Transcripts For CSPAN2 Hearing Examines Law Enforcement Challenges 20170517

Local from his face before a house judiciary subcommittee. This is an hour and 50 minutes. The sum committee will come to order. We will declare a recess of the subcommittee at anytime. We welcome everyone to todays hearing on the challenges faced in Law Enforcement in the 21st century. I recognize myself for an Opening Statement for a matter of quick personal indulgence. I would ask everyone to please remember our friend and colleague, tom tillis north carolina. I want to thank everyone for being here today. I want to thank chairman for this hearing. This week we celebrate National Police week and thats important to all the members of the subcommittee that we have a hearing to honor all Law Enforcement officers. I want to extend a special thank you to our witnesses for being here. We have with us to canterbury, my own personal chief, and director of Public Safety, Alonzo Thompson from the great city of spartanburg, south korea from Los Angeles County sheriff department. [inaudible] is that close . Forgive me. Im from South Carolina. I may get it wrong before i get it right again. From the great city of houston, texas. Each of you here today and each of our Law Enforcement across the nation dedicate your lies in their life to the precept which girds our country and that is respect for and adherence to the rule of law. I know every member in the subcommittee and member of congress would have your personal story about how officers have impacted their lives and would have their own personal testimony to the respect they have that women and men of lawenforcement. I know as i was preparing for this hearing, my mind went to an officer in greenville, carolina about alan jacobs. Alan about this time last year, maybe a little bit more than last year, learned he was going to be a father again but this time it was going to be different, he had two boys and this time he was going to be a father of a little girl. Life had prepared alan, very well to be a father. He was an outstanding student and he was a great athlete in greenville, salina. He put that athleticism and intelligence to work for our country and the United States army. He was deployed to iraq for 15 months and volunteered to live in the neighborhoods of baghdad because he understood all people want to live in a peaceful insecure environment. After iraq, allen was deployed to haiti because he wanted to add help the haitian people in the aftermath of their earthquake. But the tide of fatherhood was strong and it so strong that alan decided to return to the upstate of South Carolina but his desire to serve and protect remains. He let left the army and put on the uniform of the greenville state department. He pursued that calling with the same vigor and same strength and the same professionalism that epitomized every other facet of his life. Whether it was service on the swat team and his patrol officers. Alan would stop his patrol car from time to time and he would shoot basketball with the kids that could use a father figure and would provide to his kids and daughter. I learned all of this i learned of all of this from a phone call i had with his mother two days before his funeral. This man that survived iraq and haiti and boot camp and the Police Officer training could not and did not survive that encounter. The gang member that had just been released from jail. He never even had a chance to un holster his service weapon. He served prevent and detect and he was ambushed. His funeral gave all of us in South Carolina an opportunity on his life but chief thompson and the life of jason harris. We just lost in his own department. Responding to a call for backup from one of his fellow officers. [inaudible] any of the officers in the upstate of South Carolina. They gave the most precious thing they gave today to protect the most precious thing we have. Which is life. Law enforcement officers are willing to do what most of us are not willing to do and theyre willing to interact with people that most of us are not willing to interact with. They are willing to miss things in life that most of us are not willing to miss. Today we are honoring you and were here to listen and hear in part to memorialize those officers who lost their lives in the line of duty but also to respect and pay honor to those who are still with us. I want to thank you for being here. I am most interested in how we can help you do your jobs. The challenges are in our criminal Justice System and i want a system that is not only respected but worthy of respect and theres not a system we have in our country that cannot be improved. I am more than willing to hear ideas on how to improve it. There is Something Different about Law Enforcement officers and if we lose that sight of that as a society that not only do they wear a uniform and badge but they serve symbolically as a line to a law and order and those folks that are in not in good conscience. If we ever lose sight of that we are in trouble as a republic. I think all your witnesses and i look forward to hearing from you eric buys the gentleman from texas. Mr. Chairman, thank you for your courtesy and to the witnesses, thank you for your courtesy as well. I was in a Leadership Meeting and i thank you for recognizing or at least accepting my apologies for my delay. This is a very important hearing and as the chairman has indicated it is important that we try to help each other. Law enforcement and community. I want to acknowledge sheriff mcdonald, chief Alonzo Thompson, mr. Chuck canterbury, and chief arts for your presence here today. I want to say to you that we acknowledge in this week those who lived and those who have fallen. We need to ensure that those who live recognize that we never want to see any more tragedies and families not seeing their loved ones come home. In particular, i want to acknowledge persistent Clinton Greenwood of Harris County office who is literally executed and died on a fourthree train. Deputy sheriff Harris County died on 82815. Detective jerry wanner died on january generous 17 and five officers these among others in dallas who died july 26, Sergeant Michael smith, senior corporal lauren ahrens, officer patrick and officer michael. I went to that memorial and stood with those family members and we will never forget. It is important in todays hearing to explore the challenges and seek strategies to modernize and our Law Enforcement practices and policies. In order to increase police safety, nationwide and preventing the use of lethal force against a noncitizen and selfless Law Enforcement officers. We are going to make sure that we look at both sides of the issue and in particular we want to hear from you about Building Trust and respect. We want to understand what has been used from many in authorization and how we can balance the protection of the Community Needs with the various assets that you utilize. The need for responsible and comprehensive data, i believe, data is the science of police work. Then, of course, to be able to deal with the question of lethal force in protecting your life and those of the community. As judge learned hand and said if we are to keep our democracy better must be one commandment, thou shalt not ration justice. So, today i look forward to hearing from you as well. In keeping with this idea of justice, just want to make a point, chairman, that i made before and that is this full committee, we are the subcommittee on crime, as the judiciary commissioner in the senate, subcommittee led by our esteemed senator, senator lindsey graham, we must have a full investigation and demand an investigation of the president , the attorney general and Top White House aides, democrats on the oversight and the Judiciary Committee are asking for all memorandums that deal with the ending of the tenure of doctor comey and the allegation that the president asked director comey to end the Flynn Investigation and certainly, the release of classified information recognizing that the president can release classified information but what jeopardy has been put assets and the Intelligence Community and and of course, our allies. I read into the record that we are concerned that the continued failure of House Republicans to take action in the face of this onslaught allegations will cause significant damage to the base of the American People have and the credibility and integrity of our committee and the house of representatives. We have a solemn obligation under the constitution to act as a check on the executive branch and told the President Trump accountable. Again, not as democrats and republicans but as americans. It is time that we Work Together to be able to find the truth and obviously, the truth will be our guide. I think all of you for your service and your commitment to law and order and to the constitution. And for the service that we will never be able to thank you for as you protect the American