Century economically and technologically the United States is fighting very hard to preserve the status quo its position in the world and we can focus in on the tech sector and this is really what its more about its who is going to dominate and thats why its taking so hard to get an agreement and its and thats why its so politically important more so for trump because hes up for reelection but of course the chinese leadership has to come through for the Chinese People because well theyve been on a pretty good roll for the last 30 years they want to keep it going go ahead heather that is that is very true i think its important to stay where we are in the tariff negotiations the u. S. Has imposed thus far 25 percent and 200000000000. 00 worth of goods coming from china and that was recently increased from only 10 percent now china has also retaliated anywhere between 5 and 20 percent tariff on 110000000000. 00 worth of u. S. Goods i think its also. Its remember that we buy we meaning the u. S. A lot more goods from china than they do for my so at some point in time china will run out of terrorists to retaliate on and i and so they will may resort to other measures every tally ation outside of tariffs same question to you michael in forest hills here i mean it really is about a paradigm shift one power not wanting that shift to occur and another one feels that its finally reached its place on the global stage i mean the this is these are peers they are genuinely peers now economically and its something the u. S. Has never had to confront go ahead michael well that doesnt stop the United States from asking for economic surrender it wants china and russia and other countries all could be dependent on United StatesInformation Technology arms dollar and finance. In agriculture so that if these countries do something america doesnt like it can impose sanctions on them that will hold whole apart all of the connections of their economy no other economy is going to go along with this and china and any other economy is going to say wed better be independent from any ability of the United States to suddenly disrupt their activity by imposing sanctions so were going to have our own arrangements for food for oil or Information Technology so the you know what companies doing is to china together with other countries to make turn it to ways to in effect trump is imposing sanctions on the United States well its very interesting because john i mean you have what i want hang on let me go to john and then we could make it a free for all john but you know what you know with the kind of relationship that is occurring during the socalled trade war here i mean doesnt this give initiative to for the chinese to actually innovate even more if theyre going to be cut off. From these technologies and these products and these consumers been they can do it on their own and in some ways that seems like a kind of a wise move because he does have to swallow the bitter pill now and youll be much better later so i mean i again i mean kind of echoing what michael is saying right here is that in a sense here by targeting specific companies theyre actually spurring innovation in china itself go ahead john. Well i guess youre talking about targeting while this is actually a very chew so far china in the u. S. Being in a working wary well in terms of economic integration this postrace going on is also very large operation here in china representing Something Like 402500 1000000000 dollars of interest here so the success of global value chain that meaning global very chim production across the pacific has been credible to successful but so far you know the chinese status of learned that this is in danger now hallways a prime example of that this motto is you know you can have blind faith is the motto and this actually drives corporate china further into self in the ovation self indigenous being selfreliant so i think this is a. Very dangerous sign coming out that the global very choose stories in is in shambles right now and also want to get a point. To where others just said its chu that the United States maintains a very large trade deficit with china some point china is going to roll out goes to put on tarot some but point is that 40 percent of the chinese exports to manage things actually socialist Corporate America operating here in china and that means that a lot of these types of hitting products that are actually imported about American Companies into u. S. And altimeter all pay the buy but American Consumer you know the studies out there pointing out that the average burden for American Family is going to be somewhere between 700 dollars to 1000 dollars. So sooner or later the people going to realize this you know the price of a walmart at amazon dot com is going up and the average american working families up when the bill for this so its actually not in the marcus interest to you know just protests and this is not just one way street i mean the exports coming from china to the u. S. Or a socialist. The benefits of quitting to Corporate America and you know the goods are being bought in American Families and theyre paying for this ok how do you want to jump in there go ahead a lots been said. Yeah i mean i have yeah i guess ill be the one person to push back but im on with 2 professors and i and i am not a professor so i will be cautious all raise my hand and i think the administration in the u. S. So i know that this also hurts us it walmart has said prices are going to have to go up and it also hurts china perhaps even more than the u. S. And as a free market capitalist i mean i dont necessarily like the idea of tariffs or want to impose tariffs but i do understand the u. S. The administration u. S. Trade teams position that china has been stealing our intellectual property for many years and has forced joint ventures if you want to do business with china in beijing where you are john i think you have to transfer your you form a joint venture and you transfer all of your trade