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Have succeeded in the greatest degree possible -- meaning we have avoided nuclear holocaust. that's a success. >> bill: so you chase the money operation of north korea to every corner of the planet. >> exactly. >> bill: and you hope eventually that reverses behavior. >> and you hope that it at least stymies increasing rapidly increasing nuclear capabilities. another option here, this is something the europeans are agitating for led by merkel is to have formal sit-down talks with the north koreans. the french, british, germans have been in president trump's ear pushing him to think about this f...

That's a nonstarter with the north koreans, and over the last, you know, 12 years or so look what has happened. the north koreans have continued to develop their military capability, and more recently with these tests. so we have not gotten anything. we haven't lost anything by not sitting down -- i mean, by refusing to sit down with them, because the north koreans have continued developing their nuclear weapons. what is the harm, quite frankly, in having these sit-down talks and hopefully perhaps they will slow down their development and their testing of the nuclear women's, and hopefully the...