Transcripts For CSPAN2 Harold 20240703

Language their people spoke long, their familys been in the United States can achieve and lord given all the challenges in the country given the interference government in the daily lives americans. This is a resoundingly good story to tell so is a great pleasure for all of us at heritage to have mr. Hamm hear from this speaking about this other southerner is just a pleasure to welcome this rural oklahoman. Harold went work in the oil fields as a teenager and then established continental resources. At the age of 21, he built a grassroots start up into a top ten oil producer and the privately held oil company in United States as a voice for americas oil and natural gas industry, hes helped to make america independent. He cofounded and serves as executive chairman of the Domestic Energy alliance, and he is widely recognized as the person who led the charge lift americas 40 year ban on u. S. Crude oil exports. Vital of course, not just for the men and women in the energy business, but for all of us and for every human on planet. Thats what were going to talk about today. Ill highlight one other aspect of harolds, and then i know he will want to cut to the chase and talk about the book and is that he is very involved in his community. He has been a leader in promoting health, education, energy, industry, advocacy hes devoted much time and, many resources to championing a healthy, secure future for all americans. Having invested and donated in many efforts to find a cure for diabetes, hes also donated the. Capital to start two schools of engineering one at the university of mary in bismarck, north and another at the university of north dakota itself. I spend a lot of time talking about all of the awards that harold has won, and he deserved. But ill just leave with this one, sort of an informal from the heritage foundation, which is that he is a great american, one of the wonderful patriots of this age, because he understands initiative and liberty and the importance of Strong Family and communities before even get to that word government. So would you please me in welcoming our friend harold hamm. Welcome. Thank you. Good to be here with you. Well thanks. You know, against your better judgment, your in the Imperial City of d. C. For a day. But were grateful that you are and youve got a lot of friends in the as i mentioned, harold, we also a large online audience our, friends at cspan are broadcasting this and were just grateful that an everyday american would show up. Here to talk about American Dream. So i grew up, as i told you a little while ago, and a family of roughnecks in lafayette, louisiana, the blue collar side of the business, which you know well to. And so im reading your book. Id finished it last night and i told my wife and kids at dinner i said, this is a book you have to read. And, you know, audience at heritage sort of expect me to say that i really do mean it. It is something that all of you should read. We have copies for you or at least first come, first serve after this conversation. But all of that to say, harold what inspire hired you to write the book at this point in your life . Well, first of all, i felt like it was a story that had to be told. You know, its so misunderstood, so much confusion around it. What did give us the Energy Renaissance in america . We were on a steep decline production both oil and gas has gone downhill and everybody called it terminal. Decline is going to be out. That was it found a fair time to be found and then all of a sudden big upturn in production and oil, gas and. What did that come from . It came from one thing and that was horizontal drilling, the ability to drill down two miles, turn right and go another two miles. Nobody thought of that as a possible nobody in our business thought that was possible. But we did that and that much wellbore did have 12, 15 feet of the reservoir. Suddenly you had two miles, so you had a million times of productive capacity that you had with that reservoir and 1012 feet and it was a game changer all of the all reservoir was an america that had low property and low perm you could turn on with this technology and it did. And you know, the first ever caught on oil field drilled in the world continental was drilled that. And us and one other company was on companies that ever drilled in it and you know we didnt even use any kind of wellbore stimulation. You just drill the world war and that was it. It produced wouldnt produce vertically, but it produced horizontally and it was just a game. Nobody even wanted to participate in this first field. Everybody there was like they bailed off. They had ownership and and the properties up there, well, they farm it out to your sell it to your sons. They wouldnt participate they thought it was money pit. And i wondered if was too when we began. But it turned out. But it was a wonderful story. And, you know, over the next ten years, we tripled american oil and Gas Production and its been have been a wonderful thing and and so many people been involved and and is a story of your family the roughnecks the people that was out there all those Blue Collar Workers that had made it happen that figured out really from iron standpoint from the drillers knowledge how to do that how to how to turn, turn sideways and and, you know, get to go where you wanted or wanted it to go, not the other direction. And so small feet. Yeah. Which no, a small thing without getting hung up in a hole and all those things they endzone