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Symbol and token of how we lost our way, right? and then the private debt has been moved on to the public debt balance sheet. as a way dealing with the crisis. >> but we've create cultur culture, right? we expect to do very little and create a higher return. we now invest in companies that i'm not even sure what they do. we're going to talk about facebook later. how do they make money is someone going out and getting venture capital. $50 million for a urban box office, how does that work? oh well, we'll just write it off and go on to the next thing. that's our culture. we do have to address wh...

Smaller high schools across the country look to the data afterwards and say no. the question you will hear in the debate over education reform, we know what works. we just have to do it. and the question is is that true? do we know what works? we have examples of what works. they are working. they are serving children well. what we are not doing is replicating what works. the reason why is the complexity. it's the teachers, it's the kids, it's the investments in that commitment. >> it takes one person with a vision. >> i like you dropping chiro as if it's no thing. >> schools that work, you co...

Doesn't want to talk about inequality. they do. but they want to talk about it in these very specific ways. and i think that's the distinction. >> they want to do things about it in very specific places, right? so something like the tax treatment of kerry, which are gains you get from these kinds of private equity deals which are taxed at 15%. there's the buffet rule, the idea that you shouldn't be taxing that lower than the warren buffet secretary middle class wage earning work. they talk about regulating the market. getting back to joe's point, what are they proposing we do to make it not a ...

Is this how we want america to be shaped and viewed who make money off of bad debt or good debt or make money off of other people's hard work? i guess that is how we kind of started, huh? but, really, is all of this good? you know, is this -- all of this money making, is it good? is it how we want to make money? >> i think he wants to have a narrow conversation are you quick to be a president on this experience. but the question of should there be a moral sanction. if someone who were running for president who is a former tobacco executive, i think we all share the intuition that they would ge...

The idea? >> if charter schools work and some of them do, do charter schools. if vouchers work, do that. if there are public education systems at work, model that. i think it's too crucial right now. we are in a crisis situation to not look at everything and say what's working? >> well, that is a question, for example, in philadelphia, there are 18 charter schools under investigation right now. but we don't hear this very much. >> because it's political. >> with the grand experiment, we've been running as a country, and, again, i'm not going to pretend that education policy is my area of exper...