secrets to them and then they can use that data or they are using that have that data to trade if its a joint or theyre just a company but if its a joint venture how targeting you know if its a joint venture how. Well its thats good because china is not supposed to be able to give our trade secrets to their Domestic Companies thus putting our u. S. Domestic manufacturers at a disadvantage and thats what were targeting that well we want to you know business which means youll do the doing what youre basically fair and your buddies to do the joint ventures why because there are profits to be made i mean weve known this for a very long time michael you were disagreeing jump. In technology is universal there is no such thing as a trade secret thats like saying that china shouldnt grow its own food because we grow up grow our food. When theyre talking about trade secrets youre talking about monopoly pricing in the United States once they have other countries china and others dependent on us. Patent rights and monopolies just like the pharmaceutical companies that charge an enormous braces for growth thats not a trade secret when when a company violates. The normal free trade in establishing a monopoly every other country has the right to produce of course if some other country tries to exploit them by selling it in exploitative rent grabbing over and above us ok well joe you go what is it like knowledge of good job good job what is the technology if that in a socalled theft of intellectual property is where the 1st one to make the point that no country can make any progress significant progress on the technology of phones by just stating and and Technology Transfer coercion themselves corporate china has to be innovating and they have been climbing that Technology Lead us no doubt about it and also im not going to defend it or snow you know that its an actual property theft in china thats when it happens but the point is that i think the United States was talking about a state sponsored theft of intellectual property so i mean as a distinction here im not sure thats true i mean if you look at the u. S. T. R. Rubber law is a 2nd 31 report he talks about theft of intellectual Property Rights he doesnt distinguish between you know its individual companies or government sponsored a theft i think a very important distinction here i dont think theres a very solid evidence to support the idea that the Chinese Government is engaging a state sponsored theft systematic comprehensive theft of copper americas intellectual property so i dont think thats true there was a spot to the enforced technology. Again i want to make again i mean the finish has a good enough to we have to make a distinction between the government and individual companies when individual company cost American Companies about for me and joint venture in china of course the chinese side goes it will go you know what can you offer on the table is there any Technology Transfer you can you can offer us in exchange for something we table and if you call that force Technology Transfer im not sure thats really forced i mean this is a well thats the thats going. To go issue here and thats why i said these companies willingly go into these joint ventures here. Finish out the 1st block of the program to groups like those who are against one maybe 3 against one go ahead 42nd so the report we go to break again fly im sorry i just think again no no no problem this is fine its not my position its the President Trump and the u. S. T. R. S. Position and not just a republican or democratic issue when there has been democratically support in the us from from the past president obama for example has filed 16 cases what the World Trade Organization about chinese the chinese stealing our intellectual property as well as dumping goods like aluminum and steel on u. S. Soil in those most of those i think have been resolved but Bernie Sanders also saying that they have destroyed millions of u. S. American jobs and bill clinton in recently Chuck Schumer there in d. C. Say i havent heard theyre going on china has a right to not just a robot like im going to go over the United States. Hang on john but the chinese didnt steal any jobs it was american corporations that did it it wasnt china ok or im going to join or not or that they are going to were going to short were going to show our grain and after that short break well continue our discussion on trying to trade more say with 13. Live. Live. Live. Live live. Live. Live live. Live live. Live. Live. Live. Oh. Please. Live. Live. Live. And very well might continue watching on since last. Feel welcome you start. Normal goggles. A memory a little know well you know but what if in your ocean cruise it. Was a march. Toward was to be with a boy in the. News new york city but some still. Lead you to surround us some. Morning some. Written you believe it or that is which. Youll see in the local which is based on what. You own or one with your leanings leaves the choice to start to look at your bullshit i look at you look to salute you. That. Is my chapter. Financial Survival Guide stacey lets learn a salad fill out lets say im not sure i get any earthly. Stuff the fight well street spot thank you for. Destroying 6 thats. Slavery. Welcome back to cross talk where all Things Considered im peter all about rwanda were discussing tribes. Straight war. Ok let me go back to i call in forest hills look i am for the president getting a good trade deal with china or whatever that deal is then we have to talk about its nuts and bolts but i do support the American National interest so im reaching out to have the right here ok im just trying to kind of peel back some of the kind of propaganda that we hear in the Mainstream Media now i mean you know michael you know him currency manipulation what was quantitative easing ok i mean there are different terms for it ok but you know i mean i always pointing at china my why you know ill be evolving ill be very. Controversial here. Michael with a lot