People. I thank you so much. I yelled back. We have a very distinct panel today. Ill begin by swearing in our witnesses. If you will, rise and raise your right hand. The test test your about to give will be the whole truth, and and nothing but the truth. The witnesses answered in the affirmative. Let the record be known. I will ask you individually for your opening theme. Ill tell you on the front and that all members will have access to your Opening Statements and all the members have access to your Opening Statements so if you could summarize it and get the salient points within the five moment time point that will allow for more time for questions. Our first witness is sheriff mcdonald. He is the sheriff of los angeles california. Welcome, share. Our second witness is chief Alonzo Thompson. He is not just the chief, he is the director of Public Safety to me. In the district that ive absent in spartanburg, South Carolina. Hes exceptionally well regarded and respected in my hometown. Arthur witnesses mr. Chuck canterbury is a National President of internal order of police and i will allow ms. Jackson me to introduce our port witness. Our port witness is no stranger to one person. Were delighted with his service in the city of houston. He is a chief who is an active member, nationally in Law Enforcement issues and has served from california to texas, most recently in the city of austin. Now serves as the chief of police in houston, texas and i offered to say that we have a very collaborative effort on Law Enforcement and im very pleased to say that the chief will work with our Law Enforcement from federal to local to ensure the appropriate safe travels of houstonians and those who visit our great city. It is a delight to welcome chief art. Im also delighted to welcome family members. If any family members are here, i see smiling in the second row. I want to acknowledge them as well because theyre so very important to our Law Enforcement officers. I yield. And i want to acknowledge the Ranking Member. You will recognize for your Opening Statement. Sorry about that. Determine gaudi, Ranking Member jackson lee and singers members of the subcommittee, thank you for letting me testify. As sheriff of the largest county in the United States and is a peace officer for more than 35 years it is an honor to represent the sheriff was sworn to protect more than a hundred Million People across our great nation. Policing in america has never been more complex because we are the First Responders to some of americas greatest social challenges whether it is the growing opioid epidemic, the emerging threat of cyber terrorism, homegrown extremism and the growing prevalence of Mental Illness across our nation these are the 21st century challenges we should and must meet together. I submitted written testimony that expands on what i can share here due to time but it is available on the website. I will, however, touch briefly on a number of critical topics. As friday cyber attack that attempted to strike a hundred and 50 countries to make it Crystal Clear about how vulnerable we are and the potential scale that such an attack can have. These are complex threads that often lurked just beneath the surface of todays news headlines. Often they become known only after the imminent threat of a pending attack is made or worse. These are threats that challenge our government and bureaucratic institutions yet adaptive in our solutions and in our collective response. There is in a sheriffs apartment in this nation that immune to the impact of Mental Illness and drug addiction. The d installer to slice of the mentally ill that occurred in the 60s and 70s have turned our jails and prisons into de facto Mental Health hospitals. My deal system in Los Angeles County is in light nations largest Mental Health institution. 70 of the inmates process into our jails report a medical or Mental Illness. Nearly one third of my jail population numbers from one some Mental Health issue. On any given day upwards of 5000 inmates need treatment for their illness. That population is forecasted to double over the next ten years. And la county will need to invest more than twopoint to billion dollars in a new consolidated correctional Treatment Facility that can provide the Mental Health and medical services for this population which has nowhere else to go. Los angeles county jail along with Rikers Island complex in new york city and the Cook County Jail in chicago are the top three largest Mental Health providers in the nation. This is a failure of our criminal Justice System nationwide. There are times when jail is the best and most appropriate option , yes. But its our experience that jail is frequently, not the best solution. As a nation we have a critical need and a moral obligation to build the capacity for Treatment Options in our communities. We have the ability to support Strategic Partnerships with our Mental Health and social agencies provide the kind of treatment for services that can stabilize these individuals and keep them out of our deal system have a professional obligation to provide training for our officers of whom too much is expected. Too often our deputies arrived at a call for Service Always facing the unknown and frequently facing a situation where theyre asked to take on the role of a Mental Health professional. In Los Angeles County alone and areas placed by the sheriffs department, 911 calls involving people with Mental Illness have grown 55 since just 2010. We need to find and provide crisis intervention training to all First Responders both Law Enforcement and fire personnel. We have the ability to divert the individual away from the criminal Justice System and into proper Mental Health Treatment Facilities in 99 of the encounters. The third step is diversion. I like to thank you for passing the national stepping up diversion. We should also look at dedicated Mental Health course. You could recommend Better Options for those suffering from Mental Illness other than jail or prison. Lastly, we need to have an adult conversation about what to do with those suffering from Mental Illness that do end up in the couple Justice System in our jails and prisons. We as a nation can agree that not everyone suffering from Mental Illness or other disabilities can be diverted. Some individuals who are classified as a harm to themselves or others will end up in our jails. We need to provide the most humane and safety setting for them so they can get the treatment and help they need. The nsa seeks to be a positive source of ideas. We look for to continuing the dialogue and working with you. We can be successful must we as a nation are committed to finding solutions. I think the chairman first commitment to collaboration and willingness to engage in local Law Enforcement on the issues that are critical to all of us. Thank you. Thank you sheriff, chief thompson. The morning. Chairman and members of the House Committee on the judiciary subcommittee on crime, terrorism, Homeland Security and investigations, im honor by the invitation. The challenges faces the Law Enforcement the 21st century are numerous and varied on whether its a local state or federal entity. Gangs, illegal narcotics, cyber crimes, social media, Behavioral Health and safety issues this is not an allinclusive list by any means. In addition to those, there is a three matters that need immediate attention especially at the local level. Community police relations, recruitment and retention, and budgetary restraints. Our ability and capacity to respond appropriately and effectively to the aforementioned concerns are dependent on how we managed the three foundational issues. Highly publicized please citizen contacts have gotten attention of our nation. Citizens are interested on how Police Departments are operated. And now more than ever questions about please accountability, training, and Organizational Culture are commonplace. As a result of intense scrutiny, improve Community Relations is paramount. Even agencies such as mild that have traditionally valued and focused efforts on Community Engagement must strive to strengthen those relationships and build new ones. We will not be as responsive or successivsuccessful without strg partnerships. With baby boomers retiring intricate applicant pools, recruitment and retention is a struggle for lawenforcement today. The dangers of the profession and harsh scrutiny discourage some from entry while others pursue most lucrative, less stressful, unsafe or career fields. Retention has been negatively impacted by tightening budgets that resulted in stagnant wages, increased costs of employee benefits, unlimited performancebased incentives of special skills pay. This segues into the third and final challenge, budgetary restraints. In a climate where government bodies are plagued with lingering economic woes and are forced to make difficult decisions about budgets, many Police Departments are underfunded. Consequently it has