you know for miles out there and and make it produce. And so anyway all that had to be told, i knew it had be told. I hope somebody else would tell it but did so finally, if this became incumbent me to do that and it took a long while but put his book and you know you know i feel very humble to be the person that that did that and very glad to have it done glad have it out and i like you i hope a lot of people read it and understand our business so then a lot of despair along the way a lot of that saw what we doing and you know didnt to see that they dont see us come back and with a lot oil and Gas Production now they want to see your just completely go away they want to see the demise of it they want to see the demise of us. They looked at us as conservative business people, which we are for the most part, we cant deny it were conservative business people. We have no problem with that at the heritage foundation. Im not going to apologize for it. No. So and of the along the way, a lot of people sought to disparage downright lie about what we were doing, how we would whats going to end up polluting all the water in the world, you know, is going to do all these bad things, none of which has happened. So i want to ask a question, the business side of things before. Talk a little bit about the for everyday people, the world based on the game. Nature of horizontal drilling and that is the nature of entrepreneurship. I mean, its you got to take risks in order to reap benefits and. The material benefit of entrepreneurship of taking that risk, of course, is money but as youve explained well in the book, its than about money. Well get into that, too. But this is this is a question. It seems as if that when you youre drilling that well using horizontal. Im just going to assume up to that point that was the biggest rescue taken in your life. And how long did it take for you to realize that all capital you invested, you know, you use a poker metaphor, you put all your into the table that you realized this risk is going to pay off . Well, it certainly those first mercury wells, some of which was disastrous. You know, you get hung up on ill you know best the zone did get in so yeah that that just didnt work so lot a lot of were and deal that it took a little while a long long time to do some of this it wasnt easy and people some people did that thats the money pit were going avoid that but there wasnt fashionable to be doing what we were at all so it took some time to answer your question it took some time to realize wealth is were Getting Better at it. Were going to build make this work start out drilling thousand and feed our person sandwich drill and 500 feet person could drill a mile percent wicked could two miles and all the time those economics were changing and getting and we were Getting Better. What we but you know we it was i talk about it in the book talk about crude implement tools that we were use and i call them clunky even you know the belly assemblies and that that we were using and kick off and and turn. 90 degrees and it it was clunky. Yeah. After the invention of mud motors and all these things, it got a lot easier but that came later and had some of the primary Service Providers that we said, you know, we need near bit technology where we stands on we need the Research Done to give us a tool that we need at one of them. Tell me after it goes up four or five of them tell tell them what we needed. One of them took me aside and said, look, hands and you know, im sorry, but this is such a novel idea. Youve here this horizontal drilling said we just cant afford to spend a Research Dollars on it at other risk of Business Innovation right to do much risk. And i said well, ill tell you one thing, were going to use somebody and whoever we theyre going to get all of our business. Its good response urls. I think that was effective. So we did three years later that same guy had to by them to get the technology that they had advanced so anyway then some funny things happened long why some young entrepreneurs in the audience i happen to know and no doubt there are some who are watching online. Theres a lesson there which is to stick to your guns, but also just take this wonderful story that youve told about your business and horizontal drilling and make obvious application that im sure our audience have done to any industry right, which is that one of the things that it seems if culturally, socially also, especially in terms of policy weve gotten away from in the United States is understanding the importance of innovation from individuals from individual companies, the amount of capital it takes to make that work because of the trial and error especially in your business and also that sometimes youre going to fail and thats and the cost of risk. Oil and gas industry is probably the best at exemplifying that the United States that is that that cycle of of boom and bust which certainly growing up in a family of roughnecks i remember well but i want to shift gears only slightly and move from the perspective of of your business and maybe our perspective heritage about amplifying the good work of of great individual corporation. And talk about the impact of horizontal drilling on the quality life not just for americans but for i would posit billions billions of people in the world. Is that a fair yes. Yeah. No, a fair topic for sure. You know, for instance, when we broke the code and in the back and this was a very hard shale and is in north Dakota North Dakota and there was not