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From the old. instead of vengeance, mandela sought truth and reconciliation, he did what he did because it saved his country. when he came to power, many wondered how he would steer the new country's foreign policy. after all the african national congress which he headed had been supported by the revolutionaries of the world. gadhafi, arafat, castro, but mandela knew what countries were in his best interests. he steered nit a pro democratic, pro western -- honoring his old comrades, never forgetting their support. his final act of greatness was leaving office. very few black african leaders ha...

His organization, had been supported by revolutionaries, by gadhafi, by castro, he steers his country in the direction of pro western, pro markets, pro democracy. he never let's go of the personal loyalty to those people. i would not be surprised if at the funeral you see something very similar. there will be some people who we might regard as coming out of the rogue states of the world. then there will be barack obama and the entire western world will be there to pay homage. >> if i can just -- >> go ahead. >> it was also about him, a sweetness, a gentleness he changed the room. there were so...

Be great reconciliations. there will be people like gorbachev, who were able to take the soviet union and do away with the bad, but couldn't really build the good. he had a kind of political genius, aside from the moral courage. i was reflecting, wolf, you were showing the videos of him, for example, embracing fidel castro. i remember when he came out of prison and elected in '94, everyone wondered, what is this guy going to do? because the countries that had supported the african national congress, that had supported, you know, the anti-apartheid movement were cuba, gadhafi, arafat, these rev...

And he says he's not my slingshot and admits and it you take the slingshot away, what have you done? what's the accountable? i don't think we should take this very seriously. i think putin filled a void. unfortunately, the world and president obama created this situation but their indifference and when you draw a line in the sand, you have to defend your word and -- >> president obama talked about the red line being crossed and regime change and getting rid of assad and this week john kerry saying an unbelievably small strike. what message does that send from the american military, never mind ...

Other guests both of whom are good friends. my short answer is no. if we started two years ago, we could have built a coalition with the free syrian army and christians and curds that were pro western. at this point i was opposed for a variety of reasons, but one of which is, the coalition of islamist are already persecuting the christians, they are attacking the christian villages and burning churches and this will only be worse if they ultimately in control of all of syria. >> there is a lot of mixed messages coming out of the pentagon. it was saying that there was not a good outcome that wo...