become increasingly difficult to compete with Corporate America for qualified applicants and retain experienced personnel. Were also face in the growing necessity to advanced technology. For example, body cameras, less than legal weapons, integrated management. However, in the 21st century these are not niceties, they are indeed necessities. For instance, many lawenforcement agencies committed to equip officers with body cameras which expanded opportunities for opportunit ofo capture the critical encounters but the Technology Comes at the cost. Additional money from governmental sources will be needed not only for equipment, but for training that enhances the diversity consciousness of lawenforcement professionals such as implicit bias, deescalation, use of force, and other subject matters be necessary. Although specific needs may vary, the challenger limit is the same. In conclusion, i reiterate these issues must be immediately addressed, enhance Community Relations is fundamental for local Law Enforcement together information and proactively combating crime and terrorism. This includes Building Community partnerships to solve an array societal problems. Recruiting professionals at the local level will ensure we have a highly trained and experienced workforce to provide Police Related services and conduct investigations whether they of all criminal activity, terrorism, or somewhere between the two. We need enhanced capabilities to handle Current Issues as efficiently as possible. I give us the time we need to look for an toward the future to anticipate and prepare for new crime and emerging opportunities. Again, i appreciate the opportunity to share my views on the challenges facing Law Enforcement in the 21st century. I thank you very much for your time. Thank you chief. Good morning mr. Chairman, Ranking Member, and distinguish matters of the subcommittee. I am here this morning representing 300 30,000 members of our lawenforcement community. I would like to take the opportunity t2 thank you for having the hearing at this opportunity time with National Police week concluding. Today my members are concerned about their safety. According to a recent fbi report analyzing 50 cases in which officers were shot and killed, 20 of the assailants were motivated by hatred for police or for social political reasons. Others were now to get justice until difference in families or members to use social media to communicate their intent to hurt officers. We have long argued that hateful, and amplified social media is leading to violence directed at lawenforcement officers. I think this report bears that out. Our views of lawenforcement as a society has changed in the past few years. The respect we once had in our communities and amongst our elected leadership is greatly been diminished. A recent gallup poll showed that Police Officers were 77 excuse me, a 77 Approval Rating in this country. Every american that looks at lawenforcement officer should look at him as somebody that is there to defend their life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness. Unfortunately with social media and the media, excessive force, terms like active stupidly and Police Brutality have become a common term. Another persistent false narrative recycled in the news is the militarization of lawenforcement. Mr. Chairman, i summit it is more modernizing. The Previous Administration ignored the input of lawenforcement community and imposed broad restrictions of federal equipment programs. Throughout the program created by president clinton many basic equipment items were provided to the promise i cannot afford those. It was huge and harmful overreaction to negative Media Coverage and the fake militarization narrative. The 1033 program administered by the department of defense was singled out for specific criticism, but the executive order impose new prohibitions and restrictions on equipment or other federal government including the doj and Homeland Security. I dont need to point out that the postnet shooting, the San Bernadino shooting, many of that equipment was utilized to protect Police Officers lives in citizens lives. These are not militarized vehicles, as a matter fact, they are demilitarized. We are working with the new administration to restore the integrity of these programs and urge the subcommittee to consider hr 46, the protecting lives using surplus equipment act. The need to restore these programs and provide assistance to state local enforcement is not just limited to equipment. The administration of the opposite of Community Orienting policing needs to be funded fully as it has been in the past years. We have less police on the streets today in recruitment and retention is one of the Biggest Challenges facing lawenforcement the 21st century. There are less men and women policing and Violent Crimes on the rise in many of our cities. For this reason, i urge the subcommittee to support fully funding the Cops Hiring Program and the edward byrne memorial and justice grant programs. These programs have been a godsend to local Law Enforcement and in these challenging economic times, state local Law Enforcement officers cannot perform their duties without these extra funds. Mr. Chairman, i spoke about the challenges facing our profession as a whole. Offers when officers are expected to be mentally healthy and resilient. The job in situations we must respond to take a toll on the Mental Health of an officer. Officers responded to a shooting who have lived through things like the attacks in dallas and baton rouge and responded to an event like sandy hook of the postnet club may need to be dealing with these expenses. That is why we are very pleased that senator donnellys basic seven bill passed in the senate yesterday. They helped craft that legislation as well as hr 228 that has been introduced in the house. This bill will allow the attorney general to work with the department of defense and veteran affairs to collect information about mental programs provided to officers and will expand officer wellness. During this week, National Police week where we honor 234 american heroes who passed away last year, this is a very appropriate time for congress to take up these issues. Mr. Chairman, thank you for the opportunity to be here today. I like to point out that as of last night, we lost our 18th officer by gunfire, which put us at 6 higher than the rate last year. Today, we have had 95 officer shot in the line of duty, 18 of them have perished. Thank you mr. Canterbury. I want to thank you for inviting me to testify here today. Ip before you said police chief of houston. The fourth largest city of the nation. It is my privilege to speak to on behalf of the Police Association where im first vice president. This organization represents the 69th Largest Agency in the United States. The police chief to major cities over the past ten years with a total of 31 years of lawenforcement experience, i can say without qualified certainty, that building strong bonds with communities is what makes lawenforcement agencies successful. A respectful relation enables us to regain the community stress. In order to build strongly relationships. Community engagement bills correctly builds trust and when something goes wrong, which is inevitable, the committee knows the departments leadership will adjust the problem honestly and openinopenly. One of the challenges we face is Building Trust among the communitys immigration of enforcement. Recently s before tes passed in texas which opens lawenforcement to the perception of being immigration agents. Immigration enforcement officers if were seen as that hurts the bonds of trust rebuilt over the past many years. Immigration enforcement is a federal function that cannot be delegated to city Police Departments, immigrant communities began to fear Police Officers when they become too heavily involved in immigration enforcement. They stop reporting crimes and it increases victimization on immigrant communities. It makes the entire Community Less safe. Re engagement must include his every one of the Police Department. We urge congress as we been urging for many years now to an act conference of Immigration Reform once and for all. So this hodgepodge reporter starting in arizona moving to texas. Recruitment and retention, chief brown nailed it after the dallas tragedy when he said, call upon young men and women instead of protesting to put on the signs and come in and sign up. Make a difference. Join the Police Department. Join us and see that we can will continue to make a difference. Thanks to his call, 344 increase occurred in the recruitment and the city of dallas. Large cities like houston are cash strapped and constant battle for staffing and resources. We are hundreds of officers short as amir has stated time and again. Adding more Unfunded Mandates such as immigration does not help. We need to maintain funding. One of the things that we hope is my colleagues have said, is that