Twitter and instagram for behindthescenes pictures and videos at booktvs or handle. We kick off this year savannah book festival with retired air force Major General robertbo latiff on future war. Live coverage on booktv on cspan2. Good morning. My name is nancy lieb and im delighted to welcome you to the 11th annual savannah book festival. Isto presented by georgia power, david and nancy cintron, the gm family and mark metcalf. Many thanks to jack and Mary Raimondo our sponsors for this glorious venue the Trinity United Methodist church. We would like to extend special thanks to wire litter rowdy members and individual donors who have made and continue to make Saturdays Free festival of them possible. 90 of our revenue comes from donors just like you. Thank you. We are very excited to have savannah book festival this year for your phone. Please look in your program for information on downloading it. It just takes two seconds and it will be very helpful to you today. Before we get started by a couple of housekeeping notes. Immediately following this presentationlp Robert Latiff wil be signing purchase copies of this book just across the way it tell fair square. If youre planning to stay in this venue for the next presentation please move forward as it empties so ushers can give available seats. Please take a moment to turn off your cellle phone and we also k that you do not use flash photography. Y during the question and answer portion please raise your hand and i will call on you and one of the ushers will bring a microphone to you. In the interest of time and to be fair to all of the other please limit yourself to one question and please dont tell a story. Robert latiff is with us today courtesy of unfriend thomas. Dr. Robert h. Latiff is a faculty member at the university of notre dame and hebe is the direct or of Intelligence Community programs at George Masons University school of engineering. He is a member of the air or studies board and the Intelligent Committee studies board of the National Academy of sciences, engineering and medicine. Na please give a warm welcome to Robert Latiff. [applause] let me thank nancy and the savannah book festival for having me here. This is really an awesome event. First of all i appreciate your interest in my work. Also i dont know if any of you saw on the Savannah Morning News news. Andrea did a really nice review of the interview she had with me. As a retired military person i have probably done a thousand speeches. Standing up in front of a group talking about a book is a little bit like talking in front of kids. Its harder but this is a really important topic. Now probably more so than it has ever been. If you read the news you hear all this talk. Perhaps you saw an article yesterday or the dayay before in one of the publications that talked about drifting towards war very much like we did before world warng i and so i think its a frightening time in probably a very timely time to talk about the book. I will talk a little bit about why i wrote it and how i came to write it which i think is really a cool story. I always like to tell it and then some of the themes that are it. If it isnt immediately obvious to you like grew up in rural southeastern kentucky. I never did get rid of the accent. I was the product of sputnik era era, so i was all about science, technology and was interested in space and strangely enough Nuclear Weapons and somehow or the other i got into the university of notre dame. They never figure that one out but they let me inve and it bece immediately obvious to me that i had no means to pay for it. Thus i enter the army, rotc and i was going to serve my four years and get out and be a nobel prizewinning physicist. That didnt work so i stayed 32 years in the military, six of them in the army and 24 years in the air force or 26 years in the air force. I trained in the infantry to go to vietnam. After my ph. D. At notre dame i went to germany where he stood facing 100 divisions of soviet infantry. I thought we were going to nuke when they came across the border border. For that i actually commanded in armyke tactical Nuclear Weapons unit that was going to hand out nukes to the firing battalions. I switched to the air force and became very much in involved in research and developmentin recognizance intelligence, Nuclear Weapons, all very hightech stuff. It was all about hightech and weapon systems. So why did i write the book . Well, as a young 26yearold army captain having to give Nuclear Weapons to people really cause me to think about my role inca war and fastforward 20 soe years i again have the opportunity to be if you call it back, the opportunity to be involved with the release of Nuclear Weapons should that ever happen and many other things. But really at the fall of the berlin wall global communism. Right about that time we went into kuwait to kick Saddam Hussein out of kuwait and you would have sought booklet that and you would have thought we had won world war iii the way we were acting. After that we sort of became bullies. We were the strongest nation on earth and the only remaining superpower and we let everybody know it. That really bothered me. Fastforward again to 2003, that was the crux of what bothered me was the invasion of iraq. And its Public Knowledge that i was very concerned about that. So i retired from the air force and went to work with the industry and began immediately thinking about all this stuff and all my friends at notre dame had said ive got some issues here. Can we talk about it . A said oh sure you can