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Disappointing. >> the human rights organizations like amnesty said chelsea manning was exposing human rights abuses and already had been over sentenced because the military through the court martial process wanted to make an example of her. what do you make of that argument? >> well, hundreds of thousands of pages of highly classified information were disclosed and there's no doubt that it caused grave harm to our national security. and it's important that we have a deterrent effect by stiff penalties when a private in the united states army takes actions that no one in the military should tak...

Potential involvement in the russian hacking of the presidential election. this was many years ago, but it was the first a lot of people heard of wikileaks. the information that the u.s. government says chelsea manning wrongfully and illegally took turned up in wikileaks to a large extent. the pentagon was absolutely furious. they made every effort to prosecute to the full extent of the law. in no small part to send a signal to others that they cannot do this. remember, manning was relatively low-level army person at the time, and was able really to manipulate the system by downloading classif...

Comes against this broader backdrop of wikileaks' role in dealing with the american military, the national security community intelligence, and i think the big question is how can this be seen other than a potential victory for wikileaks. we'll have to see what julian assange has to say about it all. >> that's right. and, michelle kosinski at the white house, i'm looking at a petition here from amnesty calling for pardon or commutation for chelsea manning. their argument was that chelsea manning was serving the sentence for blowing the whistle on human rights abuses by coalition forces in iraq...