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To further their interests by influencing u.s. policy kind of in this shadow way. they were not involved, you know, they weren't doing this at the direction of the president. meanwhile, guiliani is being kind of deputized and enlisted by the president for this kind of shadow foreign policy. but guiliani is also involved in this kind of private negotiation or with these people associated with them. so how this all ties together in terms of you know trying to influence u.s. foreign policy both at a shadow level with the government and in a private capacity i think remains to be seen and could be...

Logistics and the walkthrough and the theatrics and the script for the state of the union. >> well, yes, and that may be paving the way for at least a temporary cease-fire in the shutdown. just before the show went on the air, the senate leaders, chuck schumer and mitch mcconnell, announced that they have a plan to put two bills on the floor. the first of which will be the president's bill which democrats have already declared dead on arrival. the one that would fund his wall with only temporary protections for some of these younger immigrants. then they're going to put on the floor a bill tha...

Can afford to let it leak out. we have too many people covering up the same thing over and over again and the only conclusion i have is that it's about as bad as it can be. >> so what would that be? let me just press you, and would that be a bribe, would that be sanctions relief in exchange for a plot of land that don june year sa junior said we don't have a plot of land, don't have a developer. doesn't mean it wasn't promised. what could it be? >> i think it's worse that than. i -- listen, i'm developing a real sense here that there is now knowledge within the trump circle that the russians d...

I mean, have you seen anything in any of these books that's actually juicy to you? >> well, the problem is we've set the bar at this point in such a way that it really takes a lot to shock us, right? >> that's true. >> because we see in real time so many things we never saw, of course, in any previous presidency, basically any 24-hour period you could pick it over the last two years. pick a 24-hour period and could probably identify one, two, three things that happened in that period that we had not seen in, you know, obama, bush, clinton, reagan, any of these other president. so when you have...

>> so, if we look at -- i'm particularly focused on paul manafort, right, and his -- his incredible reticence and reluctance to fully cooperate. mike flynn and the judge saying you're not there yet, i'm not ready to accept the -- to handle sentencing yet, the trump family members, cohen saying they're getting briefed. the polling data going from manafort to russia. all of this points to knowledge, in my mind, that the russians were -- it was understood that the russians were assisting the campaign, and that they did so in such a way -- remember, we have over two dozen russians indicted already...