Transcripts For CSPAN2 David Davis Wheels Of Courage 20240711

Here. I spent any evenings on the second floor and listening to the local authors talk about the books. So i really appreciate the invitation. I want to say hi to everybody out there who have not been able to see facetoface, in person. So thank you for tuning in. Obviously i am doubly honored that ron has agreed to speak with me tonight about the book. Go back. We were introduced by a local, years ago. Ron has been very encouraging and helped me quite a bit with this book in terms of background and research and so forth. Enron of course with a vietnam veteran, most of the book that i wrote is about World War Two veterans and i want to give you a little bit of a background before and i start speaking. Before world war ii, if you are paralyzed, you. Much but no helper as they would be called. Instead the average lifespan of someone would be 18 months of someone wanted in world war i. World war ii was a game changer, the advent of penicillin. In other drugs. They had surgical units are behind the battlefield, regular the frontlines. And better evacuation back to the mainland. So by the end of the World War Two, you part about 2500, u. S. Veterans who are paralyzed in return home. And they had a chance and a lifespan. This is the first cohort that was going to happen. It presented a dilemma. In a bit of an issue for the va, the veterans administration. And the government. In other words, how do we take care of these men. Before, basically they were immobilized and full body plaster cast and shut off into institutions for basically, if they were a family, they were in a family home. They had no mobility. The cliche of the term, can find a wheelchair, full through. Because you cannot move around. They were unwilling wheelchairs. Like living room furniture. And then again, was a game changer. World war two, there were wheelchairs that were made locally and they were a game changer because they could fold. Good for them in the car and then drive away and get a job. And start a family and so forth. Police 2500 paralyzed veterans were pioneers. In one of the Key Attributes of rehabilitation and rehabilitation management in the va hospitals was recreated and you would seek one of the first wheelchair basketball groups ever played. It was at ms. Karen penton Madison Square garden in 1940 and youll see them using the dinning chairs. Which in todays world, we would think of as just incredibly oldfashioned. Not very maneuverable. Back then, those were stateoftheart. And this is a game featuring paralyzed veterans from the hospital in massachusetts. We came down to new york city to play against a hospital. And you can see the game is very sort of crude. Theres a whole lot of offense of plays and things like that. But is the first time that paralyzed veterans and paraplegics are displayed in front of huge crowds. 15000 people. Admiring these pis some of these veterans who have managed to start a normal life. And sports was part of that. And hot and the key themes and we will see this in the next clip, one of the key teams and by the way, this was sort of the result. He had media coverage. This was one of the players in that game. He was wounded at normandy. And here he is on the cover of news again. Every media outlet cover these guys from the communist daily worker to popular mechanics. And here in southern california, there was wheelchair basketball. And this was out of the birmingham va hospital in the san fernando valley. This caught the attention of hollywood. And the first hollywood movie marlon brando, and he plays a paralyzed veteran. In a three having and some of this was filmed out in van nuys. And these are some of the exercises. Its one of the reason why the best ball became so popular. For the veterans but for others. Because it did help lift the chest, the arms and the shoulder muscles which are so important for paraplegics because for helping them to move around. And have the strength to be able to do this. Heres what i was mentioning about jennings. Hes getting into the car with his costar there. And then they go right into the second seat. And he can drive away. These are especially adaptive cars for the paraplegics. And you will see the house is now blocking and. In these paralyzed veterans formed a pda the paralyzed veterans of america when this team from birmingham would go on the road and stop in washington dc and adaptive cars and striving to build a house. And here we see implying wheelchair basketball. Im playing sports. This was shot at the pool there. And one of the bedrooms, i write extensively about the book was in this film. In the used a bunch of extras who are paralyzed veterans. As background actors. And again you see obviously, this was a very attractive girl to him. His first role acting. In becoming a star. Ron, your played by marlon brando. You are played by tom cruise. [laughter]. Ron david, first off i wanted to tell you is a pleasure to be participating. My very first wheelchair was a jennings closure. You may become very old. And it was the first chair i had. It worked for me back then. It was 1968. I was shot on january 20th, 1968 on my second tour of duty as a marine in vietnam. The dmz area. And i was shot through the right shoulder and went to my right lung and paralyzed me mid chest down. Been paralyzed from a mid chest down to the last, 