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Involving taxpayer money. shulkin disputes this. the president moved onto ronny jackson. the question is did he have the management ability? he was also accused of drunken behavior. we have been a month now, a little more without a veterans affairs secretary. 385,000 people employed by this department and nearly $200 billion budget. it's a big job. it needs to be filled. the president says he was railroaded. >> he is one of the finest men that i have met over the last long period of time. high quality family. i just met them. and i explained what happened.

Management ability. someone can get it back to what it was. i'm not sure i've been sold by any other candidate they can have the ability to get it back. ted cruz gueets the same idea b he doesn't show me the charisma or leadership ability to make things happen. carly fiorina has somewhat of an ability to lead as being an ceo formerly. i'm not sold on the other half of her when it comes to the ideas and the ability to follow through on many of her positions. >> thanks, give me one name if not the donald? >> ted cruz. >> ted cruz. okay. that's what i suspected thank you both for being here. appr...

They have people that they don't. people are calling the -- people can calling the insurance companies and finding out they don't have coverage. and they thought they had it. and you -- as you know, you have lost 55 million plans. it's terrible. >> all right. let me -- we only have a minute left. i'm curious. rumor in favor, theoretically, of having a governor as a president or someone who has had executive experience rather than someone who hasn't? would it this have made any difference whatsoever in your mind? i'm in favor of something somebody who is extremely competent and smart. >> how ab...

Congress rather than the internal revenue service which has had some real questions about its management ability here. jenna: and, carl, how does obamacare factor into this? >> reporter: big. [laughter] it's a sixth of the national economy, so it's pretty huge. the irs is tasked with collecting the fines for people who don't get insurance on the the exchanges if they don't have coverage now. never mind the fact that it is involved in all the agencies and the revenues of the entire government, so the obamacare problems with the launch and its management all are a reflection of whether the irs c...

Bush was his management ability to utilize people. he understood me better than i knew myself at the time. he said, hey, by the way, i don't think you would ever do this to me. i went -- and he nailed it. because that's what i was worried about, my relationship with him being affected by a book written by an insider. >> could you imagine driving and having someone talk, give you a story. >> and they're going to have more clips and a hilarious one that involves jasper. >> looking out the back? >> there's more. more to come from real clear politics morning commute. >> taco thursday. >> taco thur...