a not easy thing to do this Montana North Dakota thats really really where it began and in a way it was almost impossible. Break the code and make this produce second chemically at it took a lot of trial error. You mentioned earlier but once we did this was the finest High Quality Oil youre seeing in your life and it had a lot of the metal distillates that you need, particularly for kerosene diesel production and in fact, everywhere body will remember when got so high and it is like for 55 a gallon and anyway that brought on so much of this fuel with the metal distillers that diesel went to 2 to 25 a gallon so half and did it fairly quickly this round 2010 and well that was a huge change because everything up to point a lot of the product that was being refined was the heavy bitumen from canada all the refineries had been outfitted basically to deal with this Endless Supply of Bitumen Heavy Oil from canada but it didnt have much middle distance. So it produced gasoline, but not the middle distance that you need for. And so that along with almost innumerable consequences of the bakken, described discovery, the new innovation has really contributed to alleviating what we call energy poverty. Explain that our audience, who may be some maybe a little less familiar with that. Well, its gone, particularly on the oil side. You know, weve been able to basically get away from dependance on the middle east almost entirely due to what were producing and on a natural gas, even more so. So suddenly you we became almost awash natural gas. And then course the second, third. That part of that is all of the lng that produced as a result of all the natural gas. So for instance, last would have got probably real cold. You know what ukrainian invasion happened by russia and russia cut off supplies to europe had it not been for lng that the us was to ship as told by a friend of mine that. One cargo of lng would heat million home for a month. One that one company ship. Thank you. 638 last winter. So you think that the difference that it can make around the world and this is you know plane burn natural gas if it does same thing in those countries that it did here you know it could offset a whole lot of pollution. America with clean burning natural gas where weve cleaned up our air. We have the cleanest air in the world today. And back to the seventies level of pollution as a result so perhaps wouldnt do on around the world and yet in of the the data on that its just an objective truth about the cleanliness of american natural the american oil and gas has had a difficult unfortunately pennetta this this this image of Wind Turbines solar panels being as pure as the wind driven. Why is that why why have both businesses and im talking about the independent producers, you and even policy groups like heritage while weve had some limited success and talk about that why it been so difficult to penetrate that story. Well, theres a whole, whole nother element, if you will say it like that that, want to see that on because they want that market of generation. So youre saying is about money and its all about money. You have all of the dollars and theres so dollars going out talking about one Solar Company in existence today their market cap is. 10,000,000,000. 90 5 of that revenues from. Have over. 5 of that is from subsidies. Now, you think about that. Where does that come from . Its a its a publicly traded company, right . We all. Yes. Thats all you. Thats right. Thats where it come from. So is it kind of unfair then. You know, weve government weigh in and on that side as well with all the subsidy both for solar and all those things. And, you know, theyve just gone put them in for a while, get them started and thats going to go away right . Wrong. Are still there . Will they be there a long time . Probably. Thats the amazing about government subsidies and government agencies. Its hard to get rid of either of them. Yeah, but were going to keep trying. Herald, ill tell you that one other policy question, if i may, before reading a couple of passages in the book that i think that audience really appreciate and those are more about kind of life principles and that policy question only until recently, i would say only until the last year or so has the relationship between america losing its Energy Independence on purpose. I mean, this is design of the current regime in the white house been connected to the Chinese Communist party, benefiting that. Explain this audience, that connection and why so important from a National Security standpoint for america to have energy . Well, we had just gotten 2000, 19 september, i believe, totally energy independent. You know, we were more than were bringing in. Thats thats what that means. And so. Well celebrate that, right. And your Energy Independence. We dont have to be on anyone. And now suddenly going the other direction with the push on these. Well, youre totally dependent for all the pressures, all the metals that go into them, cobalt, lithium, all those sorts thing. 