53 years. I remember reading yesterday that even after world war ii, a lot of the quadriplegics and paraplegics were not living past one year or 18 months and she said. Im so grateful to be alive, still alive. I have lost any friends along the way. This is not an easy disability, and easy physical challenge to deal with. If psychologically, emotionally, it is a great challenge. David maybe you can tell us about that. Unit up at the bronx va. David yes and ironically was later investigated by life magazine. They did a frontpage reference cover of the forgotten food. There was a title. It shook up the whole ba. Is a story of neglect, the young men coming back from vietnam some of the most catastrophic injuries you can imagine. Paraplegics, quadriplegics. Human life from the neck down. Some of the most severe, being neglected. Overcrowded conditions. Im sure any of you who are watching the sound might have scenes in the movie tom cruise will become a board and july, that was true. That is how i begin my life at the age of 21. Im in this place, not only was i dealing with paralysis but just having the shock of lust three quarters of my body come everything for my chest down. It would never be able to make children. I must say, from the moment i left the field of battle and i received last right from the Catholic Church. They didnt know if i would make it or not. Ive never not felt grateful to be alive. Everything today. No matter how hard its gotten over the years. And theres been some really difficult moments especially in the early years. Depressing moments, moments when i drink way too much. Moments when i came close to giving up. And leaving this world way too early. Youre the part of me gnu today they did out of there barely. Gotten out of there. The bullet went through my right foot and blew out the back of the hill. I could no one walk. Tonight around to my right shoulder and set up my spine from the chest down. Cannot move. My rifle was in the stand and it wouldnt fire anymore. It was jammed. In the first marine to come up from behind, was shot in the heart from the honey he was killed instantly. In another rain came back a few moments later came up from behind, grabbed me and through me over his shoulder and money back under heavy fire and save my life. I have never forgotten the day. And how lucky i am who have survived even during the most difficult times. The early years were very difficult. Any of the young woman were severely wounded paralyzed veterans. This first few years were too much for them. But some of us decided to go on. I remember sitting in my room in my wheelchair and i was all alone and they remember having this feeling, thinking to myself out of my make it through another day. We would have some of the veterans from world war ii and korea coming to our room at the va. And they were inspiring. Just to see these guys who had been in these vultures for five or ten years and even longer. I cannot believe it. I just trying to make it through every single day. And psychologically and emotionally and physically overwhelming for me. I have no idea how i would live with this thing. But how is going to deal with it. It could have never imagined that i would have the future that i mentally. That was able to eventually address the Democratic National convention in new york. And i was able to write a book. I became a bestseller and run around the world. And i was able to eventually have a movie made of my life. So i feel blessed. My life in any ways has been a blessing in disguise. Athleticism. And you talk about the whole wheelchair festival. When i got out of the hospital david, i decided through the g. I. Bill, had the opportunity. It was a great student believe me. I had to go to Summer School just to get a general diploma which was mailed to me. So i was not going to college and had decided that i would join the marines and make my mom and dad proud. And that in the coming home paralyzed. But i remember that it was just david how did you get started brought in terms of after you out of the va hospital, and he played basketball. How did that happen. David will first of all, i was able to go to college. My academic standing was not the best of the time. So that i was still able to go. They gave me an opportunity to go. They had a Basketball Team i went. It it was called the ruling dutchmans. I grew up wanting to play the new york yankees. I mean, theres only in basketball and football and wiffleball treated if you came from new york, you were heavily in the sports. And we were in our neighborhood. And Mickey Mantle and roger medicine. In all of these dreams of being a hero. I was very strong and athletic. It was a gymnast in high school. And even before i joined the ruling dutchmans, will chair festival team, which was quite an experience for me. I used to shoot baskets. When i would have some time, there was a court just at the va, just down this little hill. There was a little possible corporative good by myself or hours. Two or three hours. And i would just shoot. And i loved it. And i did that by myself until i found out they had this organized wheelchair Basketball Team at the university. I decided to join. Now what led me to join is that i had my First Political organization that i decided to join, interestingly enough was called push. People united to support the handicapped. So my First Organization in