develop a course for us which i did and now they said now that you have developed a course for a skinny teach it . Still today 10 years later im traveling back and forth to notre dame to teach students about war and ethics and technology. I dont know if anybody watches notre dame football but if you do during halftime they always highlight the student in the faculty member and my course was so popular that they highlighted me on National Television which was kind of cool. Two minutes of fame and that got the attention of the news york times. Sam friedman a wonderful editor of the religious section of the news york times interviewed me, great article and then thats caught the attention of random house, knopf and if you know anything about it Jonathan Segal is sort of, his authors have seven pulitzers to their credit. Im probably going to disappoint him withhe this one but john waa wonderful editor, just did marvelous things and was very nice to me and very patient. So the theme of the book, there are several teams. Number one that war as we knew it and design new it really is changing and that sort of obvious. War and technology have always gone together. Ethics are critical to soldiers and theres a big chasm between the American Military and the American People. You are saying to yourself, really . Notu e only that our political leaders. Some of the sub themes, there is on feathered Technology Innovation has downsized this coming from a lifelong need. We were often as i said militaristic, hubristic, eric and about our technologies and i think arms control is hugely important. So we are mesmerized by war. We are mesmerized by technology. Steel, gunpowder, submarines, stealth technology, Nuclear Weapons, the computer, the internet. It was not al gore to invented the internet. All of these things are military encouraged his technology and technology encourages the military. We are seduced by it. One of my favorite pictures is a picture of the apple store in new york city when the new iphone comes out. There y are lines a mile long. If you asked people why they are there, because theres a new iphone. Just because. We are seduced by it. Robert oppenheimer the father of the atomic bomb recently said we were just seduced by it. We worried about it after we did it and marine general james mattis who used to be one of my heros often said to his youve got to forget about technology. You got to be able to operate on your own. I dont say that anymore but we have the largest Defense Budget in the world, larger than the next 800 countries combined and we are the largest proliferator of weapons in the world, twice as much as russia. Terrorism, guerrilla warfare, cyber warfare, and church and in our election systems and advanced technology is like cyber and other things are more available to more people all over the world. People worry about cyberattacks in our vector grid. We saw what happened with sony. If anybody has read about stuxnet, the virus that somebody did. War is going to be closer to home as we have seen and others are going to have the same technologies we have. It used to be we were way, way ahead. Now its fairly obvious that countries like china are beating us badly in hightechnology areas. So machines in some form will watch for us. I worked in an organization that bills spy satellites that they are going to be watching all th time. Pretty much everything in the world now is virtually connected to the internet so i go on the internet did look at the data. Machines are going to think for us. The military and in the intelligence business Machine Learning and art of racial intelligence are going to sort of give us the answer and it will be up to us to say yes or no. They are going to fight for us. We even today see robots on the battlefield. Robots on the battlefield and the drones are controlled by humans now but thats not always going to be the case. Soldiers are going to be different and ill talk a little bit about that. War is going to be fast. Its going to be subtle. We may not even know its happening or it may happen in the blink of an eye and its going to be global. So, some of the technologies. Ive actually heard the military being described as a giant armed nervous system so everything is connected to everything else. Things like informationto technology, we are now at a point where we can put literally billions of transistors on a tiny ship. Advanced in datamining Artificial Intelligence. If you have seen the news that dod just asked for another 18 billion to put into things like Artificial Intelligence and Machine Learning. Weapons will have decisionmaking capability. We are ready have weapons that have the pager system the aegis system antimissile system but more and more offensive weapons will sort of sneak up on the decisionmaking capability. Right now the human will always be able to be on the loop or at least bought ching the loop but war will be sor fast that humas will become irrelevant and we may actually slide into the case of decisions being made by machines. Weapons will go to a target area slides to the hill and take action. They might seek permission first and they might not get theres no communication. These things are good. Dont get me wrong. Drones and all of these technologies to make our soldiers better are good. They keep the soldiers out of harms way but they need to come with a little bit of thinking. Enhancements, i talk in the book about soldier enhancements. There is a yuck factor involved in this. Exoskeletons to help soldiers listen. Pharmaceuticals. Right now we