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At a south carolina ice cream shop and hamburger shop to meet with voters is notable. is this a new strategy and does it tie into maybe he is struggling to fundraise? >> i don't think it is a deliberate strategy or something that trump who loves the big rallies, who loves to brag about how big his crowds are, is eager to have, but i think that that is the situation that he is dealing with right now and he is first to have. the crowd sizes i think are some kind of indicator of his support. i'm always a little cautious to say that there was a direct one to one ratio between the size of a crowd a...

A very wide swath, stretching all the way back to the washington moniment. the massive side of this crowd has never been a subject of your committee. is it true they have never investigated the size of the january 6th crowd. you know, it's sort of i guess not shocking that he came into office talking about his crowd sizes and he's still complaining about his crowd sizes. >> he would like the 2022 election to continue to be about him, which of course republicans would like it not to be about him. and i think the only thing that is helping republicans right now is that, while he is still trying ...

Crowds. the biggest crowd i've ever spoken by far. >> and joining me now, cnn senior political consultant john avlon. john, i've said this before. i think his brain is broke. there's no other description for when he says these things. he has this pavlovian way of -- he has to talk about crowd sizes in the most inappropriate situations. i don't understand why he would even -- it's just sick. >> sure, you do. it's because it's all about trump and his ego, which is simultaneously massive and fragile, so he wants to measure it. it's all about size for him so he's got to get some kind of inter

Trump campaign. i just find the whole thing to be frustrating and sad at this point. i'll definitely be looking to support somebody else in the republican primaries. >> when did you first hear anything about the oath keepers being involved on january 6th, and was that a bad idea? >> yeah, so there was an ongoing -- there was a split within the organizer group. the group that had control women for america first who i was working in conjunction with, we used real quality professional security, guys who do big crowd sizes. they're licensed. they're insured. they're serious people. there were othe...

Quarter of all of the trade between the united states and canada, this group is about 75 trucks. now usually, when we're trying to measure a protest, or analyze it success, we look at crowd size. but in this case, crowd sizes deceptive. if just 400 people were protesting in ottawa, heck of 2000 people in ottawa, it would be that big of a deal, if 75 people were brought blocking the ambassador bridge, it be a decent sized deal, but to be a big local story in windsor or detroit, not an international one. and yet, here we are, it cannot be said enough that these protesters are not in any way repr...