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And in the mueller report it says that he stopped them from getting to the truth of the matter. >> yeah. and so we haven't seen any pardons. we haven't darn we've seen a few public signs from trump saying that he might consider it. but i don't know. i don't know how to look at this. do you think that donald trump would go out there and pardon paul manafort unless paul manafort was doing something to actually help trump and needed to keep doing that? it's unclear at this point if manafort, flynn have not fully cooperated. they're sitting on information that would be worse for donald trump than ...

Paul manafort unless paul manafort was doing something to actually help trump and needed to keep doing that? it's unclear at this point if manafort, flynn have not fully cooperated. they're sitting on information that would be worse for donald trump than what's already out there. so we do know that flynn has this new lawyer, sydney powell, who is a fox news commentator who believes mueller has destroyed evidence. >> right. >> who believe there's is an obama deep state plot against flynn, all the crazy conspiracy stuff that you hear on sean hannity, she is down with that. i don't know if she is...