giveli airplane pilots drugs to keep them awake. Theres talk about giving soldiers drugs to make the more courageous and less fearful, feel less pain. We need to think about that and then theres this whole area of neuroscience. This one is really interesting. I was able to talk to the Research Projects agency about some of the work they are doing mostly for treatment of soldiers with traumatic brain injuries, good stuff. They are able to restore function to soldiers but you know what, they have also learned that they cann enhance normal soldiers. They can make soldiers learn faster. They can actually treat them. They have gotten to the point where they can actually identify the structure of the brain. Think about that if you can read a thought, you can write a thought. Its very scary stuff. Then there is an increasingry concern about biological enhancement and c synthetic whie a g. Ifs, anyone has read about crisr crisper. Virus editing. The worry is and the Director Director of National Intelligence said christopher is a intelligence threat. The worry is that people will create viruses that are on amenable to treatment so we worry about that. Cyber war, we talked about power grids, dams. There was actually a case in which a man sitting in the back of an airplane was able to hack into a chemical so hacking into airplanes and weapons is of huge concern and this is another area that the dod is going to be spending 12 billion next year cyber. Electromagnetic pulse weapons. If anybody read the book one second after and electromagnetic pulse, its pretty bad and you can do itoo without a nuclear bb bomb. That technology is out there. Its being developed. Hypersonic weapons, weapons that travel 15 to 20 times the speed up sound. So technology is moving really really fast. If you look at technology adoptionll curves they are comig more frequently and things are getting into the public much faster. Even i ph. D. In engineering really cant keep up. What do you expect the normal American Public . They basically look at all this technology and go, okay. The problem is the u. S. Is technologically. Alert or it when it comes to the rest of the world. This is okay in civilian life. I get it. If we understand how the net that gives us the recommendation or next movie it doesnt matter but it does matter in the military. When we are going to kill people it matters a lot that we understand whats in the Nuclear Weapons. We have to understand the consequences. I dedicated this book to a friend of mine retired former navy in vietnam on the mekong delta expose multiple times to agent orange and died of agent orange. So we have to really think before we employ these things about what the consequences are. We knew what the longterm consequences were. Is he against technology or what . Echnology is goodue health care, everything that we have done just wonderful things like antibiotics. The problem with antibiotics is we got really used to them and now we are having a hard time trying to find ones that work because we overuse them. The food industry, we have more food than we know what to do with but a lot of drugs in our food. Ai is the technology thats eating the government. Everyone f did interested in ai. We need to understand because we dont actually know how ai works works. Even the specialist dont really know. So i moved on. So i talked about technology and that was really fun. I talked about the knowledge again and that was really fun. I was teaching a course at George Mason University to a bunch of master students one of whom was the chaplain, an Army Chaplain who had just come back fromteud iraq where 16 of the soldiers in his unit were killed and hundreds were wounded. Antitalk to me about how difficult it was to treat the wounded souls of soldiers. Believe it or not they are people and when they go out and kill others and maybe even civilians at bothers them a lot. So he talked about how important it was for soldiers to understand what is correct and what is not correct. I taught about just war theory and the laws of our conflict and he was very interested in that. In that chapter i tried to take those technologies, all of those really. Cool technologies that e are talking about and balance them against the wars of Armed Conflict and third these things right . To be discriminate . He might say well thats just so much talk that its actually important. Leadership is important. I talk about some of the things that guess we in the United States did and bombing civilian targets and massacres in vietnam and in other places and then i talk about some of the good leadership. For instance the example i used theres this idea that humans and rove bots or ask a going to fight to get on the battlefield. While im sitting in a foxhole with my robot and somebody throws a grenade in his my robot going to jump on the grenade . Am i goingin to jump on the grenade to save the robot . Courage and loyalty loyalty in camaraderie and all those things that come into question when we are talking about machines. Enhancements, drugs, neuroscience. Is that soldier operating with free will . Cannot make a moral decision . We dont know. We are trying to make machines that act more like people and we aree trying to make people act more like machines. Somewhere in the middle its going to be a mess. So my editor asked me, john asked me, besides you, who cares about this stuff . That sent me on a rant in chapter 4 and my answer was unfortunately almost nobody. Few writers like myself and others but not very many people. So i go onto this discussion