the cops office continue to have full funding, grants, any grants, federally funded grants are key. Also, protect asset for temperature. When they are taken from criminals and criminal syndicates, drug Traffic Organization and placed in the hands of Law Enforcement, it is money that is put back in the Crime Fighting and keeping our community say. Having said that, we should not allow the departments to take money from people unless there really is criminal predicate and were taking from kirk senate hardworking americans. Consent decrees, while they have a good value we hope that as they move forward that will be the hammer that is left is a last resort. That we move towards a variety of memorandum agreements. Most officers there are times where police were can be violent and ugly. There are often times where we do not do the right thing. We have to maintain the trust of the folks that we serve, and we believe a collaborative approach with the department of justice and memorandum of agreements takeoffs the monitor that has become a Cottage Industry where millions of dollars should be spent on training, equipment, and accountability at the local level in place at the hands of the mayors, and ultimately the community at the local level the department of justice. Not to waste it and give it to federal monitors it has become a Cottage Industry. I have more information on that in here. We need strong oversight of support that. We want to be smart and not waste the precious dollars. I would urge members of congress to work on issues to help build communities of trust, bridges of trust, not tear down those bridges. Thank you. Thank you. The chair now recognizes the center from ohio. Thank you mr. Chairman. I apologize in advance if i leave after my question. Im chairman of Small Business community and we have a meeting at 11 00 a. M. I have to cheer that. I will be here long enough to ask questions. Thank you for your testimony. If i could go to sheriff mcdonnell and chief thompson first. The same question. I think you had both mentioned the body worn cameras, could you touch upon both a positive said the concerns that a local Police Department has when youre considering whether to go towards body cameras . Thank you for the opportunity. A number of issues need to be addressed when the department is looking at the plane body worn cameras. Those include not only the hardware which is the cheapest part of the equation, but everything that goes behind that. That would include the ability to be able to retain on either cloud or server the video. Theres tremendous amount of video when the cameras rolling all of the time. Behind that is the policies in place in the agreements with the da and others as to when you are going to release the footage and when you will hold it as part of an investigation. That needs to be covered up front with the publics expectation and be realistic. On the other side is the personal cost. The amount of discovery that is created as a result of having the camera footage. Its an inordinate burden on an organization if they dont have already in place the personnel who are trained and certified to be able to go in and identify the appropriate amount of footage to disclose. And then to be able to pixelate on involved third parties for their protection, to be able to do that as well. You can imagine a scene where there is a backup or help call goes out in 20 deputies or officers responded with body cameras rolling. They have to go through whatever the workload is times 22 deal with that. That is a burden that i do not think has been a addressed enough. Its a tremendous expense on top of the hardware and things that people are aware of on the surface. Thank you very much. I think you give a very detailed response. The additional cost and the Unfunded Mandates i referred to. The storage fees, the upgrades that are required that poses a hardship on some of the local municipalities. In addition to that, im a strong proponent of the body worn cameras but i want to make sure that we realize it does not solve all of the problems. It is definitely a tool that is needed, but because of the cost involved it has been cost prohibitive for some of my fellow chief and lawenforcement agencies. Thank you. Mr. Cadbury, i happen to be part of an institution, the congress and we get excited when we get in the teens and popularity which doesnt care very often. Most of the polling were down with advice and ebola virus if you look at popularity. You mention the police our country is about 77 public support which i think is tremendous. On the other hand, you also indicated that i think 20 of the murders of Police Officers around the country are motivated by people who have a hatred of Police Officers were a political point of view it allows them to justify shooting a Police Officer, ambushing he or she. Its incredible but it certainly happens. Other any steps you would suggest on how we as a community, a society can reduce the amount of public hostility that some people in our country have towards lawenforcement, or is it just an element that you will have to live with any have to protect yourself from them. What you suggest . Im a Firm Believer there are some bad people. Unfortunately in the last 25 or 30 years lawenforcement has become the only form of government that many local governments have as a resource to go into economically depressed areas. We believe if there is not a holistic approach to Building Trust in communities with every aspect of government, lawenforcement cannot be sent into a neighborhood to clean the neighborhood up. If you do not attack the underlying root problem of poverty, you will never break the cycle. People forget that Marilyn Mosby asked for highintensity patrols in the area where freddie gray was killed. Work died. It was the only arm of government that the Baltimore City officials had to work in that neighborhood. If there is not a total holistic approach with all aspects, community activists, churches, schools, the we are never going to address the problem especially in economically depressed areas. Job training, on a planet, single parent, all of those issues have to be attacked before will see improvement. Thank you very much. Gentlemen, yields back. I recognize the gentleman from michigan. Thank you mr. Chairman. I have never been on the panel where we have had this much police and lawenforcement leadership at one time. So, im going to go to with police that have been so important to me all my life. That is, the importance of us improving the relationship between the africanamerican and minority communities on your yourselves and your officers. This is been ongoing problem. I support you in the funding. I support your concepts. But, you know there is a certain element in Law Enforcement that is racial, that is anti diversity. Lets just speak as honestly as you can for a few minutes about that part of your relationship, because you cannot build trust if there is a glaring instances of police disrespect for the motor and communities. There has been a long history about that. Lawenforcement becomes glaring and i would like to ask the National President of the fraternal order of police to lead off this discussion. I hope all of you will join in with your honest opinions. I do not know when or how that personal bias will be gone in this country. I do know that in my 30 plus year career in Law Enforcement, i have never been taught that racial profiling was a legitimate police practice. I have never been taught that anybody of color should be arrested at a higher rate. I have never been taught that everybody should not be treated fair and equally in this country. But, we do recognize that there is implicit bias and there is individual officers that may have those bias. It is our job to make sure those officers are rooted out and put out of the career field. But again, it cannot be the first call of a politician when a white officer arrests somebody of color. It can ever just be the first think that we hear from social media. Freddie gray for instance, there were three africanamerican officers involved in three white officers involved. To say that the three africanamerican officers committed some sort of heinous act to because of color is ludicrous. But, we believe that working together with our communities we can help build that trust. We cannot be the answer to that. We cannot go into the innercity is lawenforcement and fix the problems unless we attack the underlying problems of poverty. I agree with you that there are a lot of economic and cultural considerations involved in this part of our discussion. But, i want to see and i am watching carefully please systems across this country to make sure that everybody is doing as much as we can to root out some of these bad apples. There are only a few, but it only takes one to really create a very negative view. Who else here would like to make a comment . Thank you sir and thank you for the opportunity. When you