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You're in the middle of a global pandemic. it's not exactly easy and that can lead to significant impacts. >> yeah, good point. tell me this. how does the perpetrators being, it would appear, in russia hamper efforts to get on top of this, even if these aren't government actors and they might well be? but even if they are just criminal, it would certainly seem that vladimir putin and his government isn't acting against them. how significant is that? >> it absolutely gives them air cover. so a lot of these criminals in eastern europe and in russia and other places, their governments don't lock ...

And then also i think it's decidedly unhelpful to have used words such as irreversibility. 0k, people will say the whole point of a vaccination programme is to protect and open up. businesses will want to operate at full capacity as soon as possible. they haven't done so for a very long time, as we all know. so many people will be asking, does it matter if cases are high if hospitalisations stay low? and i guess that's the real nub of the data we are looking at, isn't it? that's absolutely right. an infectious disease when nobody falls seriously ill is really not an infectious disease worth de...

Manufacturing. so disruption to them is very difficult to catch up for, especially if you are in the middle of a global pandemic. it's not exactly easy, and that can lead to significant impacts. >> yeah. yeah. good point. i mean, tell me this. how -- how -- how does the perpetrators being, it would appear, in russia hamper efforts to get on top of this? even if these aren't government actors, and they might well be. but even if they are just criminal, it would certainly seem, you know, vladimir putin and his government isn't acting against them. how significant is that? >> it, absolutely gives...

>> they idolized things nathan had told him during his interview at the police station the night of the murder, like the fact he owned three guns. >> i got a shotgun. >> well do you know what -- >> 12 gauge shotgun. >> what else you got? >> i have a 22. silver with pearl handle, little. they have a primary, one which is a glock. >> which model? >> model i don't know it's a 40. >> a lot of things about mavens guns that didn't add up for police. starting with the fact that he happened to own the same type of gun used in denise murder. >> how did he explain that? >> it couldn't. >> i think he was...

>> even on this issue of security clearances, for example. this is not the deep state conspiring against president trump and his family. this is his chief of staff, john kelly, writing contemporaneous memos citing that he didn't believe jared kushner didn't meet the criteria for one. >> the oversights in policy decisions as well. the child separation policy. you have secretary nielsen saying we don't lock kids in cages, despite all visual evidence that they do lock kids in cages. their efforts to cut back national monuments. it will happen on so many levels. >> last question to you about bob m...