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Now, just a toughness. >> well, a couple of things. i met mike wallace in the hall by the atm in the basement at cbs, and he stopped me and remembered my work and started talking about it, and it was a very daunting moment because i had followed him all throughout my life and career, dreaming of being a journalist some day. and he was kprextremely charmin just as he was on camera. and as far as don hewitt is concerned, who was another one of the greats, i got to work with him and he was coaching me tracking a piece for "60 minutes." and these guys really know how to bring themselves into the s...

The toughness, the self regard, the too muchness of mike wallace, and a lot of that too. but what i like most about him is that most tv journalism is too soft. it's too soft. it doesn't go hard enough. and it lays back. and he was something very different. >> or on the other end, it's too hard without the context. and it's too ideological. here is -- you mentioned malcolm x. >> and just to explain that, there's too much cynicism. but somehow -- >> yeah. you've got to let the story breathe. >> these days, cynicism is mixed with a clubbiness that turns a lot of reporting into fluff. >> we can gi...