in chapter 4 about how arrogant we are about our technologies. Like i said after that we were everywhere. Remember shock and. In 2003 . That didnt work out very well for us. The media and by the way i love the media. I dont talk about fake news but i think the media gets it wrong. They focus on the wrong things and they dont look us on the important things. The internet is an awful place. Its good but its an awful place for people to do bad things. They think we are deliberately ignorant. We dont try to educate ourselves, and there is a chas. The public is just not involved. They have no knowledge of the military. People ask me did you ever kill anybody . No, not everybody in the military is a killer. Out of sight out of mind. Leaders actually use the military as sort of a boy their own little private toy. To come back to this education thing i read an article. Remember when russia went into crimea and shortly after that into the ukraine . There is a survey by a couple of harvard professors. 2000 people. What do you think the United States should do in 60 of them said we have to go in there militarily and those same 60 when you ask if they knew where ukraine was they said no. They know nothing about the military. I like to use the phrase that the t. Most people dont p realize that the u. S. Spends now threequarters of a trillion dollars a year on the military. About 250 billion of that on new weapons. They dont realize the impact of all the deployments that our are soldiers sailors airmen and marines face and what psychological scars of war. They have no idea how the military gets its missions in what the threats are. What they doge know, and dont t me wrong i appreciate it. They thank us for our service and we do halftime shows and believe me thats wonderful but it just isnt enough. We allow our politicians to employer military. Congressional research basically out that in 70 or so years since world war ii we deployedll our method. Over 60ar times, almost once a year. A recent article in Time Magazine pointed out that we have special Operations Forces in 143 countries. Now, maybe all of those things are legitimate. I question whether or not they are or we like to use our military. So i say we kind of disrespect our military. I actually wrote a article. We disrespect our military. What . We have halftime shows and all these other things but i say its a signn of disrespect ignoring somebody and we are touring that. That has to change. There has to be a national conversatione. I had a novelist friend in Silicon Valley and go bridges who actually wrote what i thought was a pretty good description of my book. She reviewed my book. She said we ask our fighting men and women to go with the battle ever more frequently trusting the tools we hand them are somehow vetted as the right ones that there orders are honorable andei sanctioned by a majority f the citizenry they are sworn to defend. We are talking about the Human Element of the war. America is singularly lacking in an intellectual curiosity and a capacity, not just an education by the citizens will to study, consider, debate and actively choose the purpose and nation should be when we put machines between us and our enemy. So, i think ann who wrote the article the last part of the book quoted me. Think of as patriotism. Anyone old enough to remember advice evenson, patriotism is not a short and frenzied outburst of emotion but tranquil and steady dedication of a lifetime. In a forward fashion, patriotism is not going to do it anymore. We have to sit down and have a debate because this technology this technology is coming and coming at us fast in the present issues for the soldier. And for our decisionmakers. They really dont have the capacity to understand this stuff. We ask a lot of the military and i hope thishi book sells a bazillion copies but i hope a lot of people will read this and enter into that debate because it is so important especially now. With that, there is a chapter on what i think we can do it is of the greatest chapter but this is a tough tough problem. Thank you for your interest in the book but i am really anxious to get your questions. [applause] please raise your hand and the usher will bring the microphone. Do you have any information what is going on in cuba . Have got that question several times. The short answer is no information at all. People were getting sick but i think technically it is possible but lowfrequency sonic waves can vibrate your internal organs so that is conceivable but the short answer is i have no information. So now the military leaders if not chronologically challenge they are technologically challenged and how do you make them understand because may be who are familiar with technology are not in the military so how do you make them understand how to use technology to the best advantage for this country . The argument is the military fights the last moores battles that we train those decisionmakers to fight the battle of the future . I dont think it is the military decisionmakers that are the issue. Generally the military doesnt want to go to war but by and large most senior military leaders have a pretty good idea about technology it is the civilian leadership. And the only way that i know of to make the civilian leadership listen is for the public to demand it. If the public demands it but it is a tough problem. To explain toa a political scientist how that works is a foolssc errand but explain the implications maybe that is something we could do. Again the public has to demanded that is the simplest