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With us is robert trainum. nera, you helped with hillary clinton's debate preps and you worked robert with with rick santorum and president bush. let's get to the heart of it, robert. both sides lowering expectations, but realistically how important is this debate for romney "nightly newmitt romney? >> it's very important. this is his second time to make an impression. the first time was during the republican convention. the second time is in a situation where he's going to be asked very specific, detailed policy questions and in fairness he gets a chance to put president obama on the defensiv...

For him. so i think he really needs to take the debate very seriously as a way to discuss what he means -- what it means to move this country forward. he shouldn't get into the games of it and the zingers and the back and forth. he doesn't want to be mean either. so i think he should just take this as an opportunity to talk about his policies. >> nera and robert, definitely not rick perry as i was looking down at my notes. thanks to both of you. have a great weekend. >> thank you. you, too. nbc news has learned that the republican national committee has fired a controversial consulting firm ...

>> i'm sorry. robert. sorry. gosh. >> that's okay. i was waiting for that. it's very important because obviously what american people are looking for, they both know that these individuals are smart. what they're looking for is some type of personal impression by saying, you know what? i like this guy. not only does he get the job of being president, but he's funny and humorous as well. even george w. bush was good at that in 2004 and 2000. the question is whether mitt romney can connect with the american people. most know he can do the job. the question is that likability factor and whether o...

I think that's the main reason why, alex, why we don't see governor romney's past tax returns as -- that could conflict with the sec filings or complement them. there's a lot of murkiness out there and that's why a lot of republican governors are saying look, mitt, please tell the truth. please be transparent. and let's talk about the economy which is the number one issue that americans want to talk about. >> here raes so's someone tryinp in here. >> in communication strategy, robert knows this well. it is the -- fact -- your question to erin, so there's one new piece of information from had g...

And job creation. and the things that he wants to do in the second term. i mean, he has done that very clearly. you heard joe biden do it to the naacp clearly. lay out a second term vision. it is a classic tactic to try to say the only reason, you know, you shouldn't care about my tax returns is because -- you know, obama is just going negative. again, mitt romney, fundamental piece here, mitt romney himself said my record as a businessman at bain capital is a primary reason for to you consider me for president. now we are asking questions -- the fact he's not prepared for these questions is p...