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We don't know for sure that what trump remembered or didn't recall when he answered those written questions to mueller. >> right. >> but we can use our faculties and it really looks like he lied in that written answer to mueller, which is pretty astonishing. >> yeah, there's a reason that people who have lawyers and are careful say i do not recall a lot when they're on sworn deposition. and trump actually we know is familiar with depositions and he says i do not recall a lot. but clearly this moment was striking enough to gates himself he both recalls it and tells investigators and now the jur...

Long time associate and political advisor. stone is charged with lying to congress about his conversations with wikileaks as well as witness tampering and obstruction of a congressional proceeding. you'll recall, of course, that wikileaks is the organization that published the democratic campaign e-mails that were stolen by the russians during the 2016 presidential election and were then exploited by the trump campaign. according to an indictment from special council robert mueller stone effectively acted as a liaison. he informed senior trump exam pai pai ination and in his written responses ...

Deputy campaign manager rick gates who told a very different story than the one trump told in his written testimony. joining me now is dan freedman who was covering stone's trial and was in the courtroom today. his news piece was headlined stone trial reveals trump likely lied to mueller. it was sort of the big jaw drop moment. what happened? he was of course a senior advisor to the trump campaign, a senior aide. he said on july 31st he was in a car with trump and heard trump on the phone and when trump got off that phone call he had wikileaks which had just released a bunch of national e-mail...

What he says knew a lot about what wikileaks was doing, and that their entire campaign was paying close attention to what stone was saying. >> here's the mystery at the heart of this for me. it does seem that stone's in some trouble in terms of the case he did actually lie in congressional testimony, that he tried to obstruct this investigation. but what doesn't seem clear is the mystery of did stone have some actual secret knowledge? did he have some back door? was he just a b.s. artist so addicted to b.s 'ing he's now going to go to jail for it? >> the mueller report had all this redacted st...