Going to be more or less safe now as a result. at a minimum, two opposite views on this. let's get perspective. tom fuentes, cnn law enforcement analyst and former fbi assistant director and mike baker, former c.i.a. covert operations officer and president of diligence llc, a global intelligence forum. torture, tom fuentes, is as old a concept as violence itself. the assumption is it works and that's why it exists. you say that assumption is flawed, why? >> well i think, chris, that it works in a limited situation. but for the most part, the other techniques, actually work better. and i think ...