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>> wasn't the original plan. wasn't his original plan. >> that's why -- but he's changed that clearly. >> i know. >> he's not a wall architect, he's a builder of many great structures all over the world. there has to be an actual wall. not a virtual wall, not a metaphor. there has to be a wall. >> in some places it does have to be virtual. that's what they want. some places they want sensors. they want different things in different places. >> here's the thing. walls work. one thing i'm tired of seeing constantly in media, people say this is some sort of medieval idea. all we need to do is look...

>> he's not a wall architect, he's a builder of many great structures all over the world. there has to be an actual wall. not a virtual wall, not a metaphor. there has to be a wall. >> in some places it does have to be virtual. that's what they want. some places they want sensors. they want different things in different places. >> here's the thing. walls work. one thing i'm tired of seeing constantly in media, people say this is some sort of medieval idea. all we need to do is look around the world, places like israel, hungary -- >> san ysidro. go to san ysidro. they were able to control the f...