85 of which come from china for those batteries, right back in a box again for dependance. You know, they it up. They they they own that. So 85 dependance again someone else that you have no control over that probably dont like that. Well and you know that they got their hands on your neck perhaps going yeah. So lets talk a little bit about a couple of passages in the book and then well, well get into some audience. Im going to read a short paragraph here, if you dont mind. This is this is about a clause or passage about its never about the money you write. My why is always about so much more than money. More than 50 years ago, i left one of the best paying union jobs with a Major Company to start a one man, one truck Oilfield Service company. I had what i felt like a ton of debt and what felt like a ton of ambition too. Yet i was fueled by an inner voice that told me i had a destiny. All i needed to do was trust myself and keep my pedal to the metal. Yes, money is a way to keep score and survive, but its never been my reason for being. There are better ways to keep score. You write maintaining purpose in life an abundance of close and a wonderful family tops the scorecard. Mm. Its hard to add to that, but im going to ask you to do that and especially, i mean, for everyone in the audience, we all need to hear this. But Heritage Benefits by, having a plurality of employees who are under or 35. Washington d. C. Capitol hill is dominated by young people. We need more of them in office. Frankly, i know youre not offended by that. But what what what advice would you give to people who are saying, man, harold the American Dream is dead . Yeah. Its simple. Follow your destiny. My destiny. I dont know why, but you know. You know what it is . I did. And it was very simple with me. I could get almost euphoric about. I need to do. I felt at that and, you know you could just get cold chills about. Wow, ill do this. You know and i dont have you know but you it was possible. I knew i could i could do somehow. So somehow somebody that handled my and it had be it and you know hopefully hopefully other people that read that book did the same thing. One of your daughters wrote an afterword to, the book, which in addition to the book, what you wrote is really poignant and im just going to read paragraph here, which is a father daughters i think resonated with me but also having gotten to know you as an acquaintance over the years. I can i can this in you and in a lot of and women who are of your generation who provide lessons for those of us who are younger to follow but this is what she writes that is always understood his purpose on this earth is greater himself. He was raised a strong faith sometimes that guides him still today, something that guides him still today . Not sometimes. He is ultimately a producer. Its the most philanthropic he can do. He doesnt take lightly the responsibility he has to provide for his employees. And through the success of his business and his employees, he have the greatest societal impact. When dad gives back, he does so purpose. A little contribution. Everything doesnt have the same impact as does giving. Back to what . Passionate about. That seems thats a vital part of how you go life. It is. You know, you you know the big things. Try to find things that are mostly that you that you care about really care about. And weve tried to do that. Our Foundation Based had three pillars. You know Energy Advocacy that makes sense. Thats a big one. Education. You know you know that thats what helped me break poverty cycle that our family was in. And so that thats real important. So weve been involved. That, of course. And the other ones help me so much to all of us and some of it is, you know, its kind of easy to feel with some of the main disease areas cancer, heart or whatever, alzheimers even. But the one that i chose, diabetes affects so many people and. Yet it was so unpopular, nobody wanted to deal with it. Nobody want to put money into. You know, there wasnt a procedure attached to it. My doctors lost money, so they dont want to do it either. So, you know, we thought, wow, thats one we need to tackle with hopefully do something about it. And so some im glad we did. When you look at this past year and you know, by making the public aware of some of the unjust things like the three pharmaceuticals that had kept the patent for 100 years, you know, on insulin that was to them for a dollar. But they kept patent by moderating a little bit with the insulin to where they could keep it monopoly up there until we brought that the attention of american public. They give it up but they finally did they finally moderate and got it down to where people could afford it but poor people was having to ration an insulin. Now you think about your for about a month if youre type one we someone were to get by on one or two of those vials. So part of your bodys done. Okay. Thats not a pretty thing but that thats what was going on. And then until harry smith and i got on tv and talked that and made it public. That would have probably continued. Well, god bless you for that work. And its a lesson, too, about how much that industry in particular, the big boys in that industry in particular with government against the healthy quality of life for americans. So thank you for your your courage there. Hopefully wont find a cure so closure. Yeah. Research has gone on. There are a lot of good things happening. And at Oklahoma State university of all places. Is that right . Yeah, were going to say that as a longhorn, you know, a little bit of a jab there. Oklahoma university there, oklahoma city. So oklahoma. Oh, god. And god bless them. So one last question for me, harold. Then well go to the audience. I really love this paragraph. And your book, another trait you write that seems to be to successful people is patients. Ive heard people in my company, theres a clock and then theres ham time. And yes, i like to move quickly tomorrow misses todays possibilities. My colleague diana