politics, and as the years, i would be involved in a lot of politics and protests. But this organization was made of exclusively, cerebral palsy, the blind, sight impaired, you name it. We had it. And back then, you have to understand, is very for multiple this time. There were more people in the streets, demonstrations, revolution was in the year and even this group that met once a week at the university was what led me to eventually join the best looking. I was filled with passion and filled with an a certain sense of rebellion. The school was that way. The country was extremely polarized. Any of you who lived during that time and the good fortune of living through that extraordinary time. In history where the vietnam war and the country was split our unit very similar in any ways to what is going on right now. I have to say that this organization push, that was the First Organization that gave me a certain confidence in a particular moment women and who ironically, shed been in high school. She eventually became an author later in life. And she says passed away. Connie who a dedicated born on the fourth of july 2, i remember leaving the va one day during, they allowed me to go there on my day off so that i can meet the dean it was going to allow me to go to this school. I can still remember his name. Dean seiter. Allen into the office and there was this girl in the office in a wheelchair. Connie was her name. With a severe disability. That occurred at birth. And she said to me you look familiar. Did you go to my high school. She said i used to watch you with your Varsity Center walking past me in the hallway. I said i remember you, you were the only disabled person was here in our entire selected. And she said yes. She said i started to drive her home. Because she needed to drive home. She said she did. But i would drive her home and she was not far from my town. I would drop her off the negative her parents. One thing led to another chance me to join this People United to support the handicapped for everything from, you must know that at the university, they were really at the forefront back then. It was find itself in the fact that it was catering to and welcoming the disabled and welcoming, this was a big change in the early 70s. And it eventually led to the american with disabilities act. But she was the one who led me to this First Political organization physically challenged people. And then from there, she said well you know, get a wheelchair Basketball Team here and hobson university. Went on to go down. It know that you were an athlete in high school. And you are a wrestler varsity presser. And you love sports. What you go down. So i went down and they allowed me and they accepted me. My level of injury was. High is illustrated had no balance. But it was thrilling. It really was. As exciting to be with other young men like myself with very similar disabilities and to be competing. To actually be competing. There was a feeling of transcending rated where it for you forgot, for moment you were not thinking about being paralyzed. In the moment you were shooting baskets. Youre trying to make shot. This was exciting, it was wonderful. And he great inside. Physically. Having whatever depressin depren mightve had her doubts or feelings, coming out was dealing with a lot of not just physical but because of what had gone through, during my second tour of duty. I was dealing with a lot of psychological trauma. What i had gone through during that second tour. I was struggling with it. I was struggling with whether i had a right to stay alive or to give up. I felt a tremendous amount of survivors guilt. And wondered if i deserved to be alive. Because others had died and i survived and people have been responsible for who and then into battle had been killed. And yet i was still alive. Even though i was paralyzed. I felt the terrible guilt. And i lived with that for a long time. It was a long journey to move through that sand to be able to emerge from that and be able to forgive myself. And to forgive those who mightve sent me to the war. Ron nano, that is quite all right. And i want to circle back and sing that you mentioned and previously about when you are the va, and you have a guess in a sense, the sports of World War Two and korean war. Had. David for the veterans who gone through. So i am laying there in my bed and you have these guys come in here with this copy very positive attitude. How you doing. As a going. Collis rodriguez sedo. One of the real inspirations and founders early founders of paralyzed veterans of america. A real character and halfbreed real mover and shaker. Had that thick new york bronx accent or whatever. How you doing. What is going on. How can we help you. Wikimedia. How long have you been in the wheelchair. And i had had a difficult day and what if i could make through the 19 over 86, and in wiltshire about 12 years. When the korea. The size would come into our rooms and they were very important to us back then. And a man who had been paralyzed so severely that he had, he was paralyzed from the neck down if you can imagine. And there was a full and his throat, with little cork out of it. Rose about it in the book. Wednesday, that would pull out that cork, and it would put a tube in there and i would have to listen to this. And all of the rest of the guys in there about three or four others. They