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The recusal question, which is another thing that will have to be decided by the doj and ultimately decided by the acting attorney general shows the checks and balances. the president is constrained by constitution and law but also constrained by political pressure. and it's fairly clear what the president's motive was here. jeff sessions is the sixth cabinet official to leave in this administration. if the other five cases, the deputy stepped up into the job, as is the normal practice. it's clear that the president went around that process and i pointed whitaker here, instead of rod rosenstei...

The way in which, or the recusal thing works at the doj, there's no law or even regulation that compels you to go to the ethics folks at justice and say what should i do here? but both legal ethics and political probity normally means if you think you have a conflict you go and say -- ask for recommendation. it appears whitaker is not going to do that. in fact, as joyce just said, the reason he was chosen is precisely because he has these conflicts. how does that recusal question play out as a matter just practically speaking over the days ahead? >> i think you're right. i think the proper thi...

But it's clear he's going to. in fact, it's increasingly clear that's why he was brought on board. >> so jeremy, i want to ask you. the way in which, or the recusal thing works at the doj, there's no law or even regulation that compels you to go to the ethics folks at justice and say what should i do here? but both legal ethics and political probity normally means if you think you have a conflict you go and say -- ask for recommendation. it appears whitaker is not going to do that. in fact, as joyce just said, the reason he was chosen is precisely because he has these conflicts. how does that ...

Changes on the way. no one is surprised that sessions is one of the first. what they're surprised at, that the acting attorney general is mat whitaker and that if true, he's overseeing the mueller probe. i don't know that we have that definiti definitively. i know it's out there in different forms. that is the significant moment. you have jerry nadler that will take a chairmanship saying they need answers right now as to the choice of matt whitaker. what is happening with deputy attorney general rosenstein and where is his role here? as this unfolds, shep, we're going to get more information f...

Pretext for raising the recusal question. recusal of rod rosenstein is something that's come up before. it stems from the fact he wrote that memo about james comey's firing in advance, and he's basically what's known as a fact within in this case. i think they'll see them use this incident to press the case that rod rosenstein, maybe should recuse himself from this case, in which case this would drop to the next person in line, not necessarily somebody they would hand-pick. >> who would that person be, laura, if the president fires rosenstein. who are the leading candidates to replace him? >> ...