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Commission, one of the most devastating things is we can't point to a case where the bulk protected us. >> it's both a liberal and conservative argument to say we can come back to the same place, but let's debate it. we don't know a lot of this stuff that's been done. >> there should abe full debate, because when we go back to david's point on health care, we have to retrust the government. regardless of where you sit on the spectrum, i think some of the revelations you've seen have even shocked some in the program. i think putting in some safeguards, if we're going to collect that data, that ...

Protected us. >> it's both a liberal and conservative argument to say we can come back to the same place, but let's debate it. we don't know a lot of this stuff that's been done. >> there should abe full debate, because when we go back to david's point on health care, we have to retrust the government. regardless of where you sit on the spectrum, i think some of the revelations you've seen have even shocked some in the program. i think putting in some safeguards, if we're going to collect that data, that it be housed with phone companies, that a court order be given authorization for a third p...

That are going to continue to happen as the corporate mandate goes in. we're going to start seeing people losing their insurance, and there's going to be a lot of angry people. >> isn't the crux of the matter that people don't like government telling them this is what is best for you, as a business this is how you have to operate. so in our quest to do good -- again, this is the argument -- it's too coercive. >> corporations tell you you're too old for that program or whatever; sorry. >> we have a much more individualistic country. we don't like the government telling us what to do. >> but a l...

Said we're going to let the government default unless we get our way, it was highly unpopular. i understand there is some sabre rattling right now by speaker boehner and minority leader mcconnell. and that's natural. they cut a good deal, i thought, on the budget, and they had to show the hard right that they're going to do something else. but at the end of the day, the president is going to hold firm, no negotiations on debt ceiling, republicans will look back to october and say, we're not going through this again. >> so here's a question about holding firm that some of the papers in new york...

Nuclear program. back off on sanctions for now. how do you respond? >> look, there are many of us, democrats and republicans in this senate who believe the best way to avoid war and get around to give up nuclear weapons is by ratcheting up sanctions, not by reducing them. the iranians didn't come to the table out of the goodness of their heart. they're still labeled a supremacist organization, the leader is still pulling the strings. only tough sanctions will get them to give up. i give the president credit for talking. i don't agree with some on the hard line who say no talking until they giv...