultimately the difference between if he is an a...