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HARDtalk

all through the last 80 years, 0xfam has been at the vanguard of various socialjustice issues. yes, of course, taking action to save lives, change lives, but also speaking truth to power — speaking out. but the point is, you need to work with governments, and if you are to get this completely revamped, much more effective multilateral system of aid to work, governments have to be involved. and yet, you seem to spend a whole lot of your time criticising governments for their failings. so, 0xfam's charitable mission has, and always will be, to end poverty. but what we're realising is that the only way to end poverty is to tackle inequality and injustice. famine exists today not because of a scarcity of food, but because food is mal—distributed. poverty exists today not just because there's a shortage of resources, but because we're seeing eye—watering

All , Climate-action , Truth , Support-0xfam , Change-lives , Course , Issues , Point , Yes , Vanguard , Socialjustice , 0

HARDtalk

processes, and a process of culture change that reduces the risk of misconduct and, importantly, where misconduct is identified, that we take action. 0n the other hand, if you look at our supporter base and our accounts at the moment, many of our international institutional donors and many, many of our individual supporters, have continued to support 0xfam, because when i meet supporters or volunteers, they see that we are an organisation that's taking these issues seriously. they also tell me that we're an organisation that is taking action to fight growing inequality, to tackle climate injustice, and are inspired by the vision of this global network for social change. you've very neatly led me back to the big picture, which i know matters to you a great deal. it strikes me that, since you've taken over leadership of oxfam, you have become a pretty politicised advocate for political and social change

Climate-action , Misconduct , Many , Process , Culture-change , Hand , Processes , Risk , Donors , Accounts , Supporter-base , 0

HARDtalk

which is for running 0xfam gb, being a key member of the oxfam international network. when you took yourjob four years ago or so, you said, "i promise you, "the 0xfam of tomorrow is going to be unrecognisable." you talked about reimagining the way big ngos do aid. have you delivered? i think we are delivering. 0xfam today already looks very different than it did four years ago, and very different to different periods of our 80—year history. we're no longer a top down delivery vehicle for charitable giving. we're much more of a global network that's taking action to save lives, working in some of the most difficult contexts in the world. but we're also trying to change systems to call out systemic discrimination, oppression, calling out inequality increasingly. and so we are... it's difficult to do that. sorry to interrupt, but it is difficult to do that, calling out these systemic problems, the discrimination,

Support-0xfam , Member , Oxfam-international-network , Unrecognisable , 0xfam-gb , Four , 0 , Aid , Ngos , Reimagining , 80 , World

HARDtalk

organisations like 0xfam were part of a relief... ..relief operation that saved lives. this time around, only a fraction of the resource that the un and organisations like ours need are being delivered. take the uk, for example, which has cut its aid budget just at a time of rising humanitarian need — is only delivering a fraction of the aid that it delivered a few years ago. and so there is a chronic underfunding of resources needed in the humanitarian system at the moment. now, you have been running one of the world's best known charitable aid organisations for what, the best part of four years. would you agree with this statement, which was written recently by sanjay reddy, who's an associate professor based at the new school for social research in new york. he said, "the truth is, aid as currently organised,

Part , Organisations , Support-0xfam , Change-lives , Fraction , Un , Relief-operation , Resource , Relief , 0 , System , Resources

HARDtalk

when you in your own organisation are desperately tainted by a scandal which was all about a toxic power dynamic and indeed involved discrimination and abuse of females by white 0xfam male staff members. look, i think what happened in haiti in the earthquake response ten years ago, or so, was abhorrent. we let ourselves down, we let our supporters down, but most importantly, we let the people we were there to serve down. and to people who don't remember, just to remind them, the allegations, which indeed your own internal investigations concluded were well founded, involved staff members of oxfam abusing their position, routinely using prostitutes, some of them using underage girls while on a mission of emergency relief in haiti after the 2010 earthquake. and it took years for 0xfam to publicly acknowledge what had happened.

