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Into mountains of grievances by sunni communities. let me give your viewers a glance -- a glimpse of what we're talking about. you still have tens of thousands of sunnis in iraq who are treated like criminals because isis functioned within their own communities, they are placed in detention camps, they are excluded, they are treated like basically criminals. they are collectively punished. so isis, even though it lost the khalifa, the territorial khalifa in 2017 in iraq, it has been able to find a refuge within these sunni communities in iraq. in fact, your question is so important because the...

Killing one individual regardless of how important this individual will not really put a permanent end to the islamic state. what has happened -- what has happened in the past three years, after the dismantling of the khalifa, the physical khalifa in iraq and syria the group has mutated into a resilient insurgency, a low cost resident insurgency. it has a few thousand sand fighters. low-cost operations. it has sprawling operations in syria and iraq and afghanistan. it has carried out thousands, not hundreds, fareed, thousands of attacks in iraq and syria and afghanistan. it has targeted mainly...

Are describing, and it seems that isis particularly in iraq and syria is feeding on a certain amount of sunni resentment against how they are treated, particularly in iraq by the shia majority, in syria it's a little more complicated but there are kind of hard line sunnis. you know, if that sectarian dynamic is at its heart, what does the united states as an outside force do? >> well, i mean, i think insurgencies as we know, insurgencies can go for a long time, local insurgencies. it's about really addressing the grievances of the local populations. it's not just whether in the middle east, al...

Angry sunnis. this is in iraq. in syria the kurdish-led militias who basically control the prisons where you have thousands of islamic state fighters and tens of thousands family members have not really been able to build the trust with the local communities, mainly local arab and sunni communities in northeastern syria. so isis this insurgency has been able to really find a refuge and the question is how do you address the grievances? how do you deal with punishing poverty? how do you provide security and, fareed, look, the united states is missing in action. really the american foreign polic...

>> let me ask you, fawaz, about on that issue, you wrote a very prescient piece on foreign policy in august of 2021 as the taliban was taking control of afghanistan. you wrote, the taliban can't control -- that should be in the west. this major problem just in terms of the taliban taking over which has proved to be entirely true, they face terrorist attacks all the time. how unstable is afghanistan and do you worry that it could become the cockpit once again of terror groups getting larger and larger as the instability grows? >> you know, there is -- we're not really talking about mysterious c...