when she she brought me my copy of the book had tagged and said, kevin, we all here talk about kevin time at heritage here and i really love this and i think weve got to move fast because. The country is on fire, which is why we try to move fast at heritage. But talk to us about ham time, especially people who are, you know, maybe earlier in their careers trying to figure out their daily discipline at work and how you get things done. Well, you know, first of all, to get we need to go. I had a lot of change and do and myself. So personal improvement and so that happened had to happen quickly and then other things in business. You did a really brilliant about a prospect that you really figured out all of a sudden kind of a breakthrough and just know that everybody else is having that same idea. If you dont add up, theyre going to say, ive been beat to some really good ideas. This you know, by a few, few days, few weeks, few hours. So anyway, we tried it and still have time and and are executives and have got a great Leadership Team at continental just terrific. And and what they do and and you know they make it happen and urge day and have time. For that explanation so well get into audience questions. Well take questions both from those of you are here in person and also my aforementioned colleague diana will have some questions coming in from our virtual audience. But we will start with questions here in person. Gentleman all the way in the back row. Just wait for the microphone, if you dont mind. Joe, hi. I thank you so much for coming. Im stern, the director of the Budget Center here at heritage. Im moved by your dedication, the faith and the importance you put in it. I want to ask you what you thought the relationship was between not faith at the individual level, but throughout a Society Creating a society thats driven innovation. And i want to ask if think that the lefts kind of focused attacks on our faith institutions have been part of why weve seen sluggish growth, the last generation and the increasing economic frustration. Hes a smart guy. Yes, matt, ill tell you what, he had about four questions in there. And i was pretty to take you and me about 5 minutes to ask that. Well, first of all, innovation is a great thing. You never know where itll come from, but, you know, whether its a simple things like we did and by being out there that working on a rig and tell from drill standpoint and you know that absolutely the innovation has driven america you know the you take this far we did you know it is driven much of the economy by i a couple Million People to work you know so its been big tax policy apps you know weve seen all kind of Different Things occur with policy and it can drive it up it can also drive it down and you know, too much taxes piled business that can get to the point that it drowned in and discouraged people, all the entrepreneurs and anybody from taking a and risk and provide all the growth and growth. So good question. Exactly right. Thank you. Yeah, great. Great exchange. Thanks for that response, harold. Diana microphones coming your way, maam. This question is from pouliot of the Energy Policy foundation. Among many in u. S. Government, there is a that hydraulic fracturing was the of Government Research and the department of Energy Project funding. What is your perspective on that . Okay. And the question was, theres some theory that it was Government Research created hydraulic fracturing. Your response . Well, there means a limited amount of Government Research that. People used. I think George Mitchell talked about what he you know, how he used some funding under some grants ideally to improve fracturing technology. Within barnett shale. And he did. I know for a fact that he did. Im familiar with that. Basically, they were working with vertical wells. And i think of us in the industry had known that you could get gas from shales. In fact we had perforated some highly shallowly sands that really didnt produce from the sands but we got some shale gas as a result. But george through those kept working with shales to produce gas economically from the barnett from some vertical wells. And i know that happened. The real breakthrough who came when devon bought Mitchell Energy and their Properties North texas and started work on worth horizontal in the barnett. And that really really a key to turn on that development. And and it became big production a huge growth and production huge growth in production. And came from that so Larry Nichols and his crew did a great job. I think may have drilled a few horizontal wells there before larry bought that. But primarily it was. So anyway, the that government brought this Energy Renaissance i heard obama take full credit for. You all that President Biden cured cancer last. Anythings possible we we talked to obama go and disown. We talked to obama. I want him to know. Just for sure that horizontal drilling very well could give us energy in america. And so in a casual gathering by the giving pledge, people made sure that he knew. And he told me, said, well, he said secretary chu has told me that there are going to invent a battery thats going be the key to transportation future. So anyway, that was his response. In the next five years, you write the over 2012. Okay, we could just talk these claims the left has made about environmental destruction and this battery, which seems like such a fiction. But well move on. I will take question on this side. So, gentlemen, there, microphones coming your way. Keep