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Are now sending large amounts of weapons. we should continue to do so because our aim, as jake sullivan, the national security advisor said this weekend, is a free and independent ukraine. and we are not going to get a free and independent ukraine without ukraine actually being able to, not only stop the invasion but reverse it. and that requires major military capabilities. we should be aware that the russians have a vote in this. not only on the ground in ukraine but the possibility that they could escalate in the way that you and mike were talking about. i agree with mike that we shouldn't ...

Believe security required to be part of the alliance, we believe that's their right and we should do so. not only does that mean we will have an obligation to defend these two countries, but they will have an obligation to defend the rest of nato, including the baltic states, which remain expoegszed, no matter the outcome of the war when it comes to russian capabilities. i think european security will be enhanced and the security of finland and sweden will be enhanced and russian security will be enhanced. that poses no threat to russia. is in everyone's interest. >> and just finally, mike mcf...