answer i could give you. First of all thank you for writing what seems like a wonderful book and i look forward to reading it so are you describing a failure of people . The republicans accused the democrats of losing china in 1848 and nixon spent four years in vietnam in a war he knew he could not win and today we are in afghanistan nobody in this country can explain the exit strategy or what victory amounts to but yet politicians are terrified to tell us the truth because it would be unsatisfactory. So is this a lost cause . What more do you think we could do . Leaders are terrified of their ownt people for good reason. Maybe i should have said it is a difficult cause not a lost cause but the biggest part of the problem is that war comes frequently and at no cost. We fought the vietnam war on a credit card and every conflict we have been in with no additional taxes. I certainly dont think we should go back to a draft but it should affect the American People and after 911, the president declared a National Emergency and told the American People to go about their business. I think that is wrong. The only people who are affected beyond the families obviously were military and i signed orders keeping people in the military well beyond where they should have stayed multiple times i had no doubt they were killed or wounded but if it doesnt affect people that they will not care. I dont know that answers your question we have to figure out a d way to affect the American People. Then maybe we dont do it so often but when it really needs to be done. You talk about the ethics of war with all that is going on with Exponential Technology and how that differs globally can there really be the ethics of war . Direct that is a wonderful question. Literally for millennia, especially for centuries people have debated this topic. Most advanced countries or civilized countries actually do follow some sort of law but otherwise it was nothing but butchery in the time of the greeks. So i think the basis of your question if i could be so boldan but groups like isis or al qaeda dont care about ethics. But that shouldnt be important to us. We talk a big game of human. Ights we have gone to war over human right so we actually have to demonstrate human right so those who have signed up for thend Geneva Convention and other humanitarian laws so to think that there truly is a placela for ethics in warfare. I dont know if that answers your question but we should do what we think is correct not what other people do. Do you believe the all volunteer military is the most effective way to staff the organizations . That is a question i get a lot. Obviously a graph at a time of the draft. I dont think we have any other option but the all volunteer but is that the most effective way . No. I dont but i dont have any other answers beyond perhaps maybe having a National Service but if you look at the data, increasingly it is a narrower and narrower slice of the American Public it doesnt represent the entire demographic and again the fact that it is all volunteer i think politicians abuse that i dont want to use it as a tool to impose their will on others and thats not quite right but i dont think it is the most effective way but short of a draft which will never happen again i dont know. This is technical but as an air force guide to univision between the Unmanned Aircraft . Possibly in the future Unmanned Aircraft certainly dont have the limitation of the Human Systems to try to keep the pilot alive. So i guess its some point, whats the point . That possibly, yes because the technology is so much better. Actually had students ask me once why dont we just have war . So what is the point at some point humans will die or land will be taken having machines kill one another doesnt seem to be useful. Following up from before why did you say no to a draft that seems like the best way to get the public invested if everybodys sons and daughters are affected. Dont mistake my answer as a no. I grew up in the time of the draft. It was not without its problems you can get not drafted for bone spurs. Though it fell heavily upon a smaller subset but by a large everybody served. I just dont think it is possible in the current political environment. If 911 wasnt an opportunity im not sure what will be that i do believe everyone should serve. Er so if you will not serve in military serve in the government. If you are a citizen of the United States than what about the social contract . You have a responsibility. Honestly i would like to seeit the draft but that will never happen. One of the things with the former chairman he said what we should do is lower the number of active duty soldiers to a very low number and fill that up with reserves than the next time we go to war the reserves have to go than that would impact families and they may say no. So i didnt actually say no but i am a realist and dont think it will happen. This is a broad question with the additional 80 billion or whatever it was to say if we cannot win with that or half of that comic can the military spend its budget wisely and efficiently or is it just a behemoth that keeps growing . I was with you until you said wisely and efficiently. They can certainly spend it. [laughter] i bought weapons. I did this for years. I think we could honestly i dont think we need three quarters of a trillion dollars but to be fair much of that goes to spare parts and operations and gasoline but over 200 billion goes into the weapons. And i honestly think if we dont get one system onto the field until