look at where we are in america today, i believe we have come a long way, we certainly always have room for improvement. The police are called to situations that are out of control. We get there when situations are fueled often by emotion, alcohol, drugs or Mental Illness. It is always a dynamic situation when you get into it. Race, on top of it is the third rail of american policing. Look at what is happened recently and over our history in this country. I think the answers are to continue to talk about it. People are afraid to talk about race. Unless we engage and talk openly and honestly about it will not come to a place where we are all going to be proud of where were going. There are 18000 lisa permits in our nation. Are they all the same . They are not. We are working to be able to raise the bar for every department in america so that we are comfortable that anybody who goes out there in the field represents the profession and does so in a professional way. I believe today were dealing with issues of misconduct to try to be able to get at the root of that aware separating people from employment who are out there doing it the wrong way. When you look at the amount of police in this country, its about one third or 1 of our population are charged with the Public Safety for the remainder. That is not very much that we can do that on our own. We have to be able to work with the communities we are privileged to serve in a way that is positive in a way that we are all on the same team. Again, it goes back to not only the race issue, but where the climates. That is driven by poverty, lack of opportunity, lack of education and all of the other society else anything police being inserted into a situation that is volatile and highly charged police often get the blame for what the underlying reason was. Beyond the control of what we could do to be able to affect the added true. Has we move forward a big step is focusing on youth programs. Thats not a core please issue but we have taken it on because we see the need to do that. We can bridge the gap at an early age and help kids after school have a safe environment, we do that in l. A. , to be able to give kids that safe environment and ensure they do their homework and then they are allowed to do after school activities, sports programs, work on the computers in those things. Thats really where we have to begin to look for the future. To work with kids at the earliest opportunities. If we dont do anything more today with you for, to me the most important thing is that you take back a message that there are people like myself who have been working in different capacities long before i came to congress and Race Relations. These racial tensions are factors that are not solely about police and the black community, they come from these related concerns of poverty, unemployment, and other educational disadvantages. But i need to make sure that you take this back with you, because you affect some of those people who may be thinking they can get out of line. The major concern is improving Race Relations for me with all of the other folks that may be considered minorities in our community. Who wants the last word . Because of my respect for the gentlemen, were three minutes over, but if you want to take a very quick stab at answering that question is important enough for us to go four minutes over. Your very kind. Thank you for the question. It is opined that we engage our community to a nonconfrontational or not contentious times. Relationships translate into collaborative partnerships. And the thought is michelman to the right hiring the right people, having to the workforce thats representative of the community that it serves is important. Im proud of the fact that an in my area the Service Population is 70 white, 30 nonwhite, another department reflects that same level of diversity. To get that level of diversity must be intentional. There are qualified applicants out here. Of all race ethnicities and gender but you have to go where they are and attract them into your agency. By being reflective and responsive to the citizens and the respectful and equitable w way, that trust people to you and also helps build the public trust and confidence that you are looking for. Rewarding the behavior that is desired is key. It also mentions adjusting that has been appropriate and is extremely important. So much of what we can do prior to the situations taken place in one of those not contentious times. If you go online and see youll see one of our latest initiatives were we brought people together no matter what side of the tracks youre on, your socioeconomic status, were all on one table working on a project that top causes us to Start Building relationships and bridging gaps. Its evident of what we can do when we come together with unity and purpose. Thank you mr. Chairman. The chair now recognizes the chairman from louisiana. My father had thirddegree burns and is permanently disabled, heres a training officer. Attachment is respect for what you do in the day jersey face. Mr. Canterbury, thank you for your testimony about the need to modernize our lawenforcement. I believe that people use terms like militarized dont understand the real challenges you face. I think language is important and i appreciate making that distinction. As you noted our great tragedy in baton rouge got the attention in louisiana. We have the distinction of being the most dangerous state in america for Law Enforcement. I wish we could do something about that, we will try. The question is, did the department of Homeland Security renewed late monday that warned of the dangers of home grown terrorist. They called the threat environment in our country right now one of the most recent the 9 11 attack. I was wondering in your opinion, do you agree we will continue to see an increase in smaller, more localized terrorist attacks . Absently. I think social media has allowed terrorist organizations over there to influence Young Americans in the United States and glamorize acts of terrorism. I have served on the homeless occurred in counsel both for president obama president bush, it has eyes been a major concern and will continue to be. We are obviously going to see an uptick in lone wolf style and american attackers that have never been to that part of the world, but have been energized by social media in those marke markets. Recognizing that to be the case, all of us feel the burden of it. We feel we need to do what we can to try to address that threat. The followup question is to adequately prepare and respond to these attacks, do you think there are improvements that can be made to apply to Lessons Learned and specifically in terms of coordination among various First Responders . I think the communications from the federal level to state local have greatly improved since 9 11. It can continue to get better. I like to point out that we still do not have an interoperability radio system in this country. We are closer than we were. I testified in 2003 after 9 11 of the importance of that and the contracts for building a system out has just been let in 2017. The comedic asians must continue. It needs to be both ways. J tts needs to be fully funded. Chaidez need to be fully offended and the Fusion Centers need to be fully funded. I appreciate your work in that arena. Maybe this question could be for any of our panel members. The Police Chiefs and share semi homestead of louisiana facing growing threats and challenges because the resources as i know you have testify to instruct with, the challenges are going up, the resources are going down. Can any of you elaborate so we have it on the record about the 1033 program and how that is proven to be a criticals resource for year department, county and department. The program is not the problem. It is all about proper training, proper policy, proper use. I remember when they cannot, people started saying we have these things that are being used in iraq. Although i do not choose to get one in austin because it was not good for tight streets, i defended that because i said, there is plenty and a lot of rural counties. In houston we have a huge problem with flooding. It is not the equipment, it is really the policy that is used and implemented for its use. And the way it is used. We have helmets, we have binoculars, office equipment, helicopters, and again, there are no offensive equipment other than rifles. Other than that it is all defensive and protecting the American People. We hope that we are thoughtful and i dont think the 1033 program has been destroyed by any means. But we keep that Program Alive and well. Anybody else . The 1033 program i would ask reconsider be given to look at the needs of local police. When you see any of these activities should a situations, terrorist situations on our home soil, who gets the call . People called 911 and local police respond. If they are showing up in a black and white inside arm and thats all they