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June. and if he loses here, he's going to have to turn that over pretty quickly. >> o'donnell: there have been other cases about presidential power, right? president nixon had to turn over the tapes. what's the precedent here? >> i mean, lawyers for the house committees that are wanting this information from the president say those cases show it's clear, he has to turn it over. but lawyers for the white house say those are totally different issues. these are committees wanting his personal information before he was president. so it's totally different. so this is going to be up to the court to...

In 44 minutes. dianne feinstein follows him and horowitz makes an opening statement. barr called it a travesty, a sham, said gross abuse, flimsy evidence. what do you make of -- or is it obvious what his position is, ken? >> it's obvious that bill barr has strong feelings. i share those feelings. i have read this report with a sense of outrage as well as sorrow. i find it hard to believe that the f.b.i. would conduct itself vis-a-vis the court, vis-a-vis the justice department in the way that it has. in addition to what senator cruz said earlier about misrepresentations, there are omissions be...

The part of the f.b.i. but the sharpest condemnation of f.b.i. behavior since we've seen since the church committee in the 1970s. this is extraordinary. the american people will really be stunned and shocked at what the f.b.i. did vis-a-vis people who were innocent, like carter page. it is absolutely a sad day for the f.b.i. clean house. >> bill: when he was asked about motivations he said i don't know what the motivations are. i can't explain that. that's why we have durham referring to john durham. we think maybe he will go public in the spring or summer. isn't there a real good chance that ...

Giuliani in a worse place and saying worse things right now, vis-a-vis his client's interest, could you come up with a worse combination? >> you would not. if you are at all engaged in trying to help this president navigate this crisis in his presidency, getting through the impeachment process, the one place on earth you don't want rudy giuliani is in ukraine, taking documents from a known corrupt politician about joe biden and having those pictures on the internet. it's unbelievable. >> and tweeting. you better help with the biden efforts. it will not get united states assistance in his anti-...

Security adviser to president obama, is these days a contributor for us. ben, isn't it about time that we rough up canada and france a little bit? i'm speaking facetiously, of course. what do you make of this new era we're in, vis-a-vis our nato partners? >> brian, these are the summits you look forward to because you are sitting down with the countries that you agreed with, back when we were in those jobs. i mean, it's really extraordinary, but i think what's so kind of depressing about it, right, is that this is not a surprise to anybody. first of all, the fact that those world leaders are s...