would be suctioning the fun out of his lungs and he would not get the money apart and heard that everything today. It was just, so moving. I felt so lucky to be alive. And yet here was a guy right across from me who was just trying to live ahead. Delete that was ahead. And how could these people inspire you. And people like the world war ii vets. In the korean vets, coming into your room and telling you, you can do something with your life. Your life is not over. And for a long time, i remember the guy would come in and he was recruiting paraplegics work for the watch company. To make watches to work on watches. This were a lot of the guys were sent. To the watchmaking company. I used to say to myself, that is not me. I was had a big dreams as a kid reads and maybe it was another good thing to do some big. But i always thought of my life but have a much greater meeting. Im not knocking people who worked at the watch company. They have a job. And i just wanted to do more. I wanted my life to really count and really stand for something even before i was paralyzed. I had been inspired by john f. Kennedy. I wanted to be by john f. Kennedy braden john wayne. Maybe it was unhealthy. Maybe it was maniacal but that was so i was afraid and was an american. Having grown up in american boy in this country, having dreams beyond all dreams. Believing you could be anything you wanted to be. No matter what happens to you. Even back then. I said i wanted to do something great with my life. Ron only interrupt for a second. There was a program started through the World War Two thats. She built a watchmaking school in queens. And when youre going to john f. Kennedy airport, you will go by some of those buildings there. Eventually, they added a basketball court. David i had no idea. Ron when you think about it. It was one of the sponsors, the steam. And there was another company team of the pan am jets. And they were mostly polio. Sonu i, as part of the story about that watch making company. As you mentioned. I was part of the rehabilitation was vocational. And the va administrators figured, its give these guys in a job in a wheelchair, they can do watchmaking there. Anyway connected. David any of the veterans, i admire the head of the watch company to do that. I love the name of the team by the way. That name is really catchy. I love that. I probably took the wrong turn. I was grumpy and i had an attitude. I dont know how my mom and dad ever could have with me. I used to go out to the barn i would come home drunk. Menacing the scene and the board of the fourth of july. Remember in the men. I would be terrible. I was a juvenile delinquent is 21 in a wheelchair. Sue and thats a good point. In the things that we experience in the sense of they started playing wiltshire festival. Everything was okay. Theres recovery. As you mentioned, there are psychological elements. You have both physical and psychological things. David can you imagine losing most of your body. Having a trigger that killed people and knowing that you pull people right in front of you. You taken life of this will not to mention the somebody must kill you. You somehow are dragged out of this place only a cordarro body left, or your head. The upper part of your body and got a big something this and find a way to keep living read underway. Ron before we go, i just want to throw this out to the audience. If you have questions for ron or myself, please feel free to type them in and one of us will answer. We just want to make sure that you allow that is viable. Ron i really want to recommend this book. This book is inspiring. One of the things that david touches upon. He writes beautifully. Passionately. He touches upon affected this group of men, they were playing in the clip that you sell. These men of world war ii, of okinawa, on the european area who came back these devastating injuries, they were of the greatest generation as well. And this book, recognizes them, probably for the first time that we begin to recognize the fact in a very honorable way, that this group, these men were very much a part when a piece of that generation. By the way, my mother and father both served during world war ii. My mother joined in the navy a week after pearl harbor. My father who was in wisconsin at the time, planting trees in the roosevelt program. He informed. Right after december 7th 1941, immediately when you sign up the monday after the sunday, december 7th my father was lined of to join the service. To support his country. So i grew up with parents who had served during the second world war. Ron a new of course or boarding the fourth of july, 1946. Right after. David a little while ago. Ron there was quite a reaction. It went quite a different reaction for when the world war ii veterans came home versus when Vietnam Veterans like yourself came home. Maybe you could address that and talk to that point a little bit. In other words, what was the reaction you found when you return home finally to little under long island. And try to start your life anew. David growing up, in the 50s with john wayne movies. Machine guns, and the culture. I dont know if you remember, was a tv show on cb is called the big picture. I grew up watching this about world war ii. When losing europe, it is better heroes coming back from world war ii. Were all aware of that. Thats what we thought america was like. If and