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>> we thought the cold war was over and won it without firing a shot. putin thinks it is coming back. he doesn't think we won it. how is he fighting the cold war? the same way we won it last time. on economic ground. jenna: is he winning? >> i think he is doing a pretty darn good job. why? because he has ukraine in an economic vice. they're broke. they have a $15 billion debt. nobody will lend them the money. nobody will bail them out, except russia. they're vulnerable with their energy. all of their energy from natural gas pro russia. russia has shown in the past they're per lechly content to...

But president obama isn't doing that at home. he is highly unlikely to do it in ukraine. finally he would have to stare down putin. the problem, jenna. putin will not let his go. it is part of his plan to rebid the greater russia and ukraine is the crown jewel in the first step in it. jenna: what does he gain and we lose if we can look at it in those terms if at the end of this crisis and there is really no end in sight right now. >> nope. jenna: the ukraine does move closer to russia? what does he win and what do we lose? >> what putin is trying to do, he said in the past one of the greatest ...