have, their at a tremendous disadvantage. But themselves in a situation where they will be hurt or killed and not be able to accomplish the mission of rescuing people. Having the equipment we have been able to get through the 1033 program, we have been able to go into a hudson to stop the shooting, extract people at the scene, give people to medical attention. Without the tools necessary for the exception, we dont use them everyday and as the chief mentioned, its about leadership and accountability and using the right tools at the right time. Not using them for situations where we have seen in our recent past that people can cite and say that they are not intended for that. Theyre not. Theyre intended to put our officers and deputies in a position between danger and the public and to be able to do hudson extractions of citizens to get them out and get them help stop the threat. Thank you for that. I just want to rightcurlybracket in this, this is not just a feelgood exercise. We greatly value your input. Another is a commitment to the people on the subcommittee and the full committee to work toward the reforms. Thank you for what you do. I now recognize a generally from texas. Thank you very much. I was happy teal to my Ranking Members and i want to take note of the fact that chef, you are member and congressman is very active full member of the committee and was here at the beginning. I think her for her service to acknowledge congressman deutsch and his presence here today and acknowledge congressman richman presence here today and the subcommittee for our members. We are delighted to have you here. Also to take note of the fact that we are interested in working together. I want to start with mr. Canterbury. Thank you for the representation of 300,000, to you in your collective membership, let me continue to offer my acknowledgment of your service and as well sympathy for the loss of their families. In my past life i served as a Minnesota Court judge and interacted with citizens and officers on a regular basis. They sometimes say, not necessarily clothed in their blues but close in seeking their proper cause warrants. We know the work that is done and we thank you. I want to follow the route line of questioning of my Ranking Member to say that we have to meet each other halfway. There is no doubt that the walter scott case on the jordan evans case, these are very conspicuous cases that link large psyche of americans know matter what relation the air. Not know if they will work with us, as you will know that we are working on a trust and integrity bill that i believe is a hand of friendship. It also includes the collection of data. That is numbers. You just cited the fbi report, but i viewed it as science that helps trace us toward providing the funding youre interested in. I was a great supporter of the cops on the beat program. Grants like you said help as much as possible. Would you, very briefly because i want to get to it the share for him to further emphasize some of the tactics we have used in houston and i want to thank the mayor for emphasizing terms of Community Outreach who you have engaged in. If youd also answer the question, just this past monday secretary kelly, and i know that you have gotten this notice in working with our joint terrorism indicated that we may be in one of the most serious terrorist threat atmosphere since 9 11. The swells to local police what kind of resources and what you need dealing with that question. I think mr. Canterbury. Sheriff will you take hold of this question please so i dont have to say it again. Im interested in your comments about Mental Health. Answer the question about using some of these people came to you are not terminals, they need Mental Health help. Thank you. I like to lead up i say they think the difference in the walter scott case versus some of the other cases is the city of charleston handled the entire investigation in the prework that she thompson was talking about in the city of charleston. If you look at the manual Church Shooting as well, im a proud south carolinian, we did not go to the streets and ryan in South Carolina. We walked arm in arm on king street in charleston and demanded an end to the violence. It is the prework that happen there. On a National Level we have always been committed to data gathering. What we also like to see is mandatory collection of Police Officers as well so that we can demonstrate as a total number. Its voluntary reporting currently. Yes, we would work with you in any way possible to increase the amount of data, Scientific Data is a basis for asset allocation, policing strategies. On the other side we want to collect the data in the number of Police Officers. I will take up on that offer. Thank you. Morning again. In history where focusing on building relationships, Building Trust. Mayor turner sets the tone and we follow, including yourself in the Police Department. We do not pay people with broad brushes. Black lives matter, some people paint them with broad brushes and we know some of those are people who just want to see good policing. What were doing is engaging one another, building bridges, when smb for marginalized immigrants and painted them as a bunch of thugs and rapists and drug dealers, were painting them as what they are. That is, day laborers, cooks, nannies and people building our homes and bridges and roadways. We need to put down our brushes and Start Talking to each other and actually instead of running away from activists, run towards them. Because of that we have built trust that we call each other where we need to and have honest, open, blunt but respectful discussions. Thank you. On the issue of Mental Health, i have one of daily basis 17000 inmates in our custody in l. A. County jail system. Of that number, four or 5000 are seriously mentally ill. If you were to look at the remainder of them on issues that like ptsd the number would be around 90 . We have a population that is very challenged, they need different care than traditionally we have been used to providing. Many folks are in custody because her acting out on their Mental Illness. Theres a cycle of dysfunction that continues. They come into the custody, treated, we try to stabilize them on medication and be able to get them functioning only to be released from the system back on to the street. Many are homeless. They go back to skid row are living under a bridge or freeway. They reoffend and find themselves the bakkens custody. A very expensive and inhumane cycle of dysfunction that we need to break. We need additional funding a focus on communitybased Health Care Treatment to provide alternatives to incarceration for people who can be better treated in a medical setting than in a custody environment. I briefly at that we have a lot of people veterans quebec with ptsd. We have citizens like my son who has autism. We are finding more and more situations where the actions, although they may pay to be criminal in nature would be better served if we were to defer or get the people the help they need. At some point that we identify resources and leverage those resources to assist those that are having some labor health issues. One last word, its a growing epidemic. One in every six and two children born on the spectrum. This is not a situation that is going to go away anytime soon. We need to put image and effort is to dealing with our fellow citizens as a girl because they do get older. Our little boy will be taller than me next year and hes only 12. As a Police Officer and having him as young black male who is not going to understand some of the orders of please, im in a unique position to try to help on both sides of this equation of how to respond and also how to get parents some assurance. Thank you. If i could add hunt to the interaction of the police with the public as it relates to autism and other cognitive disorders. If we can find a way to provide crisis intervention training to all of our officers and sheriffs, thats another tool in the toolbox. We trained how to be able to go in and be authoritative and take control of the situation. If we do that was somebody who is autistic we will guarantee its going to set them off a sudden illness and will end up with a potential issu use of foa bad outcome. The people know what to look for and can recognize symptoms and come up with a different approach would get a different result in everyone benefits. I want to recommend someone in the audience. Mr. Womack is here from houston, texas who has worked with the chief and came here to acknowledge National Police week. Thank you. Welcome. The chair now recognize the gentleman for texas. Thank you. Thank you for being here. I assume all four of you are here this week along with thousands of other peace officers and families of the slain officers to honor the fallen, not just from last year but the previous years as well. Latino in texas last year we had 21 peace officers killed, numerous others wounded were