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Something that we believe is constitutionally protected regardless of where we might place our bets on what the courts would do with it? if we see a particular right that might be jeopardized by an act of congress, we are considering, wouldn't be inappropriate for us to say, look, we are not sure exactly how far the supreme court will go here. out of an abundance of caution, out of respect for the constitution, we are going to draw the line more carefully to make sure we don't step into unconstitutional territory? >> that has happened historically and i think happens today. and that underscore...

The written record was detailed, accurate and complete. so the consistent legal advice, it never changed, was that there was no legal requirement to retain the tapes, but there were some policy objections to disposing of the tapes. so our job in the office of the deputy director for operations was to arrange consultations with senior leaders at the agency. at the time the tapes were destroyed, mr. rodriguez asked me to prepare a cable because he was going to have another conversation with then-director of the agency to talk about this issue again. i did so. a couple of days later he released t...

Never changed. there was no legal requirement to retain the tapes. but there were some policy objections to disposing of the tapes. so our job in the office of the deputy director for operations was to arrange consultations with senior leaders at the agency. at the time the tapes were destroyed, mr. rodriguez asked me to prepare a cable, because he was going to have another conversation with then director of the agency to talk about this issue again. i did so. a couple days later, he released the order he believed on his own authority. he took the decision himself and he said it was based on h...

So the consistent legal advice, it never changed was that there was no legal requirement to retain the tapes. but there were some policy objections to disposing of the tapes. so our job in the office of the deputy director for operations was to arrange consultations with senior leaders at the agency. at the time the tapes were destroyed, mr. rodriguez asked me to prepare a cable because he was going to have another conversation with then director of the agency to talk about this issue again. i did so. a couple of days later, he released the order, he believed, on his own authority. he took the...

With what mr. pruitt has done. his ethical lapses notwithstanding. the fact that his priorities for the epa are to roll back protections for people like the people in my hometown of flint. to actually increase the likelihood that there will be more drinking water problems in this country. and in the meantime take money that could be used for those purposes and give 25 and $30,000 pay raises over the policy objections of the white house. i mean, if you can breech the ethical standards of the trump white house, you have set a new record for breaching ethical standards, and he ought to go. >> is ...