you think about the next while the other guy is creating something we have to respond to. T in my opinion, is too big maybe if we look closely we could find it to exactly where it needs to be my issue is the american dont seem to care much about it. Ask any typical person on the street what they think and you will never get the right answer and i think that is sad. But if the politician says we need it then okay. Nobody ever tells us how sending troops to the ukraine makes that safer. You could say helping to protect nato so that will make us safer but that is a long rambling answer to your question. I answer . Ow, didr. [laughter] you say that the military is developing neurological enhancements . Do you see there is a way to use that technology in our schools to help our students . There are two answers. First, those technologies are very often almost always get into the civilian world they are developed by civilian companies. So yes they will make it but whether or not they should help students becomes a very sticky ethical question with the idea of putting brain enhancements is like having students take ritalin. So whether or not we should be enhancing people . What about those that cannot afford it how does that affectw society . I thank you are probably onto something those technologies usually make their way into civilian life but how are they controlled . Also to and on a positive note. [laughter] i will tell you our soldiers sailors airmen and marines are the best in the world and our people and deserve everything we can giveriar him. [applause] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] 10 10. Live today from the savannah book festival. That was arthur Robert Latiff on the future of war and technology. It is going to be a few minutes until the next offer is ready to go at Trinity United Methodist church in downtown savannah. Next up is author brian curtis on the only rose bowl to take place somewhere other than pasadena, california. Live coverage of the savannah book festival continues shortly. [inaudible conversations] booktv tapes hundreds of other programs throughout the country all year long. Heres a look at some of the events covering this week. Monday at politics and prose bookstore in washington dc, to hear lanny davis, former special counsel for president clinton share his thoughts on the outcome of the 2016 election. On tuesday we head to roosevelt house in new york city where former white house official and cabinet secretary will examine our democracy and share his views on how to bring back trustworthy systems of government. Later that night at new york university, the presentation of the ten america literary award given annually since 1963 which recognize books in a range of categories from biography or science writing to essays and poetry. On wednesday at the green light extorting brooklyn investigative journalist vegas on White Nationalism in america. Thursday Syracuse University professor Daniel Thompson will be at saint and from college in New Hampshire to discuss why moderates might be less likely to run for congress. Later that night we are at the free library of philadelphia where rutgers professor Brittany Cooper will examine the power of what she calls eloquent rage and how it can be harnessed as a resource to bring about change. On friday, former Clinton Administration labor secretary Robert Reisch will be at the First Parish Church in cambridge, massachusetts, to talk about the economic and social cycles societies experience and their effect. That is a look at some of the events booktv will cover this week, many are open to the public. Look for them to air in the near future on booktv on cspan2. I have three criteria, the person had to be important or teach something important and two, they had to have a truly interesting story i read fiction and i think there is an arc talking about something as complicated as technology with apple motion to build the company to take a person and tell their story was important so i needed people with interesting stories and it was important topl me to have people not as wellknown. When the book opens i talk about this party that i went to a long time ago and i think the cio of the tech company with a very, very famous celebrities ceo. This person started to sing a littlemo song the only words were i did all the work and he got all, the credit. [laughter] and i think innovation is a team sport so the analogy that i use is a baseball game where the pitcher throws the perfect game because anyone who was at that game watches in our at the first baseman who steps on the bag at the last minute and the catcher makes the perfect calibrated calls and it goes in the history is the picture through a perfect game so anyone who is honest about how they succeeded in the valley will tell you it is a team effort that is true then and now i wanted to tell the story without whom the person in the spotlight would not have been there. Who do you want to start with . Sorry mike. [laughter] is always dangerous when the person is sitting in thehe audience because they can jump up to correct you so a lot of people in this room know who mike is but as i have gone around to other places, not very many people do which is a surprise to me. Ve when people know the founding of apple they noted to steve and the garage 1976. But they dont know there was somebody else who owned one third of apple and that was mike. The way his story came to me luckily we were friendly after my first book with a biography over an important friend to my hand since i do a