your. There you go. Keep your hand raised. Hi. Chris knight with argus media. You reportedly told former President Donald Trump that you wouldnt be supporting him this election cycle, that and that youre donating instead. Ron desantis and nikki haley. What caused you to make that decision . And have you had any discussions with desantis or haley about Energy Policy that you particularly appealing that made you want to support them . Its been several. People write about the conversation that ive had with mr. Trump and my concern is, you know, that his elective ability in the general and and turn attention to that to see to make sure that we wind up same place we did last time have as close guess whos going to win like they last time. Man, ive been on quite fair but thats what happened. Well leave that up to their body, their own opinion. But anyway, thats what i talked to him about was know, whats he going to do to, you know, make, make that he can win the general. If they if he if he wins a primary, you have to have to turn attention to the the general election. So that was that was my concern that i discussed with him. They would discuss it that he, you know, with his base, hes got a powerful base that perhaps he could play the role of kingmaker, you know, help somebody else through the use of his base of support. So weve had several conversations and people have talked about. Thank you. Thank you, gentlemen. There on that side. Okay, mr. Ham, thank you very much for coming. Thank you. Looking at the early days of the industry and the whole revolution you were bringing about, what were some of the initial inklings that your thesis was correct. What did you see . And was it a question of seeing what the initial results, what you saw as possible or was it a question of appreciating significance . So its a question of taking advantage of, something that you see. And was it a question of appreciating what you or the significance of what you saw. Good. I thought about it as i look back upon it all these years later. First of all, i was also impressed by what i was seeing in the industry at that time. Know surrounded by a a lot of different people that ive ever been around. And just my initial research into it. How much it had it had contributed, you know, to the overall growth of oklahoma. And that thats where and gel what what it could do and the future i think was well just felt like it was fantastic. I want to be a part of it so i think is a bit of both of those things. So good question. Thank you for probably just vital in addition to your own knowledge and gut instincts to have a team around you, which i know is another another principle of yours and successful leaders. But love that question. Diane, i know youve got virtual question for us. Its difficult to understand the massive preoccupation and commitment to net zero 2050, which yields very high costs and little environmental benefits, domestic oil, Gas Production is a primary instrument of Wealth Creation and national for the United States. Can you explain the misplace focus on net zero. Well, i dont know the name, but i explain all of it. Harold had zero emphasis thats out there. A lot of people just get caught up in it and make statements that were going to be net zero and 30 or 40 years and try to get there some, people are serious about it. You know, its a its possible to both. But in instances to be net zero offset completely theres like the project that were involved in with the Carbon Capture from ethanol plants, an underground sequestration of that carbon which would than offset our production. So yeah you could be net zero and you know, think, wow, that here you are the oil Company Helping the Agriculture Community and why did you do that . As obvious question, because theres right thing to do as the right thing to do is to dampen all that carbon up that is going on today. Why not captured . Why not sequester it underground . You know, which site for thousands fewer . Great question. Yes, maam. And the front microphones going to come down your way momentarily. We might see any putting your name in. Okay, helen, to plead scare the Global Management partner, the group, mr. Roberts, thank you so much for hosting was truly amazing and mr. Ham you mentioned youre not money what was your mission to take the company private. This is one side of the question second is how can those of us who truly believe in your mission to really carry the truth and help destroy the lies and all the false flare about shale industry and energy and abundance . How compelled those are currently misled because there is so lies particularly among the Young University campuses. How can we become a part of your effort for the Domestic Energy producer this alliance . Because i know you need a lot of help. Okay. Thank you. Well, first of all, i talk about the going private. You. Yeah, we had served our purpose to be a Public Company when we went public in 2007. And we knew we was onto something huge there in the bakken and and the only way we could develop that to have a big influx influx of capital. And so we could we could do that by going public, selling part of the company to the public and we did that. And thats why we went we and you got paid to be part of a Companies Back the the multiple for instance value was 8 to 9 times. Yeah you know the for avatar for the rings. We werent private one you no longer got paid for it after covid 19. Suddenly your valuation were down to three or four times in and people can had. And thats