Of our conference in liverpool. You know, that were about to go to now making a positive case for change. But blair rates are urging you to be more radical to get you into number ten. Are you the man really to lead the party for that Radical Change for labour . Ive had clarity of strategy since the very first day i took over as leader. Is there clarity on hs2 and the two Child Benefit Cap . We had to change the labour party first. We had to expose both the tories and the snp is not fit to govern. And then we needed to lay out our positive case for change, which is what were doing at our conference. According to my strategy, when i started this strategy three and a half years ago, most people said to me, good luck, but youll never achieve it. Within five years, weve put ourselves in a position where we are credible contenders who humbly accept the victories that weve had, but know that we must work even harder to earn the trust and faith of voters as we go into that General Election. Just finally, given you a victory over the snp, what is your message to people who are Pro Independence in scotland . Theres been some commentary recently about a Labour Government paving the way for independence. Is that right . What is your message to people who want independence . My message is that if you want change, vote labour. We can have a stronger scotland within a changed United Kingdom facing the challenges of the future together. That is a positive case for change. Its notjust relying on our history, its looking at our future together. But that is what id say, if you want change, vote labour. Sir keir starmer, thanks very much. Thank you. See you set has just given his reaction to his partys to feet. fix, reaction to his partys to feet. Bad result, of course it was. There are a number of factors that lead into that. We were told time and time again that margaret ferrier� s reckless actions played against us, and the Police Investigation obviously played against us, as well. We have had tough Election Results in the past and we will bounce back stronger and i am keen to make sure we are fighting for the next electoral test. Ive been speaking to professor sirjohn curtice, a political scientist at the university of strathclyde. I asked him whether labour would be able to recreate this kind of success in a General Election. By elections often give an exaggerated reflection of movements against governments and, to that extent at least, we cant necessarily assume that labour would do as well in scotland in a General Election as its done in rutherglen in this by election. One reason, for example, is that it was relatively easy for conservative voters who wanted to ensure that the snp lost this by election to switch to labour to ensure that the snp lost, but they might be much more reluctant to do that in a General Election. That said, it has been when oppositions start to produce swings of this size, and this is not the first one for labour, they had a over a 20 swing in a by election in yorkshire back injuly from the conservatives, its when oppositions start to put in these really big swings that history suggests that they may well be on course to win the next General Election. So maybe labour wont get the a0 seats they had in 2010, maybe they will end up with the 20, but that 20 would, in itself, potentially make a significant contribution to labours chances of getting an overall majority at the next election. Not an easy task for the party because at the moment, at least, the geography of its support is not very efficiently distributed and it requires quite a big lead over the conservatives for them to get an overall majority. Well, the Scottish Labour Members and politicians that weve been hearing from today seem to be taking those numbers to heart and are talking about possibly being able to win a majority in the General Election. But i want to ask you, john, about the turnout and how that affects it because the turnout here was around 37 . So i wonder how much that really makes it plausible to call it a seismic victory because in 2019 in the General Election the turnout in scotland was 68. 1 . So how much do you factor aspects like that into your analysis . Let me give you one rule of reactions to by Election Results in the United Kingdom. The losing side will always say look at the turnout, it was low, and the winning side, of course, will say that doesnt matter. The honest truth is that the 37 turnout in rutherglen, well, its what . A couple of points lower than the average in all by elections in the uk in this parliament, also below the average in all scottish by elections during the course of this century. So its not markedly below. The truth is that previous by elections that have shown large swings to the opposition have indeed sometimes presaged General Election success. So i think the truth is we shouldnt simply discount this because its a lower turnout because the turnout is not markedly lower in many another by election that has indeed at least told us about the direction of travel, even if perhaps its giving us a somewhat exaggerated picture as to how much progress the opposition is actually making. Thats a good rule. John, thank you. And i will remember that youre always full of very good rules to bear in mind. But i just want to end by asking you now, weve talked about what this might mean for labour in the General Election, but what about what it might mean for the snp . Because weve been hearing from Conservative Msps saying that he thinks that thered be an snp wipe out within reach. What do the numbers suggest about the possibility of that . Well, i mean, if you take the results of the rutherglen by election and extrapolate across the whole of scotland, youve got about a half a dozen snp still, but that means the snp would be back down to the level they had in 2010 before that tsunami of success in the 2015 General Election in the wake of the 2014 independence referendum. But what does the snp face . The snp faces a difficult task under a leader who has yet to prove himself. The problem that humza yousaf has is that he personally is not that popular amongst the public in general and amongst snp voters in particular. And secondly, his party, which hitherto has been remarkably united for most of the last 16 years that its been in office in edinburgh, has now acquired a taste for division. There are a number of Dividing Lines that are going on and of Course Voters dont like divided parties and they have noticed the perception of the snp being a divided party has increased. So the question is can humza yousaf, Whose Authority over his party still got a Question Mark about it, unite his party, bring it around, give it a sense of direction behind which everybody is willing to fall behind. I have to say, at the moment, there is a degree of uncertainty as to about whether he will be able to achieve that. The green partys annual conference is beginning in brighton, with the Party Setting ambitious targets to increase its number of mps at the next General