lot of history i knew that there were so many of thesedo little startup Computer Companies all over the valley and all over the country and they all had theirtr brilliant engineers and their brilliant marketing guy but what made apple . And he would say there were a lot of people and that is true but one of those was mike because when you look at apple 1976, steve jobs was 21 years old with 17 months of business experience in his entire life working as a tech or atari as a matter of fact. [laughter] and Steve Wozniak wanted to stay in engineering hewlettpackard and did not want to start ast company so how did they end up as the youngest company ever to hit the fortune 500 . Because mike came in and brought with him a cadre of people from the microchip industry including carter. And if you look at apple when they went public good night, president , the vp of manufacturing, vp marketing, vp sales, cfo, vp hr, several major investors like sequoia all brought in by mike through his connections in the Semi Conductor industry and that is a story that is remarkable that people did not know that it goes back to the important of building on what came before so how foolish would that have been for those two to say we will do it ourselves because everyone else around them try to do it themselves without the same success ktv. Org. Heres a look at upcoming book fairs and festivals happening around the country. March 10th and 11th live at the university of arizona with the tucson festival of books without her talks and call ins, this festival features ms nbc and katie torok and charlie sykes, military historian max boone, investigative journalist David Johnson and many other authors. Later in march, the virginia festival of the book in charlottesville and the National Writers conference in brooklyn, new york. In april, we are headed to texas for the san antonio book festival and we will be live at the Los Angeles Times festival of books. For more information on upcoming book fairs and festivals and watch previous festival coverage click the book fairs tab on our website, booktv. Org. I am not an expert on fa but starting a conversation about patriotism and what it is to make sure that people do understand by the dictionary definition is the difference between patriotism and nationalism patriotism is a deep love of country but if you think of being a patriot if you are a true patriot that you dont beat on your chest to say we are better than everybody else the best in the strongest but to be in search of the more Perfect Union to say in order to seek a more Perfect Union that is patriotism but nationalism has arrogance and conceit which is dangerous takenn to extremes with economic nationalism and as an arrogant nationalist one of the things that i wanted to do is remind people of the Historical Perspective that follows but that extreme economic nationalism in the 1920s had racial nationalism now i am not suggesting we are at this point but i am suggesting it is a broad term of the presidency sometimes a short distance that leads to tribalism there are great historical experiments of the history of theit United States at tribalism then we are through as the land of the free and the home of the brave in those days until quite recently, the until quite recently to achieve what the air force thought they had at that is the case there is a lot of collateralf damage and to contribute to that with the Current Situation buton back then to be assigned so on and so forth and many were killed in the course of this there wasnt much you could hit except whole sections of cities mike when they were flying in arizona you didnt have that kind of accuracy at all. Effexor we did with the british had done to fly at night or in clouds using the radar pretty much with the british were doing and using incendiaries what the british had started in 42 to aim at those areas because the houses were closer together and then there is something down there. So they were called baby killers and in japan what we discovered with jetstream that made it possible to hit anything very accurately and then to cause a firestorm demonstrated in hamburg by the british which is a widespread fire that simultaneously drops a lot of incendiaries from all around changing those wind patterns and now the temperatures would rise to extremely high temperatures like 300 degrees fahrenheit. So peoples values shrunk in thete shelter. Because in tokyo for example where this was put to great effect on march 9 and 10th s 1945, how many people here know what im talking about . That night . How many do not . Okay. It caused a firestorm of enormous temperatures. So the people who came out the shelters were caught in the assault. It was creating hurricane when what i put in the book because of health it had to be understood. People were reporting babies being snatched out of the arms that tokyo is crisscrossed with canals they would use the canals to escape from the fire and tens of thousands burned to death. They would face the updraft so the cruise had to use their oxygen mask to escape the stench of burning flesh so Strategic Air command told roosevelt was the greatest manmade killing in the history of the world. [inaudible conversations] booktv is a live coverage of the savannah book festival now continues pick you will hear from author brian curtis. He will be talked about his book that looks at the only rose bowl to ever take place outside of pasadena, california. This is live coverage on booktv. [inaudible conversations] good morning, book lovers. My name is nancy and