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The iceberg? >> i do think it's the tip of the iceberg. first of all, i don't think anybody expected a tax and fraud case as massive as that that has been filed against manafort and gates. >> what does that mean? >> well, it's bigment and the other thing is no one expected to see what was in that plea agreement which shows a cooperating witness. and that reads to me like an outline of a chapter from a spy novel. it's just -- and it hints at so much more. it deliberately states this isn't all the facts we have, in essence that they have much more. >> this was a surprise, wasn't it, john? >> a b...

Strategy to play nice is an epic failure. i'm sure not everybody who has the president's ear is making this kind of radical -- giving him these radical ideas, but certainly steve bannon is and given the fact that we are told that the president has been seething today, he might be open to this very different 180 in strategy. >> it seems like they've been at least starting it the last week with all the hillary clinton stuff. >> yeah. hillary clinton is one thing. going after the special counsel. >> is another. >> is a whole different thing. and we'll see if they actually take him up on it. >> th...

They try to i am pair it, that's what that statute deals with. >> john flarnry, i want to get your take. >> yeah. hell has no fury like a man child caught in the cookie jar. all this nonsense about oh, it's okay and it doesn't involve us, well now we get the truth. now we see that we're closer than ever to this guy giving up the dpoes. and if he tries to do what he's done and to overrule the rule of law, and this investigation was within the four corners of the authority of the special counsel statute and the warranty was given, then theshtd be forcing his impeachment, his resignation, even hi...

That's how this papadopoulos is described in these papers. >> well, that means somebody who is doing recordings, whether it was wearing a wire or making recorded phone calls. it's somebody who is actively going out and trying to get evidence. >> and john flarnry, they should be concerned, the white house about this. >> oh, absolutely. and there's another thing. we overlook the fact that there was a wire tap under the fisa for paul manafort. and no one knows what they got or didn't get in that. there have been some outlines of it. and there were two version of it. and one overlapped when the pr...

Since papadopoulos was arrested in july and the time that he signed this plea agreement in october 3rd, there have been all these interviews done of people in the white house. and we didn't know that this papadopoulos document existed. so there's a lot of people who have now been able to provide interviews to the special counsel without the benefit of knowing what was in here. >> yeah. all right. thank you both. i appreciate it. i need to get to some more analysis now. i want to bring in john dean, also marriottty and john flarnry. i'm so glad to have all of you great minds on this evening to ...