of people are just jealous of chinas enormous success i mean it is the one of the most amazing economic miracles in such a short amount of time when i was a young man you know china you when you open up like a you know an atlas and you know the f. B. I. Fact book you know like china was just not there to be the most populous country in the world that nobody ever really talked about it except for its commie there now we have to talk about it a lot and ive been to china it is a remarkable place to see now. A huge middle class but its extraordinary i think you know. People are not really well informed what china is really all about except for its the new adversary which is so boring go ahead michael well china has succeeded and gotten rich by boeing the same policy that america followed in the 19th century to get rich it has a mixed economy and it uses the Public Sector to subsidize the basic needs transportation Education Health to provide these really so that employers do not have to pay. A high enough price so that they can afford high priced housing like american. I hear the americans cannot acknowledge china is succeeding with a mixed economy which it call socialist but then youd have to call the American Economy socialist we have the government subsidizing. The military sector subsidizing agriculture china is doing exactly what the United States and the United States cant understand china because it would have to acknowledge that it itself is a mixed economy and that is anathema to the academics john is and i want to focus on that one question remember to ask john i want to ask how there in michael later is there a win win scenario as we go into this because the even though the terminology we use trade war is if someone has to win or lose i mean its its such a black and white issue the way its portrayed in the media and i find that that is very dangerous because if its a war someone has to win of course you dont want to lose and it could spread into other areas geopolitics it in the military and which of course none of us want that to go happen so you know is a win win possible here because of the rhetoric coming out of the American Media and the administration they make it sound like you know this is a an existential threat maybe it will be one day but certainly not now go ahead john. Well the chinese come has been very careful of using this war the war i mean the trade war up until the collapse of 11th which is which was set up on a month ago when vice premier little hook came to washington d. C. Ringback and in a negotiation far apart up to the up to that point the china scum in the press in china most of them you know National Media is actually controlled by the government we have never used a war war to categorize whats going on between states and china weve always were talking about you know trade friction but now ive seen the official mention of this world war so i think the Chinese Governments position has changed. That a bit realizing that you know they cant just keep make concessions or concessions some point they have the theres a line they have to join the sands of Gold Ministry of commerce issued a white paper lay out 3 conditions very clearly a force that if were going to reach a deal or have to go back to you know before july last year when the tassel impose order additional have to be gone thats the 1st condition the 2nd issues that. Approaches his commitment china scum and hasnt is going to make doing this train a go she has to be reasonable and and the moderate you know words theres a reach between present she and present chum during the summit meeting argentina in november that china is committed to buying so no months and seems the. The the trade deficit some u. S. Keeps worsening since last november the american side has made additional amount of demand that we have to increase imports from u. S. Chinese come and say this has to be more the 3rd thing is that the force the macas of the talking about in that 150. 00 page document that is the documenting the goetia between vice premier. Asked to eliminate all those things regarding any legislative timetable on the chinese spot chinas government thinks thats a infringe upon their busy infringement upon china sovereignty so these are the 3 issues that have to be resolved and in my opinion that this of women is not so much respect to the substance of the americans concern for what china structure issues or even the trade deficit amount i think its committed even this amount to the stone issue right now is regarding the enforced americans of it or was this Enforcement Matters and doesnt have to be going through legislative avenues they dont have to they have to you can infringe upon china some of the a massive on a monitor that you know words its a very sort. Things stand the test very good point how theyre i mean it was one of the questions that i sent out to all of you here i mean the United States the manning structural changes and how china does business in its own country i mean that is a bit of a reach isnt it i mean it shows a lot of disrespect. To the dominant and submissive country again thats not going to work now i mean like it or not as much as the American Media doesnt understand it china and the United States are roughly peers now ok and you have to start treating it as one go ahead heather well they should be piers i hope so and i dont want to trade war i mean i dont think anyone in the administration wants a trade war but it is our right to point out i think wed all be in agreement that asking china to change things their structural policies for example their state owned enterprises. Is maybe reaching too far like you said i think its a threat to their International Independence and then see it as an infringement on their sovereignty as john rightly point pointed out but the fact is if we are dealing with things that have gone on for decades sense bill clinton helped china to the World Trade Organization in 2001 of stealing intellectual property theft and force