Election. Co leader carla denyer says it wants to have four mps in parliament after the election, something she says is absolutely realistic. The party currently has one mp, caroline lucas, who is stepping down after 13 years in the job. Were standing by for a Keynote Speech to be delivered shortly at that conference by co leaders ms denyer and adrian ramsey. Well bring you that live. Live now to brighton and our Political Correspondent helen catt. Helen, so this idea that it is realistic that they might have four seats after the next General Election, though . Seats after the next General Election, though . Seats after the next General Election, thou~h . ~. , election, though . Well, that is the bi. Election, though . Well, that is the big question election, though . Well, that is the big question. The election, though . Well, that is the big question. The greens election, though . Well, that is the big question. The greens are election, though . Well, that is the i big question. The greens are adamant that it big question. The greens are adamant thatitis big question. The greens are adamant that it is but it is a tough ask. They have only had one mp but they have been trying to get a second pretty much since she was elected backin pretty much since she was elected back in 2010, but the greens are meeting at this conference of the back of a really successful year for them. They had record wins in local elections in england this year, joint control control of a consul for the first time, in suffolk. They said they have been taking votes from both conservatives and labour. They have struggled under the first past the post system. It is still a pretty tall order. They currently hold one seat in brighton. 0ther hold one seat in brighton. Other areas they are targeting is bristol, thatis areas they are targeting is bristol, that is held by labour. They are targeting to other states that are held by conservatives. In north herefordshire, the last time the greens came forth there and labour had a majority of 25,000. It is a big ask. They said they had been targeting this much earlier than they have done earlier and they say they have done earlier and they say they have done earlier and they say they have a strategy, saying they are open to do deals with other parties to try to get their candidates over the line. But they said that labour and the Liberal Democrats so far have not only interested in doing that. They have been trying for so long. They have been trying for so long. They have been targeting some labour seats went labour seems to be doing so well in the polls. I asked Adrian Ramsay, wind i have ever doing so well . Over the last four sets of elections, weve seen huge growth in the number of greens elected to councils right across the country and thats been from labour and from the conservatives in rural and urban areas alike. People are saying that theyre looking for a positive alternative for mps who will fight for their area, who will fight fora fairer, greener country and whoever forms the next government we need green mps there to hold them to account and stand up for their constituencies. And weve just got huge excitement, huge momentum behind our campaign to deliver those green mps at the next General Election. If you look at some of our Sister Parties around the world, like australia and canada, for example, theyve seen their green mp numbers grow in their recent elections. Theyve gone from one to three or four, as were seeking to do under first past the post electoral system. And we learn the lessons from those and from all the places around the world where greens are part of the government, making a real difference at a National Level as we are in scotland and the republic of ireland, in germany and new zealand. These are places where, alongside growing numbers of councils across england and wales, greens are making a real practical difference for peoples lives whilst transforming us to a fairer and greener future. And if we want to do that at a National Level, we need more green mps in parliament who will stand up for their communities as well as working to tackle inequality and the climate crisis. Helen, do you think that mr ramsay orany helen, do you think that mr ramsay or any other Green Party Member could follow in the footsteps of caroline lucas, who we know has been an mp for 13 years and is quite a well known figure even outside the Green Party Membership, perhaps even outside politics itself . The Green Party Membership, perhaps even outside politics itself . Outside politics itself . The greens have set themselves outside politics itself . The greens have set themselves quite outside politics itself . The greens have set themselves quite an have set themselves quite an interesting political test here. They have been Crystal Clear that their aim is to get more representation in parliament, that Thatis Representation in parliament, that that is the way theyre going to change things, they need more mp5. They have set himself this test. If they dont meet that at the next election, where did they go after that . That isnt something that Adrian Ramsay wanted to get them to make three or earlier. He said this wasjust a good chance make three or earlier. He said this was just a good chance to get them over the line. This is a good test for them to see if they can do that under the current parliamentary system and what it means for the green party going forward. Helen, the Climate Green Party going forward. Helen, the climate crisis, green party going forward. Helen, the climate crisis, which green party going forward. Helen, the climate crisis, which adrian i the climate crisis, which Adrian Ramsay mentioned, is potentially going to be quite high up on the agenda for many voters, which would do well for the green party and it would make them more of a priority, but equally, if you look at some of the local issues, if you look at brighton for example, caroline lucass constituency, there has been a bit of popularity lost over a very local issues like bin collections. The greens are talking about the successes they had elsewhere in the country and they were a big successes. But in brighton whether You Stab Minority Control of the council, this was a pretty disastrous year in the local elections. They used tab minority. They went to just a handful of councils. So there are local issues as well. But broadly speaking, we will help we will hear a lot about this in a speech shortly, a Focus On Housing and insulating homes in particular. Housing was an issue they put focus on and they put focus on in the local elections. Today, they will talk about giving renters the legal right to force lanyards to better insulate their homes and they talk about a Government Grant System to help those on lowest incomes to insulate their homes and the idea is that they would be to force landlords to access low interest loans to fund works to ensure them. We did ask them about our concerns that would that lead to a shortage of rental properties that if you put more of an