when we came back from vietnam, sent you the other day, i remember silence. Nobody really put it to talk about it. They didnt want to talk about the war. And yet our lives have been profoundly affected by it. That experience dramatically. And i remember feeling, that i know a lot of veterans said they felt they were missed treated and abused. I just felt that people just south of feelings. They didnt want to talk about it. There was very difficult. I think i was trying to ignore myself and wanted help in. And somehow, she is overwhelmingly russian. Because having anxiety attacks, was sticking my finger in my throat every morning. Wrenching. It wasnt sick to my stomach. I was just doing that to break the terror that he felt every morning. I would wake up a nightmare every morning. I go to bed with a nightmare every night. Good go to sleep at night. His when i was blended it. I was frightened. If i just stayed awake. But as they went back across the river and i went to the first data station. Youre correct what you said earlier about how quickly, i was immediately taken care of. Was i was pulled off the field and once my life was saved. In the rain who saved my life, was killed and not artillery it caffrey he died the same day he said my life. And immediately and the other side of the river, the command center was, i was being attended to. My doctors print is being cared for. It was put on the helicopter immediately and then playing. Immediately. I was in the intensive care for prayed immediately i was receiving last rites of the Catholic Church now is being operated on. So this was very different. I was able to survive and come home. Ron terms of that chain of command and your treatment. You are in world war ii and korea. And where they evacuated by helicopter. One of the bedrooms that, let me just say this. Ron seemed our lives. This was a savage window. Elisabeth and every day. I dont feel that way. Feel like ive transcended this. I know im paralyzed. I know its difficult. It is difficult to redact. But yet i feel like i have moved beyond the freighted to the its important that people realize that you can move beyond. Anybody watching this right now, no matter how tragic you may think your circumstances are. Or how youre struggling emotionally or tormented. You have doubts with the life has meaning. Never give up. Never quit british you never know what is around the bend. You never know how your life can change. And dont know what is waiting for you out there. I couldve ever imagined that when was first wanted, some famous movie star would like my life story millions of people would see that around the world how could i ever imagine that. But i would write a book. In my mother would say how did you ever do that, you were terrible high school. Ron i think he was paralyzed the knuckle what i want, his name is jerry, i was able to meet with them and interviewed him. I got with him before he passed away. Thankfully he knew this book was on his way before he passed away. His life intersected with yours. I would like to ask you about it. It is not that well known. Jerry lived a very full life. He was in a wheelchair for 70 some odd years. Ron 20 more years than me. I can only hope that i will and the long freighted. David he wanted to live life to the fullest. And one of the jobs was to go to mexico. And it became known as place for the vast numbers of veterans, the paralyzed veterans who would go down to mexico, to live as they could look cheap and fun. An understanding with down there and you lived there. And wanted to ask you with that experience was like. Ron it is true and i went down there. Back then, there was a place, called the village of the sons right of nosing the compound. And they were almost exclusively, to them veterans, paralyzed. Probably saw the scene in the movie, quite a colorful scene. Knowledge of the son. I wanted to get out of the states. In a found out about mexico when i was on the paraplegic ward one day. A guy in wiltshire borneo, i spent time with on the board, kingdoms of wheeling the board with a sombrero out on an beautiful young woman, she looked like she was 18 years old, younger woman. We want that old. But anyway, he said you know, i legitimate my wife and i said, how are you doing. And he said you got to go to mexico. And youve got to go to the village of the sons he said. Will change your life. So i went to this place. I remember getting drunk one night again. I was drinking a lot back then. I dont know how i get home. I can hardly see. Was blind drunk and drove back to my house. I get out of my wheelchair and willed up the ramp. I remember crawling into the bed and hooking up to my bed, my catheter that ive used ever since. And saying to myself, what am i doing. Where is my life going. I made a decision. The next day got a ticket. To fly from Kennedy Airport to mexico city. A direct flight. And change planes and i was headed there. I was going to do with entitlement. I was going to try to find my wife. That was my main motivation. I couldnt find a girl, couldnt meet anybody. Maybe it is my own insecurity until now. I had a lot of that. I wanted to have happen to me what happened to him. Wanted to meet somebody. So i flew down there. Landed there. And i remember the sky around the village, and he carried me and to this old broken down trump. And he drove me, must been 30 miles or so. For this