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Is -- essentially there was no contract. so unless there was a contract that was issued between the president's son and the foreign entity, they don't really feel that this is going to stick around. regardless, this does open up a new line of questions for robert mueller and his team to dig into. >> i spoke with one of the reporters on that story for "the new york times" yesterday. he said to me on air that while he was reporting it, he was struck by how close he felt to where bob mueller has been as he was talking to sources for that piece. back to informant story on the pressure being exerte...

Response or agreement, even if it doesn't actually get taken. we're sort of making judgments too early because we don't know all the facts. but this looks bad, it smells bad and it may be criminal. we don't know all the facts yet. there's also this question about the contracts. everyone's saying why would at&t, this customer, sign this contract with this ridiculous consulting company? i don't know what they were promised. that can be a basic kind of fraud claim or crime. and we don't know whether that was michael cohen acting alone or michael cohen with the backing of other people. was there s...

Into, dig into, dig up dirt on american citizens. what is your reaction? >> well, first of all, if it is true, it evidently didn't go anywhere because the allegation is that it started last year. we haven't heard a peep out of the people that were undertaking this, assuming that they were. secondly i think frankly pretty sadly, poppy, it is a great big giant flashing neon exhibit a and how low politics can become in this country where people resort to the demonization and character assassination of people with whom they simply disagree. can't be about the policy argument anymore. it has to be ...

That there were necessarily any other payments, but that does seem like more for mueller to dig into. >> well, one of the issues that the trump legal team has had and cohen's legal team is understanding what was actually in the documents that were taken from cohen's office. and i think that at least in the week or so after the raid in new york, the lawyers didn't feel like they were getting a fair idea from the clients about what actually is in these things. they were acknowledging that they were more concerned about the new york investigation than they were mueller's investigation because the...

Seem like more for mueller to dig into. >> well, one of the issues that the trump legal team has had and cohen's legal team is understanding what was actually in the documents that were taken from cohen's office. and i think that at least in the week or so after the raid in new york, the lawyers didn't feel like they were getting a fair idea from the clients about what actually is in these things. they were acknowledging that they were more concerned about the new york investigation than they were mueller's investigation because they had no idea what was actually in there. and simply the idea ...