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Forward, may even do reconciliation themselves to push those other things forward after they get this one thing done. >> that is entirely possible. but again, the bipartisan talks for the infrastructure bill is something that biden has been saying from the beginning that he wanted to see. so he's really sort of backed into the corner in terms of having to accept this particular package. the reconciliation tool is not something that it's entirely clear they'll be able to get all those things through. democrats have been trying to see if they can use it in a sort of new, experimental way that it...

Bipartisan negotiations on the infrastructure. and the only reason those negotiations are happening, i think, is because the white house has not secured his vote to be the 50th vote to get it to reconciliation. so you wonder if there's any crossing over in his mind between these two enterprises he's engaged in? >> no, manchin is holding this very interesting and unique position and so is kyrsten sinema. he's able to push the white house into coming to the negotiating table because again basically threatened to tank whatever bill democrats are hoping to pass in the senate. and even if they use ...

Crossing over in his mind between these two enterprises he's engaged in? >> manchin is holding a very unique position, so as kristen cinema, he is able to be pushing the white house to come to the negotiating table in terms of infrastructure. because he can tank any bill republicans want to pass in the senate. even if they used the reconciliation tool, he has power. as we're seeing with the january 6th commission, manchin is hoping that republicans will come together, will be negotiating in good faith and what he is recognizing, and even though he is saying he hopes they find the way, the odds...

Sure. the question is how much growth, is it enough growth representative to actually make up for what it's going to cost and as you look towards an infrastructure program what that's going to cost. >> well look, if you went back to when president trump was in ag rated and you said we're going to be north of 3% growth rate if you thought the stock market was going to be where it's at everybody would have laughed. everybody would have said no president trump is not going to be able to get anything done, get anything passed. now president trump has had an advantage so far in being able to use th...

With the rules. senate budget rules that we have to be mindful of and we want to make sure when he pass a bill out of the house that bill ads here to the senate rules so that we can use the reconciliation tool we need to use to pass tax reform. those sunsets things that are done to make sure the bill conforms to the rules. we don't personally like in the house, but we need to follow if we want to make sure that's privileged. >> there is this expectation that congress will act later to extend those. >> i believe that as well. >> doesn't that imply then that the deficit impact will be greater? >...