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>> these are duly elected representatives. >> what's the disconnect? >> and an important part of the equation. one of the disconnects, is there is a trust deficit the president has with those that are very active in their support for the second amendment. they don't believe his intentions are good. but i think when you ask that question about has the president failed? i don't think he has. as somebody who has not supported the president's policies on a lot of this, i recognize if he wants to overcome some of the challenges with working with congress. the way that you marshall support behind le...

Does he deserve the death penalty? yes, does he. he probably deserves to die slowly the crime is so horrific. >> ann, do you agree? >> well, no. this is a case -- in colorado, the government has to prove that he's sane beyond a reasonable doubt. that is unlike many, many states. that is going to be impossible. the question of what he deserves isn't really the question here. the question is legally what's going to happen. and he's got a psychiatric hist history. we know he thought he was the joker, the red hair and all of these things. when he was acting insane. and they have a diagnosis. he's ...

Beyond a reasonable doubt snt answer is no. so then the next question is it what do they do about that? >> let me ask you a question to follow up on that. it's not about what he deserves. i understand there is a legal issue. for many, this is more than that. this is human life. tom teeves, a father of a man named alex, a young man in that theater who was killed. i talked to tom recently. i asked him what he thought about the death penalty for james holmes. here's what he said. >> it is a struggle to be honest with you. but i don't want that man on the street going out and killing your child be...

With you. but i don't want that man on the street going out and killing your child because he will do it again when he's -- when they talked about the people, he could have cared less. they were objects to him. >> ann, can you tell a father like that he shouldn't get the death penalty? >> you know, my heart goes out to this father and everybody affected. this is a horrible case. and the visceral reaction is you want james holmes to die. but here's the problem. if they go to trial, the state, and he's acquitted by reason of insanity, then he's going to go to a mental institution and get out pot...

With you. but i don't want that man on the street going out and killing your child because he will do it again when he's -- when they talked about the people, he could have cared less. they were objects to him. >> ann, can you tell a father like that he shouldn't get the death penalty? >> you know, my heart goes out to this father and everybody affected. this is a horrible case. and the visceral reaction is you want james holmes to die. but here's the problem. if they go to trial, the state, and he's acquitted by reason of insanity, then he's going to go to a mental institution and get out pot...