joint ventures even though the americans want to do business with china where the 2 largest economies in the world of course the americans want to do business with china we just dont want china to steal billions and billions of stuff from from americans and rip us off but i think this is really americans west and we started back to you as you have started this program talking about this grand paradigm shift and thats really whats going on here im kind of hit and miss you know going to michael and in forest hills i mean its not about intellectual property is the intellectual property theft i suppose there is ok but thats not the the game changer in all of this i think that she was thrown out there its red meat for the media to show that america is a victim ok. Not a victim in all this that basically you kind of trade agreements theyve had with countries around the world since the 2nd world war is all their own fault i do agree that donald trump is doing some really good things and far as trade is concerned and he has to do more but he has to has he has to realize hes not dealing with mexico here is dealing with china go ahead michael well that is a trade war is really in this case a war of economic systems the United States once trying to do what russia did under yeltsin to our turn over its industry to let American Financial institutions come in and really take ownership of Chinese Economic Development so the question is what kind of a planned economy are you going to you know america has a centralized planned economy planned by waltz through china has a planned economy planned by politicians now who do you want to plan your economy american banks in their own interest in the Financial Sector which is creating debt or do you want a non Financial Life plan that hes not an actual industry actual labor actually raising the Living Standards instead so underneath that what they call a parade war is this war of economic systems and a war will the world be multinational multilateral or will it be unilateral that really what it is and what i think you as the guy who has economy go ahead other you know the u. S. Economy is far better off than china i mean in my opinion we have unemployment at the last levels in 50 years 3. 6 percent wages are rising g. D. P. About 3 percent 7000000 job openings i dont think its the same in china right now they have declining exports declining g. D. P. In 2018 the lowest in 28 years and the i. M. F. Is actually downgrading chinas forecasted growth so of course they have the what im saying on the merry go theres a shift in terms of the doesnt have to let them 1st really talk a got everybody hold your breath everybody hold your breath there we go john j. Bin go ahead john. Your stats are wrong chinas g. D. P. Is 6. 4 percent last quarter thats double the United States of chinas exports and i get it going updated all gone not last may the the steps just came out last the dismay of the posse made exports close by 7. 7 percent which the United States there is no last count but was there trying to trade it had a. Tear. To the exports was European Union was in the aussie and thats the south asian Southeast Asian countries theyre going by more than 10 percent so overall you know theres going to be some difficulties i admitted that i mean this this trade or is having. Causing problems here in china and some American Companies og will be a lot of china the publicly moved to vienna philippines malaysia the other companies doing that but let me tell you even if we. Think about the worst and now if we leave how do you write off chinas exports United States thats only representing something between a 1. 00 to 1. 00 but 2 percent of chinas g. D. P. So its something that china scum as we can pair with and then would have to bear with if we go down in a very dangerous path so you know some point divine is not going to make keep make concessions again and ok to be ok john that made. Me want to hang i want to go to heather have there 30 seconds because it was rather lopsided here go ahead heather go ahead well i just i think we had 150 page agreement urged draft of a proposed agreement which we did between the u. S. And china last month. U. S. Treasury secretary said that it was a great agreement i think the vice premier and president xi in china were also very optimistic that a good deal could be reached but somehow overnight the u. S. Trade team saying that china every neck down a lot of the aspects the core issues like currency manipulation force joint ventures and. Electoral property and those were not up for negotiation on the u. S. Side now i dont know if thats true or not because china is pushing back saying that we were asking them to change what you michael and john pointed out and frenching on their own cabinet and theyre here theyre struggling i mean honestly plenty i dont want to you know stuff for us to keep talking about but on different episode of graustark many thanks to my guest in Washington Forest hills and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at our d. C. You next time to remember. You know to the 2017 the german newspaper defense published an article claiming that the European Union that last 30000000000 euros as a result of its very anti russian sanctions. Particularly affected eastern. Many polish vamos went broke and he committed suicide. Sometimes i cant. Get along with. The top on the political front on a. Young team to have to finance my view on the whole so im going just doesnt have as a kind of unknown. And then lets see in the in the polling if the defense won the smiting position. On the stumps with all the faults and thats what. You could. Not face us extradition hearing until next year in america you could face up to 175 years in prison. Through one of the. Suspected attackers. So they were hit by flying projectile apparently contradicting us. Into the mind on the fence. Back at the american allegation accusing the u. S. Of resorting to. Gender stereotypes. 29 percent of british women suffer the