darkened to the village of the sun. This really quite an experience rating the next morning i got up and i was in this little room, is very humble possible little bit. Was nothing fancy. Made motel six look like a priest or cape. Its very basic. And there was a main area where the long table all the guys were going to be a wheelchairs on both sides. We had breakfast there every morning. And every night at a certain hour, we had a rims. I happen to fall in with some of the role people as you mightve seen the movie. Charlie, was a wild man from chicago. What your name, charlie. How long have you been here 800 years or Something Like that. Until then, everybody here him. And i fell in with us while the man. They took me under his wing. And i was grateful to be running with anybody back then. I wanted to live. I wanted to be some girls. So he took me into the citys. Said ill take you out freighted and it took me to these different or houses. In city. So i can meet a wife. So i ran with charlie. I dont know if you saw the movie rated i do want this bookstore to go out of business. I tell the rest of the story. I had never had before. And this was my First Experience with. I was paralyzed before it ever made love to anybody percent. And im so young, starting to be a good catholic. I didnt want to burn in the fires of. Signed not made love our had with any woman even in high school. I was 21 years old now all of a sudden boom, is paralyzed everything in the mid chest down. I would never have stuck again released not since i will not sprinted never be able to have children. I was lining up in a warehouse can find love. Ended up on these mattresses and these four houses. With these women it. They were particularly done, i dont know how young they were. But i didnt even know what to do. And in that one scene, i started to cry. I cant move this. Cant move data kidnapped. It was very difficult and painful and frustrating and dramatic for me at first. And thinking about all of these guys world war ii. Something thats not often said. But most of the sexuality, the loss of that aspect of our lives and the loss of the ability to my children have children and have some type of normalcy in her life freighted know something, youre afraid to tell people about it almost. And that place provided that for me. You could call it a place of experimentation. I can at least experience for women for the first time who would not let the mayor make fun of me because i cannot move certain parts of my body or feel them anymore. They who would accept me, and allow me to begin the journey to discover what sexuality really was. There were other aspects of sexuality. Other than that one particular approach that i had lost the war. I know maybe this is bothered people to hear this. If it was not just that i cannot move my legs. I would never stand and walk again. Theres also that i cannot experience this experience that everyone said was so wonderful. An exciting. So is the beginning of a journey for me. To find meaning and purpose in my life freighted and the village of the sun provided that for me. Charlie drove me from one for us to the next. And we were getting thrown out of places. In this man was dangerous. No got thrown out of one place and i thought, first of all, the fluke him at the front door and out of his wheelchair. Onto the street. And i wondered if we would survive this. And i know if you remember, the cab ride, they finally get back to the village of the sun. He starts fighting with the cabdriver and tries to tell him that he has cheating and starts calling General Social names. In the cabdriver ended up throwing his on the roadside side. We were lucky enough to have gotten back to the village that night. We were abandoned in the middle of the desert. So the village of sun was quite an experience for me. And at the same time, is very happy to get back to the United States. I would say god i am finally back home. David thank you for that experience ron. And if i wrote about any had been adopted children. And that was part of their journey. Two new normal as you would say. Ron im one person. When i went through. I was witness to the fact that yes any of them, and very normal lives. Any of them raised children and had normal families freighted and you know why it took me. Never been married and never adopted any children. But i have been able to find love in a very special woman in my life right now. David and she helped us connect with this internet thing the world zooming on an broadcasting with. So we appreciate that. And an we have a question from eval. And he asks, it obviously you played voltaire best ball. It did you ever plate wheelchair baseball. Ron neu never did. But in toronto, a street right in front of my house, don, we would play football. And i was overl obviously is als quarterback for he loved football and wheelchair. And also when im still patient in the bronx va, theres a workout mass and i would challenge the paraplegics. I was a varsity wrestling high school. I would challenge someone to wrestle me. Everything was paralyzed which estimate all had was my upper body. Still. Strong. And i would wrestle these guys. But even after being paralyzed and actors being shot and wounded. There is a desire to be physically involved in the sports that i loved as a young man. I never played wheelchair baseball but it did pick up a little ball