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Award? because i think she's up for it. >> i think it would put the kibosh on it, frankly. because i do think that's how people lean out there. and you have a much more liberal choice in "lincoln," if you will. the tony kushner certified choice. >> you're right, kushner's going to help. >> i'm very ambivalent about this movie myself. i'm very wishy-washy about it. on one hand, i think it's the most phenomenally made movie of the year. i think it's a great piece of filmmaking. on the other hand, i think it's amoral. i have strong questions about the use of the information. >> we're about to dis...

Exhibit. >> clarence, you've seen this movie before. it sounds like something is in the works here, huh? >> yeah, something is in the works at least on the senate side. on the house side, we still don't know about those hard core intransigents and even if the senate does come up with something, if the house can agree to go along with it, if as kristen said, you've got to have all of the democrat and 30 republicans. there's only about six who come. the rest don't seem to lose any points, as far as they're concerned, by a peering to be as much of a roadblock as they can, even if it means going o...

>> you were wonderful tonight, young man. >> what do you mean? >> just what i said. you were graceful. you were confident. you're going to be a very fine king. >> i don't know what to say. >> your father would be very proud. >> i'm not so certain about that. >> if i were your father, i'd be proud. >> well, bill murray playing the charming f.d.r, laying it on the king of england. what did you make -- i will definitely see it. >> it's a strange little movie. it's kind of shapeless. but there is something very interesting going on now. learning as you learn more about the lives of great men. you ...

So you watch this movie and it makes you think lincoln wasn't just some guy who sat on a pedestal. he was a guy out there playing hardball. he had these three lobbyists in the film. i wish we could take -- >> no, they were on the fiscal cliff. >> the fiscal cliff guys and it says -- >> no, they're the best lobbyists i've seen. it showed that the democratic party of that day were pretty were copperheads. they were playing ball with the war ending saying that they could let the south keep slavery. >> right. and you know everything didn't really change until the so-called southern strategy. i had...

I think it's a hustle of genius. i think ben should take that senate position that's open. he proves that he is just a consummate showman in this movie. everything about this movie is real. absolutely real. fetishistically real, except for the climax which is straight out of a hollywood cliff hanger from the 1920s. but it's a terrifically entertaining movie. and it shows you how much we didn't know way back when. >> i know, i remember as a side story, what a great role the canadian ambassador played. it looked like him. anyway, now back to politics and bill murray's portrayal of f.d.r. and his...