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Yob that i don't know that i can speak for all of miel co -- my colleagues but that's how i feel. >> you're the one i wanted to talk to. i appreciate this. i hope it's part of a continuing conversation. >> thank you for having me. >> that's a good window into the challenge for the democrats. how do they keep the temptation to go after the president and balance against the constitutional duty of oversight? we'll watch. biden 2020 is something that the right and left are both bracing for. some are relishing on both sides. i have some questions on a changing democratic party. who better to ask th...

That as a reasonable justification at this point. why to you is it such an easy leap? >> i don't think it's an easy leap. it's completely the reason that we have to keep following this. we have to keep finding the evidence and making sure that we are doing our due diligence. it's our constitutional responsibility. impeachment is a political thing as much as it is anything else, unfortunately. so we have to recognize that reality and it's our job to do the investigations and present the evidence and if it is political it's going to have to be both parties that get on board. >> true. the only wa...

California representative katie hill is one of the democrats leading the push on oversight. big news. paul manafort, 47 months. some people thought he was going to spend life in jail. this isn't even four years. your thoughts? >> i do think it's short. i think that it's -- this is the judicial process. we can only do what we can do. there's a lot that comes clear after this. all of these charges were in relation to what he was doing with a russian backed ukrainian president and ukrainian government and the ties we're seeing, the connections with this administration and this president and russi...

Independently have merit. they were worthy of prosecution on their own separate and apart from the political context his real problem he was never charged with. you understand this very well but collusion is a behavior, not a crime, unless we're talking about securities law. you'd have to have a furtherance of it, actually coordination that points to a conspiracy. >> the judge was trying to signal that early on in the proceedings when he said look, i think more than anything else to say everybody put the brakes on things and don't try to read anything into this with regard to collusion. i'm go...

Since i was independent counsel. along is that if what you're talking about is using prosecution as an alternative tool toward politics. >> this is congressional oversight. >> that's fine but i think they need to be more candid about what their intentions are. oversight is one thing. if really what they're talking about here is they don't want -- the leadership doesn't want to signal what their intentions are but this is about impeachment, that's a problem. >> you knew he was lying to you about things. why, you don't know but you know he lied about when he was negotiating a deal. he lied about...