that freighted i would try to do what i did when i was a kid played wiffleball again in the backyard freighted and i could still hit the ball with one hand with a wiffleball bat. But there was something missing. Something hurting inside present the same and would never be the same again. But at the same time, i continued. I know who thomas. I continued my love of sports. An time is a great sportswriter. Its an honor to have his question. David one of the things that i thought was so interesting when i did the research in this book coming from someone who really didnt know about the origin of winter sports, was why did they pick will share festival. The great team sport that was played. And you think the height with basketball and michael jordan. And on the other hand, having said that, basketball, is smooth, and the best ball is big enough to hold. And for these players in the wheelchairs and we think about it, with a grass field anyway, its very difficult freighted be one it would take about three hours to get the first base. [laughter]. David so theres another question here ron slipping into this one. Were getting close to the end of her time. You mentioned in the past there was a lot of silence around the topic. Was it shifted the conversation. But that what is shifted that there was so much time around topic. Ron around the war. Leaning the topic. David around this topic, around paraplegic. Ron and were talking the world war ii veterans freighted we know what specifically happen in Madison Square garden on that one particular night, just before this game with the New York Knicks began, the public address system, somebody announced theres going to be a special little preevent. All of a sudden these guys the wheelchairs came out into the core. Nobody had seen this before. There were thousands of people in the arena. Madison square garden. A big sports arena. And they came out and they didnt know what to make of them. They did not know whether to feel sorry for them. There was justice silence. In the big gay began. In one of the guys in the wheelchair got out of the chair. And there was this gas. All throughout the garden. But what happened was very important at the moment. He turned around and grabs wheelchair and he muscled himself and pulled himself back into the chair. Sets out and he started yelling the referee from what i read in the book. Started yelling and all of a sudden, everybody started to cheer. I Madison Square garden. In the feeling about who these men were, they were regular guys. They had been looted the war. We still have a lot of fighting spirit left. They were not done yet. It was very important to me when i read that in your book. Ron just to end that, when you think about that, before the war, the president of the United States Franklin Roosevelt was a polio patient. And use a wheelchair. He refused basically to ever be photographed while he was sitting in his wheelchair. There is such a stigma about disability back then. And obviously there still is stigma about disability to the state. But what i think im being out there, by being Madison Square gardens. By defeating by the way, able bodied teams that would borrow wheelchairs for the occasion, by forming this group that had become a very powerful group in dc. The new produce the stigma. And help bring about change in our society. Its a long process but one of the things that i am fascinated with his that came out here from van nuys was whenever they would make the rough trip back east, illinois stop in washington dc. They would go out and tell everybody about the disabilities. Ron they were pioneers. They are the reason why i have the life that i have today. And when i found the acceptance. The other physically challenged or disabled people. And we are equal. You can rise to the heights. And theres a saying that ive heard for any years. It says that roosevelt was elected president of the United States back then. But no person in the wheelchair today, could be elected president of the United States. Dont agree with that. I dont believe that. I believe our potential as disabled people, and the potential of the physical challenge. World physically challenged one party to send limited departed if everybody is a physical challenge. Everybody deals with disability. The most dramatic disability is when your dad. Not here anymore. What is more disabling than not being alive. Give me a break. So everybody goes through his ability. Everybody deals with this disability. Were all dealing with that freighted or not all admitting it to our selves freighted but i think that physically challenged people representatives the inspiration for this i think your book is so important. It honors the greatest generation and an element of the greatest generation. An eloquent and beautifully put together way. I recommend that you read this book. In david, larry said the skin pride you wrote it beautifully. David in illinois, almost became the Vice President for joe biden. No money. She was in a wheelchair. Ron sunday the future of this great country of ours, that a man or woman in wheelchair will rise to the office of th officef the presidency of the United States. Will hold you to that. If theres any other questions, please let me know. They thomas another one. Ron, do you watch a lot of basketball. So, who are your favorite players. Ron lebron james, the lakers of course. I