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Blowback for the president in the wake of the shutdown deal what it could mean for new talks to keep the government open. the roger stone indictment and how much peril the president is in from it. >> i intend to fight because this indictment is fabricated. there indictment is thin as can be >> plus, the new questions being raised about jared kushner's top secret security clearance. good day from msnbc world headquarters in new york i'm frances rivera long time trump friend roger stone talking to nbc news outside of his home in florida one day after the special counsel charged him. here's wha...

To wikileaks. >> that may be next. matthew, you heard here sam's perspective in saying he doesn't believe roger stone will cooperate with mueller because of his loyalty to the president. then we've seen that, michael cohen perfect example. say it again and again he would take a bullet for the president. so do you see him cooperating? >> well, obviously, we don't know what's going to happen, but yes. time and again and this happens across all sorts of federal prosecutions. you have people who start out saying they'll never cooperate and once had he face the reality of potentially going to jail,...

Opportunity if they put enough pressure on him to get him to at least give up that person who directed him, perhaps they already know who that is and i think that you could look at him maybe cutting a deal. flipping, i don't know if it's outright flipping, but we'll see. >> jonathan, what you do you think about that where is he, you don't see it happening, though? >> first of all, i don't know. a lot of things can happen. i don't want to be categorical in saying he wouldn't cooperate. conspiracy is not part of this indictment. it can be added later on and that is the core of this case, not per...

About that, since it never happened, it appears to me that they have composed testimony for someone. perhaps rick gates, perhaps steve bannon >> all right so you just mentioned this you were talking about that. how far in there is the involvement? could it be donald trump >> look, the short answer is we don't know mueller is very, very careful about how he drafts these indictments. that was put in there for a reason i suspect that was put in there for a reason for mueller's purpose because of coming indictments. that's a presumption i have no obviously direct knowledge of it. but in terms of r...

Court on tuesday charged with seven counts of lying to congress, obstruction and witness tampering. he was not charged though with conspiring against the united states but his indictment reveals a clearer picture of potential ties between the trump campaign and wikileaks. joining me is former trump campaign adviser sam nunberg great to have you with me right here. >> thank you. >> this is the first time you heard those words from roger stone as he stepped out moments ago. what are your thoughts calling in an ainge jus overreach by mr. mueller and saying his dogs are traumatized? >> it seemed i...