another important reason for writing this book right now have only got sort well along gas country. You know no need for me more right or wrong so and the valuation got down to three or four you didnt get paid the public can go through the headaches of being being a Public Company so we were we bought back the 16 . We didnt own and so it was Pretty Simple which gave us about 20 more time to run the company, which is huge. So that was a good thing in that regard. So the last part of her question on that. So like, oh, how can yall help . Yes. Yeah, can how could this . Because i each of us is a stakeholder. This issue. Absolutely. It is false and its done in beginning in the public domain. So how can we become engaged, for example, in the udp in order to make sure that, we can strengthen your and actually deliver message and return return the minds to the right place. Yeah, ill restate that for. The audience especially online. Great question. Thank you. It is great question. How can we help a stakeholder especially given the aforementioned narrative is sort of overrun the truth, the reality, the situation . Good question. Absolutely. Thats a terrific question. Every one of us has a stake in this game. Every one of us can be a player. You know, you need to voice your opinions. Diane, such a good example here on front row. You have a great testimony about the industry. And you know what it what it is, what it means and know the reality of the situation. Every one of us plays such a big very i see im back there with depo you know out there every day writing articles, writing, doing the news different, things about the reality of Energy Industry in america and what what is right and whats wrong and and sometimes its too hard to gather all the detail of that last policy thats passed by the folks dont like you, you know, and and the impact that its going to have on a consuming public that dont even know about it, you know, that they slide in under the guise of some or the other. So each one of us being the guard and weighing in every chance you get with your neighbors, you know, talking to the folks in your sphere of influence is so important, you know, to be a be part of that. So thank you and ill piggyback on very briefly heralds obviously the expert but from the standpoint of just messaging on policy, im often confronted the question that diana, our other colleagues who work on Energy Policy from people who say in circle of friends no wants to hear this story and i think using good rhetoric, which usually a question, not a leading question, you want to establish a good rapport with someone whos skeptical. And theres a lot of skepticism about the reality on this issue, as you know. But in order to ask the good questions that lead to a good conversation, you have to be based on facts. And thats where diana and our team and there are obviously other people in the audience, people who arent here who do a good job of that. But thats the key thing is, is to have those three or four or five facts that, probably people who are innocently buying into an ill intentioned narrative dont know because our schools terrible, especially on this issue and other issues this by the way is why we have to end the Us Department of education. I told my colleagues at heritage every time we do an event in of the topic, im mentioning that until its all right. Diana, do you have a virtual for us . Yes microphones coming your way. Thank you. What do we need to do to educate the public about the dangers of china and losing Energy Independence to a country thats not to us, especially after russia, just cut off the oil. Europe. Well, it should obvious now with, you know, this last example how how important our National Secure is and Energy Independence gives us that and we cant fritter that away, but china, you know, they they have their own deal and their deal is not your deal. You know, this is a communist and. Let me tell you, they theres steeped in communism and its not democracy at all. Those people are oppressed. You know, its a its not a good situation by any any imagination and any any time we think there are fringe look out that its going to be too bad so its many of us have been duped by that for about ten. Yeah, were here weve been duped and we certainly have. And z is you know hes meet with the wrong folks. Hes supporting the wrong folks. You know, hes an anarchist and hes not our type type people at all. So, by the way, anyone interested. Yes. Thanks for the response. That great question. No one interested in this should go to a paper that almost all of my policy colleagues at heritage had a hand in thats winning the new cold war with china. A substantial part of that is what we on on Energy Policy. All right. Time for a question here. Yes, sir. Could you please comment a bit on the appalachian. What was the real fundamental business up opposition in and the impact of finishing it. Were talking about consumers and you know that benefit of all consumers get this pipeline in and certainly those people that are on propane or other fuel said that need this natural gas so. Well politically thats why were shut down you all the lawsuits sierra club everybody said that shut this down because they didnt want it complete but it goes back to a fundamental thing that theyve figured out have been has been something in prague progress a long time about how to how to close down oil and gas altogether and if they could do it through pipelines. I dont care if its natural gas or crude oil or whatever. Eliminate