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Was the case. >> this reminds me of the clinton white house in the 1990s when anything related to hillary clinton, the senior white house aides would walk on egg shells and it was very different for them to go to the president's wife and say, hey, there's troubling reporting in the press. with he need all the facts. there was this very tense relationship because it's a family member of the president's. kushner, for some run, anything that comes up related to kushner, the senior white house staff is scared, doesn't want to talk to him, doesn't want to pressure him. >> a sense of paralysis. >> j...

With this head of the russian bank and he went ahead and did that. so that's a very strange sear r reece of events and then you have a coverup. up kushner not disclosing these meetings on the form that he was required to disclose them on until after the fact. that's a very curious serious of events. >> matt, especially the russian banker and then also the bank's records, all of that information is easy to find on google. it doesn't require a high-level briefing. >> right. look, i think that there's a lot of things about this that are -- that raise questions. if this were another country, i don...

History and, b, the context for this, again, matters to your point about russia. this all happened amid allegations by 17 different intel agencies of russians hacking democratic committees and staffers. so that's one point. the other point is, when "the times" broke the story about jared kushner meeting with this russian banker sergey gorkov back in march, the russian -- >> the white house said they didn't know why? >> they didn't know why. since then they have said -- and they initially said shortly after our story, not to us, or suggested it on background to people, and then since have indic...

Intelligence can't hear it. that's what it sounds like kushner thought he was doing. it's also very suspicious that he did not report this meeting. this is the kind of meeting you'd remember, being in the trump tower with him and flynn and -- >> a meeting which wasn't on the books at trump tower. >> yeah. >> initially. >> so this group isn't acting like people who don't have anything to hide. >> does it seem strange to you that the number of people who seem to have neglected to report the meetings that they had with russians and whether jeff sessions, jared kushner obviously we know about mich...

Civilization versus islamism or radic radical islamism. he wanted to work with america and the idea that our bureaucracy would leak information is not a paranoid notion. >> this is our fundamental problem here, is why is it that the trump campaign aides after this election, after all of the american intelligence is telling us what they did during the election, why are they more skeptical and distrustful of american intelligence services than -- >> steve hall, i think -- >> but russian intelligence versus american intelligence and -- >> as a career cia officer. >> the only thing i can talk abou...