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Destroying destruction and so forth. and then it has a very, i mean, strong impact on the germany and what's one of the origin of what came with hitler and nazism and so forth. so i think that for europeans, this is a part of the memory and we need to keep that in mind. but this debate will have to take place. this might be a hard a hard question to answer, because the war is still ongoing, as you and i sit here. but once the war is over, how long would it take to rebuild ukraine? a few years. a few years, several years. it's clear, and it depends there, again, at the level of destruction and ...

Made to pay for some of the reconstruction and if so, how? i mean, it's a very difficult debate. i think, in a way, when you see all the assets that have been frozen, i can see the logic of using some of those things, some of these assets. i think when you have the history of europe in mind, the notion of reparation calls for sort of alert, i think we need to be aware of that also. for those who maybe don't have a long memory. you're talking about what happened in world war one and germany, and then that led to what we saw. exactly, because it was really the logic to make the country, which wa...