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Look, the government has lots of oceans of data. the government demands that i tell them every penny i make and how i made it. that also is in one sense an invasion of privacy. but there's a larger national purpose, which that serves. that same applies to this metadata collection. what do we do with the data? what we do, chris, let me give you an example. we roll up a terrorist cell, let's say yemen, which james rosen referred to in his piece, we roll up a terrorist cell there, find a cellphone about which we had no knowledge prior to that raid. we take that cellphone number, metaphorically, w...

Administration is more transparent about this effort than we were in the bush administration. i mean, they made this meta data collection activity available to all the members of congress, not just the members of the intelligence committee. >> all the members of congress, not just the members of the intelligence committee but now that these leaks have happened and this debate happened in the public, does the president have to communicate more with the people. does it have to do more or is it too risky? >> i think the president does need to communicate more. this is controversial. people are di...

Intent of the law. >> in a bipartisan majority in both houses of congress apparently disagree with richard. because they have authorized this program and continued to authorize this program. and frankly, the obama administration was more transparent about this effort than we were in the bush administration. i mean, they made this meta data collection activity available to all the members of congress. not just all the members of the intelligence committees. >> last question for you, as a former bush administration official, do you ever find it odd given how quiet the obama administration has be...

Marathon, they were filming everybody there. but they certainly help pinpoint the two suspects who were eventually identified thanks to those cameras. i guess the argument ari is making is what the nsa is now doing with this metadata collection. they are going through a lot of stuff. they might be able to pinpoint some of that stuff and prevent another 911. a lot of folks say, you know what, if they can do that, fine. >> first of all, again, we have no evidence that that, in fact, is the case or these attacks couldn't be stopped through other information. i think this is deeply flawed. those w...

Government. what's happening now, we're talking about whether or not to turn over user information, whether to unlock encryption. that's a very different ask, and they don't want to do it. >> actually we're talking about other things, chris. this is why it's helpful that i understand technology. hillary clinton tried to issue the same line last night and then had to quickly say i don't understand much about technology, because she doesn't. let me give you an example of what i'm talking about. when we miss with all the metadata collection we've had. the san bernardino couple and the tsarnaev br...