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Caucus effect, right, there's a story i think people are telling themselves in political circles which is basically the shutdown kind of broke the fever of the tea party in washington. and they've been domesticated a bit. that they're no longer as powerful and this clean debt ceiling raise means basically their power has ebbed and that's where things stand now. do you buy that story? >> i've gone back and forth on it, myself. i'm not sure. it would have seemed to have peaked at the time. however, we've seen boehner go back on immigration reform after he endorsed it for about a week. i think th...

Caucus effect, right, there's a story i think people are telling themselves in political circles which is basically the shutdown kind of broke the fever of the tea party in washington. and they've been domesticated a bit. that they're no longer as powerful and this clean debt ceiling raise means basically their power has ebbed and that's where things stand now. do you buy that story? >> i've gone back and forth on it, myself. i'm not sure. it would have seemed to have peaked at the time. however, we've seen boehner go back on immigration reform after he endorsed it for about a week. i think th...

If we do have a catastrophe october 17th, 18th or 19th. we don't know what day it is. what does he say? obama could have moved the money around, but he didn't? he brought on the catastrophe? what's their fall back? >> i don't know. pat toomey is my kind of republican. i'm a club for growth republican. i'm sure that will come back to haunt me on twitter sometime. but he's a small-government republican. he's also a guy that actually supported background checks at a time that it cost him a great deal politically with the national republican party. it doesn't make accept, but i tell you this. i th...

And backed away from it. it's hard to find mike barnacle, the "wall street journal" says we're for small government you guys are walking into a canyon. you're going to get killed by this. i think this is the point, mike, isn't it? where the fever breaks and the people that have fund ad lot of these campaigns in the past say you guys have stepped over the line and what you're doing is not only bad for the republican party, it's bad for my business and it's bad for america. >> well, the koch brothers have gone to the point yesterday to point out that they are not among the deniers. >> yeah. of c...

It. >> states like illinois have problems. let me go back to this skid in the game. pat toomey is smart. what skin does he have in this game? if we do have a catastrophe october 17th, 18th or 19th. we don't know what day it is. what does he say? obama could have moved the money around, but he didn't? he brought on the catastrophe? what's their fall back? >> i don't know. pat toomey is my kind of republican. i'm a club for growth republican. i'm sure that will come back to haunt me on twitter sometime. but he's a small-government republican. he's also a guy that actually supported background ch...