Organisation , Power , Staff , Dynamic , Abuse , Scandal , Discrimination , Members , Females , White-0xfam , 0 , People

HARDtalk

of the poor people in the poorest parts of the world that they claim they're out to serve they look at, for example, salary levels. your own salary is published. you're very open about it. it's not...i mean, it's relatively high in uk terms, but in international terms, it's not particularly high for the leader of an important organisation. but some charities, look at the international rescue committee in new york city, are led by individuals, in this case david miliband, a former british politician who is earning pretty much $1,000,000 a year as the leader of a humanitarian organisation. do you think that weakens the case of humanitarians, when they're on that kind of money? it's up to the board of international rescue committee, or any organisation, to set its own... of course it is, but what's your opinion? so my opinion comes back to the lessons of the last few years for organisations like ours, which is that it's really important that we walk the talk — that if we're to be taken credibly and seriously, then we also need to strive to be a more inclusive organisation. so, for example in 0xfam, yes, i'm lucky enough

World , People , Example , Salary , Parts , Salary-levels , Organisation , Leader , Politician , Great-britain , Individuals , Terms

HARDtalk

and we were founded in the dark days of world war ii in oxford as the committee for famine relief, by eight ordinary individuals who were outraged by the fact that famine was allowed to be happening in nazi—occupied greece, and set about doing two things, importantly. one, to raise resources to provide food relief for people in greece, and secondly — importantly — to speak truth to power, to campaign against the uk government's and the allied governments�* policy of blockading nazi—occupied greece. all through the last 80 years, 0xfam has been at the vanguard of various social justice issues. yes, of course, taking action to save lives, change lives, but also speaking truth to power — speaking out. but the point is, you need to work with governments, and if you are to get this completely revamped, much more effective multilateral system of aid to work, governments have to be involved. and yet, you seem to spend a whole lot of your time

Resources , Fact , Things , Famine , In-oxford , Individuals , One , Committee , Greece , Famine-relief , World-war-ii , Two

HARDtalk

$1,000,000 a year as the leader of a humanitarian organisation. do you think that weakens the case of humanitarians, when they're on that kind of money? it's up to the board of international rescue committee, or any organisation, to set its own... of course it is, but what's your opinion? so my opinion comes back to the lessons of the last few years for organisations like ours, which is that it's really important that we walk the talk — that if we're to be taken credibly and seriously, then we also need to strive to be a more inclusive organisation. so, for example in 0xfam, yes, i'm lucky enough to be paid a good salary, and importantly, we're committing to reducing inequality within our own organisation, so we publish the pay ratio between my pay and that of the lowest paid, or median members of median pay in our own organisations, and are ambitious about making our own organisation more equitable so that our arguments to make the world fairer and more equitable are taken more seriously. so i think it's really important that we practise what we preach.

Organisation , Course , Leader , Money , Opinion , Case , Humanitarians , Kind , Board , Lessons , International-rescue-committee , 000000

HARDtalk

donors don't appear to be so confident. if one looks at the revenues you get, they're still actually significantly below the level they were at before the haiti scandal broke. so, two things, i think. 0ne, no organisation can ever say it's free from misconduct or harassment, but what we can, and i can say, is that we have put in place systems, processes, and a process of culture change that reduces the risk of misconduct and, importantly, where misconduct is identified, that we take action. 0n the other hand, if you look at our supporter base and our accounts at the moment, many of our international institutional donors and many, many of our individual supporters, have continued to support 0xfam, because when i meet supporters or volunteers, they see that we are an organisation that's taking these issues seriously. they also tell me that we're an organisation that is taking

Scandal , Things , Donors , Level , Revenues , Looks , Two , One , Organisation , Misconduct , Harassment , Systems

HARDtalk

really? the un, of course, tries to raise emergency monies from the nations of the world forjust these sorts of crises. there's the world food programme, a whole host of other un and multilateral agencie which go in to crisis situations and try to alleviate the worst of the suffering and certainly to avoid famine. is that not working? the system has worked in the past. the last time we were worried about drought conditions in east africa, the international community did come together, did deliver billions of dollars worth of aid. 0rganisations like 0xfam were part of a relief... ..relief operation that saved lives. this time around, only a fraction of the resource that the un and organisations like ours need are being delivered. take the uk, for example, which has cut its aid budget just at a time of rising humanitarian need — is only delivering a fraction of the aid that it delivered a few years ago. and so there is a chronic underfunding of resources

World , Course , Nations , Crises , Emergency-monies , Host , Un , World-food-programme , Multilateral-agencie-which-go-in-to-crisis , System , East-africa , Famine