killed in the state of texas last year than any other state. The five of them killed by a sniper while a demonstration was taken place in the city of dallas. Ironically a lot of the officers were protecting the demonstrators and crowd the sniper opens fire five officers killed, several others wounded, citizens killed and finally, the sniper was taken out as he should have been by Law Enforcement. As a member of this committee along with the others, we mourn the loss of all of those officers plus over 130 that were killed throughout the nation. Thank you for being the head guy for your department. I want to talk a little bit about the justice for victims of trafficking act that has been implemented. As you know, the bill that passed overwhelmingly in the house and the senate and signed by the president goes after the trafficker, call that person the slave master. Goes after the buyer who is the consumer, and also helps the victim and treats the victim about a victim of crime and not a criminal. The city of houston recently had the super bowl and the city of houston Police Department wasnt charged and correct me if im wrong but the city of houston was in charge of the entire process of trafficking and making sure that the outlaws stay out of our town during the super bowl. You worked with federal, state and the nfl and other organizations. My question to you specifically on the bill goes after the buyer, the consumer, the person who bisects primarily with young children. For years that person seems to always get away with that conduct in the criminal Justice System. Can you give me some successor not success of the law going after the buyers and justice for victims of trafficking act in our city of houston . Of money. Thank you so much. Unfortunately the city of houston is the epicenter for Human Trafficking and sex trafficking. It is nothing were proud of but something we are combating. Two things were doing thats important. Like secretary kelly is talking about, the war on drugs you can focus on the people selling the doper treatment and going after the people who are buying it. In terms of this, we do need and we are thankful for the fact that we are starting to focus on what we really need to be focusing on which is the consumer. In the city of houston with the das office and the mayor and Police Department, we are now treating the victims as they are. These womens are victims. These boys, children, girls are victims and were treating them as such. So as a consequence of our doing is theyre helping us identify the bad guys that are taken advantage of the folks whether the trafficker of the job. One of the thing were doing is publishing the photos of these people to go unnoticed. Thats something i wouldve done as a judge in the city. There are some interesting people that ended up in those pictures i will leave it at that. We are grateful for that bill were hopeful it will help us like that. The last thing, a lot of these folks are traumatized that when their stop by Law Enforcement with the pimp and the trafficker, theyre free to say anything. So training Police Officers on what the indicators are, how to best get someone on the side of the road has gone a long way. I would encourage all pleased permits across the country to be required to have training in that area. Thank you. I think the Mayors Office has a tremendously adequate and excellent protocol on dealing with the issue of Human Trafficking. I hope more cities take it in the future. It will make us the hub of not trafficking but the answer to trafficking. The less, i wanted to make was to mr. Canterbury. I want to thank you for supporting the bill that i have introduced, back the blue act which punishes outlaws who commit crimes against Police Officers throughout the country. With that, i yield the back. The chair now recognize the gentleman from louisiana. Let me thank all of you for being here. I will start with mr. Canterbury since he represent so many people. I want to know that these are not catchy questions. If you can answer quickly that would help get to where i want to go. Would you agree that so many municipalities and local leaders in states and cities and counties are so cashstrapped that they are using the Police Department says the revenue generator to find these. Do you think that policy fosters or hampers Community Police relations. It hampers Community Relations. In st. Louis there 68 Police Officers issuing tickets. They brought that to the forefront and we should never be used to generate revenue. You would agree that the street code of no snitching erodes the safety of those communities and it hampers lawenforcements ability to identify and convict criminals that are terrorizing those communities. Absolutely. On the converse with the blue code which has been termed in terms of Police Officers unwillingness or reluctance to do the same to other Police Officers, the fact that is out there people talk about it erodes the communitys confidence in their Police Departments. I believe the discussion of it erodes it. I personally dont think the blue code exist to the extent that it is meant to be. Ive seen officers that might turn a blind eye to a policy violation. Ive never seen anybody turn a blind eye to a criminal violation. The other thing is, you mentioned and i was glad to hear you say that you do not think they real bias but you think some officers come in with their own personal personal implicit bias. To the extent the chiefs and others have the ability to read that out, most often i see with allegiance to service or others that the union will always come to the defense no matter how much evidence. I think that also erode some community confidence. Let me ask you the you talked about baton rouge in my district. You mention st. John and officers being gunned down. Thats what were concerned about. You mentioned homegrown terrorism. What have not heard here today is the group that has killed more Police Officers than anybody else and so when we dont mention them i think it gives the perception to the public that we have some outlaw urban kids are other people who are targeting police which is a non fair depiction of when we know who this citizen is and we never talk about them or call them by name. My lawenforcement officer tells me theyre more concerned about stopping a card that is a citizen than any other job on. I think sovereign citizens its not covered by the media the way it should be. I think law forstmann is extremely concerned about sovereign citizens. Baton rouge, the assailants for best to be a silent. And st. John parish were less deputies were both sovereign citizens. Im homeland, judiciary and im going when he talks about sovereign citizens. That concerns me. I think if you can talk about it with my colleagues that will help us. You all are outgunned. They have better ammunition, higher capacity cartridges, better bullets that go through the body armor that you have. And i have better body armor. If we talk about baton rouge specifically the officers got out of their cars with handguns and he probably invest about 5000 and, theres nothing that could save him. Not the helmet, shield, car door, his bullet wouldve went through everything. We have to have a honest conversation about what people on the streets can buy and whether there is a need for it. Our officers are walking into situations where its iraq except their armed is a crossing guard and the bad guys are armed as terrorists. If you could help us or not talk about taking peoples guns, we just want the police to be a fair footing with the criminals. Could you respond to that . In the past ten or 15 years ive seen a big shift in lawenforcement perspective on the first and second amendment. Our position has been better background checks, Mental Health records being available to conduct those background checks will go a long way. As the Assault Rifle bill that was signed by president clinton, the numbers do not prove at the conclusion that that bill had any success in reducing the number of gun sold a number of crimes committed. Preventing people from getting those weapons that should not happen should be the first and foremost thing we should worry about. Command with the. The f157 which is a handgun which will go through body armor, and has no knockdown power so cant be selfdefense. It is sold in cabelas and everywhere else. It is strictly a killing gun. The question is, do we have the need for that and anecdotally on assault weapons ban, i was a kid during those times. I dont know what the data shows but i know the street value and the street cost of an ak47 at the time went from 40500 in the store to 1500 on the street. It made it harder for someone to buy that gun and hopefully calm their head before they could purchase it. Thank you for what you do. The chair will now recognize the gentleman from texas, former u. S. Attorney. Thank you. Thank you for being here today. Im sure over the course of this week, police week youre