have to tell you, i know tom rated tom and i have been in the village rated Redondo Beach several times. He is a wonderful writer. Tom, as i told you any times, mike great sport is baseball. In the dodgers. I love the dodgers. I grew up a yankee fan. This a big deal. His almost sacrilegious coming out to california from new york. Becoming a dodgers fan. My neighborhood where i grew up, either hated the yankees love the dodgers are you love the dodgers. It is between the two blocks. There were dodgers fans and yankees fans. And i was a yankee fan. Mickey mantle. Of the whole team. I know every position. If you really love sports, you will you know every one of them. Everything a no about them. Basketball, and football, i love to watch miscible. Very proud of the lakers this year. Theyre just zooming along. I have the gall the way. Is baseball. Even this limited season, i continued to be an avid fan. Enormous a time, baseball is my greatest love of all. David and then obama will send back. Maybe we can get another person to join us next time. I hopped back on here. Because you said the dodgers. I love love love love the dodgers. So im so glad you able to say that and you became a dodgers fan. Even though you grew up yankee fan. Incredible. What a season. Plus baseball. Were going all way. I agree. Ron thank you. Thank you i so much for everything. To my thank you to both of you. Really really appreciate this. This was a great great conversation. In the forget you can buy davids book here. You can click on that button down there and i will take you to the romans book site and you can buy wheels of courage. And he want to scroll up there and then check here in the side, tom did mention the 40th anniversary. And i link to that in there as well. Just so you know. Because we enjoyed with what ron had to say tonight and you can get the full book there. We ask in general, when of the books here, if you can support independent bookstores. , we continue to ask for your help during this tough time. To buy books from us. We hope that you can do your Christmas Shopping here. We have plenty of stuff to purchase separate scan of a onestop shop. In september and were talking about christmas and feels weird. But what a great way to start the gift list. They might be able to get that and again, thank you so much gentlemen. We are so appreciative of your time. And everything that you did for us tonight brightest thank you so a much. Ron thank you. David thank you. Thank you everyone for tuning in. Business abdomens bookstore. Com. Good or system media site. We hope to see you again soon. Have a wonderful and everybody. Current bestselling nonfiction books according to the washington post. The best of me, a collection of stories and essays by author and humorist, david. Isabel woken since inspiration of what she calls a hidden tax system in the United States. This followed by after Matthew Mcconaughey was more and modern comfort foods. And some of the bestselling books according to the washington post, is activist memoir. Untainted. Some of these authors appear to book tv, and you can watch of their events online at booktv. Org. During a virtual author event hosted by a bookstore in michigan, a retired astronaut harry birds inflected on his time and space for his portion of the discussion. And i talked about a lot of the different aspects of launch. First evolved getting into your suit. How complicated that is. In the process of getting strapped into a space shuttle. It is not exactly like going and getting into your car and putting in the seatbelt. The experience of the launch. The noise, and the views that i have the sounds of things happening and what it felt like. It is the experience of launch. Done a lot as a Fighter Pilot in test pilot. I thought i knew what i was getting into. And actually launching on an endeavor, was unlike anything id ever done to save lease rate is in the launch, chapter is. Cool. I like the part of the story. In another part life in space that you expect would be spacewalking. And again, getting into the sit there, if you see me in, is three or 400pound. It takes hours to get into. Astronauts they increase the pressure, they have to worry about the same problem scuba divers have that is getting the bends when a change in pressure. If you do it too quickly. In hollywood, he threw a new city was that you start putting the aliens. In real space, this whole process takes hours. Have a long ordeal. So doctor that now i talk about what its like to be outside. The dysplastic visor in front of you and this monkey suit. And on the other side of that is instant death. So the threat level of being outside and space walk as little bit higher than other things. In the abuse that i saw, i felt like at times i was saying creation. Like humans arent supposed to see this, this is gods view that i had to get back to work. To watch the rest of this program, visitor website and social the author when the title of his book, how to estimate using search fox news top of the page. My name is Karen Greenberg and im the director on National Security at the law school. Im delighted today to be joined by the author of the new book, the black banner, declassified it. The war on terror after 911. You probably know, a former special agent with the fbi and investigative highprofile cases before during and after the 911 attacks. In recent years hes