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Cia, the american cia or the russians that we should be choosing the russians is insane. speaking of what joel just said, malcolm, you do already have in bed with wikileaks. you do have both wikileaks and breitbart in europe trying actively right now to impact elections and they don't want to impact them toward the more western candidates, they want to direct them toward the trump cloenz? >> i think it's fascinating that nigel met with julian assange. you know he did. he doesn't go dropping in for tea. he was there meeting with him and the question is what kind of coordination is faraje doing ...

The american public shubl deeply troubled. so the truth of that statement from your point of view, malcolm is the cia in the general routine business of using our cell phones and tvs to spy on americans? >> no. they're not. absolutely not. and neither is the national security agency and believe me, i know both these agencies. they just don't do it. it is a legal land mine and there is not a warrant available on america citizen as a target, you are hammered. even with inadvertent exposure. we don't play games with american citizens. on the other hand, if you are a counter terrorism target, a co...

We don't have time for the american public and wikileaks is trying to stoke this paranoia and the fun part about it is, on behalf of russian intelligence. why should we believe a thing that this guys says? it steals documents and exposes them and he just benefited isis and al qaeda and everybody else who we could have been collecting against. >> you and i talked about this offline. there is this thing where wikileaks managed to make themselves heroic, but also for the longest time on the left and sort of made themselves heros of transparency. talk about julian assange, is he even a liberal and...

Laying on the floor of the apartment. that is how they verify that. they know. they problem see another guy moving around, may be trying to hide, crawling on the floor, maybe wounded, like malcolm said, he might have a suicide vest on a really good chance. they have time on their side at the moment. if all the citizens are evacuating. they will play it slow. they will win. if it's him, it's huge intelligence development. but they have gotten all this intelligence from all the great work they have done over the last few days. they did 100. the raids. they have the citizens behind them. when you...

He was working for the trump campaign, and then in the white house. so, again, he has a lot of incentive to try to bring the goods against somebody who's higher up on the chain. which means somebody in the oval office. so it's perfectly right that there's not a done deal now. he's got a lot of pressure, though, to really deliver somebody high up, and, again, that means president trump, somebody in the oval office, or somebody in president trump's family. again, obviously, mule sir -- a guy with integrity, only wants the goods if their true and there is concern sometimes about people who cooper...