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Does this imply that they did give up more additional information since this is -- they have come back again? >> i think it implies that they probably tried to assert some kind of privilege or rely on something that the president said, a court probably looked at it and said that there are -- there might be individual statements you can have protected but you've got to come in. sew, yes, probably more -- i don't get the sense -- this is pure speculation they were blowing off the subpoena or fighting with the justice department but they can object to questions as they come in and may not answer ...

With some of his aides like giuliani and lawyer eastman. >> some of the committee's work has been on establishing that the president knew or should have known that he did, indeed, lose the election. you have the attorney general testifying that he told him that those claims were bs and others here. from a defense standpoint, what would the president have to show to undermine that argument? is it as simple as saying -- finding one helpful witness to say, well, i told him he did win the election and he believed me. is it that simple? >> it's not that simple. there are two very basic problems. ju...

The witness stand. all of us debated beforehand will we see kyle rittenhouse on the wind stand, obviously it worked and do you agree that he had no choice but to do that. >> not as a matter of law, but yes, i think as a matter of strategy, he had no choice. you have to put your client on the stand if you're claiming self-defense. it was interesting to hear the defense say they had two mock juries. we can debate the value of mock juries, but he did much better from the defense standpoint, when they put their client on the stand. kyle rittenhouse, the prosecution did not do much to undermine him...

Country in the world for this pandemic. as you know and i am not saying this to make anybody feel bad we did among the worst. 4% of the world's population we had 20% to 25% of the cases and hospitalizations and deaths. those things were terrible here. what happened? how do you model for human behavior? two things. there are lots of different ideas i came across and put into the book. we don't think of pandemics as we think of defense. we spend a lot of money on keeping ourselves safe from potential attacks from a defense standpoint. we treat pandemics like potential weather events, preordained...

Emphasis of preparing for the next one when you know we never prepare for anything? >> that is a good point and part of the reason for the book. according to the pandemic preparedness index the united states was the best prepared country in the world for this pandemic. as you know and i am not saying this to make anybody feel bad we did among the worst. 4% of the world's population we had 20% to 25% of the cases and hospitalizations and deaths. those things were terrible here. what happened? how do you model for human behavior? two things. there are lots of different ideas i came across and pu...