our ability to get our product to market. Well, then they put you out of business. So thats what it really comes down to. And and then had an administration that wouldnt stand up for the letter of the law and go ahead push it through because you know thats a lawful thing that these folks theyve made application called a law and theyll have a all now thats its unfortunate with all the things same thing and the north dakota was crude oil on has finally passed but took a long time and and it hurts consumers it hurts a consignment public you know it holds up prices of product and those interludes consumers really really are are young lady had a question well go there before we take a virtual question from diana. Thank you. Hi, karen harnett. Im probably from oklahoma and i thank you for what youve done for our state. I wanted to ask, though, we just talked about the pipeline and the regulators that when you were doing Innovative Technology were there regulated roadblocks you experienced then or were you ahead of the regulators when you were doing this . Good question. And yeah, there was a lot of roadblocks. Mean, you you know, the whole world and all oil fields everywhere in the world, north or montana or even oklahoma, that basically was set up for vertical wells, spacing units. And so youd have 40 acres as and for a wall or 80 acres basin gas or whatever they. Suddenly in to drill a long lateral horizontal you 1280 acres spacing for for those units and and so we had doubters our camps that youll never get that done but we did we we a wonderful north Dakota Commission and in montana had a an Energy Commission there for oil and gas that saw need for it and changed the spacing. And so we did it it really kind systematically and got it it done okay and its work beautifully and well and its such a boon to. Landowners, royalty, owners, you know you see these people that their first 6 million not a bad deal. So it worked wonderfully well of the toughest state to get a long lateral horizontal bill was actually oklahoma so we had some small operators that we all came and and opposition to it and we worked five years to get that changed but finally did and and now you know oklahoma has done as well with production it sometimes you just have to have faith work the system and get it done unless you have opposition from like in new york for instance when Governor Cuomo decides that theres not to be any horizontal drilling and in new york. So we have landowners joined or neighbors, brothers in pennsylvania, these brothers in pennsylvania, got these brothers in new york, didnt get anything. Which is unfair, unfortunate, not so anyway. Very good question. Dana, you get the last question. Thank you. Your company, pioneer had a horizontal drilling and a hydraulic fracturing making America Energy independent. Why havent other done the same . Is it that they lack the geological formations . Is it that they lack the technology or is it regulatory burdens . Why dont other countries want to copy United States in this manner. A good question. And other other countries do want to copy it, but we we have the americas great. I just tell you right now, its its a great nation. We have Land Ownership that do you own the subsoil surface. If you own the surface that has what it was and so theres great the other other neighbors some other nation a lot other nations you dont have that situation so governor can talk to you and so you have these political laws so socioeconomic political decision made that that that wont let them develop it. Id like in for instance theres a back and look a lot and then and basin can you develop that. No you know the french government owns the the subsurface and you know some of them dont that happen and so theyre they are and not doing it well theres other nations that have similar situations you know that as great in argentina instance theres a huge what would be a huge horizontal play and thats saying some development thats taken forever to get it done because of Government Intervention so thats thats primary purpose and the combination americas Natural Resources men women with initiatives its like their new Education System its unique. Daniel webster one on one, his quote was us go forth and develop nations resources. Still hangs and the chambers of congress and so the very wise decision everything natural come from the earth all gas does well well one bit of housekeeping before we wrap up so when we conclude here in a little bit harold has very graciously agreed to sign books that weve got dozen books out there, first come, first serve. I that youll live by the rule of and not rush out there like mad men and whatever. Its america, after all, youre here and and also so in addition to the book thats out there for you we believe in and feeding you sustaining your energy so theres theres lunch out there most importantly one of the most important parts of culture at heritage is just the camaraderie taking some time and visiting especially amid all these challenges we have so avail yourself of all of those things and and thank you for being part of this those of you who joined online. Thanks for for joining online but most of ill conclude by saying to the one one of the great patriots of our age, mr. Harold hamm, thank you for being here. All right. My name is patrick marks. Im the proprietor of the green arcade bookstore, which is across street. On market street, you may have been there. Thank you. This is not about me or green arcade. Its about sea change and chin