going to receive a lot of kind words and praise and certainly richly deserved. As u. S. Tourney under president bush the opportunity to service the top federal lawenforcement official in the Eastern District of texas give me the opportunity to stand shoulder to shoulder with many officers and Police Department across the 33000 square miles of that district. It instilled in me an appreciation i didnt have before about what your men and women are asked to do everyday. The sacrifices theyre asked to make on the circumstances under which they are asked to make them. In my mind every week should be please weaken this country. Rather than just talking the talk as legislators, we put words into action and legislation that does more than to say that we are grateful that present to you. Weve had a lot of great common theme on the subcommittee today for members on both sides of the aisle, to be specifically mentioned one specific piece of legislation that i introduce Less Congress and again this congress which is the plus act which is protecting lights using surplus equipment. Legislation became necessary when the Prior Administration decided to restrict the 1033 program and take back some of the equipment that have been transferred to lawenforcement agencies under the program to the department of defense. I want to yield my time too. You have had some opportunity to talk about it and we had a chance to talk before, mr. Canterbury working with your folks on this issue, cant say how much i appreciated and how much we look forward to continue to engage. Chief we talked about this issue a few months ago at an event, but theres a narrative, false narrative in some folks mind that this is barney fife plan weekend warrior with rpgs. Theres a misconception about what the equipment involved is somewhat it really means. Sheriff mcdonnell, right next door to the jurisdiction at the San Bernardino attack happened, i would really like you to take a few minutes and talk about the fact that this is an theoretical. This particular program what it means in terms of saving lives, not just of officers but citizens they protect. I would like to yield to all of you in that respect. Thank you for that opportunity. We touched on that briefly. The 1033 program has been very valuable to state local departments and the ability to have the tools necessary to respond to those calls that are out of the ordinary. When you need the equipment, you need it. To be able to put yourself in an Armored Vehicle between the suspect and some down citizens to affect their rescue. The seconds are lifesaving. To be able to get in there without waiting into have the tools necessary and rapidly deploy them right if were waiting for an entity far away to be able to respond, this stuff as you see it on tv, these active shooter situation are often over the seconds or minutes. To mobilize and get the equipment there and do it needs to be done in a way as safe as possible, the 1033 program has given us tools that otherwise we would not have had. I would like to add on in houston that without this equipment we learned in katrina if you can wait for the federal government to come and save you, youre going to be waiting for a while. So, the more we can equip our local agencies to be prepared for all threats, whether by nature of the next multistate shooter incident you might have, homegrown citizen or sovereign citizen, the better off well be. High water vehicles in houston is basically at sea level and when those rains commit we deploy these vehicles and some people think of iraq, but theres no offensive capability with 99 of the equipment that were talking about. Its all equipment that helps us conduct our Everyday Mission of keeping everybody safe. I would just like to add for those departments that are strapped financially been able to get this equipment at a lower cost is advantageous to us. They can try to get some of the equipment from the private sector is extremely costly. Its cost prohibitive for us. Its a valuable resource for us. Im not sure theres another occupation out there were some and is expected to make correct, splitsecond, sometimes lifeanddeath decisions while navigating complicated laws and procedures, in the process lane his or her life on the line for total strangers for relatively little compensation and where every aspects of those draws public scrutiny and in some cases from the citizens of the courts. Thats what your folks do. Highlighted by the freddie gray matter but a series of other issues as well. Now, i believe that you came to the city of houston and previously were in the city of boston. Is that right . At any time during her time at the austin pd i think there were voluntary cooperation agreements between the Civil Rights Division in the department of boston. As i write . As we were investigated by the department of justice that lasted about four years, the entire process but rather than enter into Consent Decree a lot of money goes into what i describe as a Cottage Industry for these folks who get paid to have a vested interest in never get anything out of the Consent Decree. If we can use to send decrees as the last as the last step for cities and counties that dont want to be helped by the department of justice and spend those precious dollars on training and equipment of and the things that will change outcomes we are better off. We are actually going to have a meeting with the attorney generals folks in two weeks industry chiefs to talk about this issue. We dont want to abandon them but we think corporate of agreements with teeth in them without these monitors that are sometimes getting one, two, 3 million a year may be better for the tax for the tax. What were some of the programmatic changes made as a result of this voluntary agreement . Oh lord for me was a great tool to have because quite frankly they were validated with this new chief became from outside the state of california was observing that we were not, our systems are processes our policies were so outdated. Use of force if i use my pr 24 use my baton of somebody we would have the sergeant come to the scene oftentimes to assess to what was the use of force and documented use of force. We changed, we had 163 or so recommendations and we implemented 161 of them so its a Great Partnership and a great tool in the hope collaborative agreements will be the preferred method moving forward of attention the final step and quite frankly without the department of justice a lot of cities and counties simply will not divest in the training and equipment the Police Officers need to do a complex job unless they are forced to do these agreements in terms of the Department Justice. Is that a result of the department of justice engagement involving a presence and the austin Police Department was able to modernize and significantly improve the relationship between the police and communities. Is that write . Yes sir. I know sheriff mcdonnell, the l. A. County has had experience with Consent Decrees and Consent Decree came about as a result of allegations and accusations of excessive use of force particularly in communities of color. Is that write . We have one in the jail someone in apple valley. Can you tell me or expansion of the department of justice and has a resulted in positive changes resulting in improvement . Does it potentially improve the relationship between a the police and the community . I have Prior Experience with lapd with the longterm Consent Decree as well. It needs to be managed in a way and a macrosense so that does what its intended to do. The things that are being counted and the things that matter and change. A lot of times youll have a Consent Decree with a number of different recommendations for change. The completion of the Consent Decree is consist some of those will affect organizational colin gerald change in some of us are checked a box things which are not as helpful. Can you give me one example is my time expires as the type of thing that could affect organizational change in a positive way . And looking at better practice in apple valley racial profiling allegations we were able to drill down on that and we are measuring what is occurring out there. Our greatest measures public satisfaction. There was a recent article done by the l. A. Times measuring where we were prior and where we are today and it was very complementary of the change within the organization as relates to Police Community interaction so we are very proud of that and within the custody environment thats a different place today than i it was a few years ago. We are very proud of the progress we have been able to make there. Our use of force, significant use of force by deputies on inmates is down dramatically. When we look at the population of the jails we have in california they have changed dramatically, much more sophisticated and much more violent criminals and for longer periods of time than previous so the challenge is greater but we are managing them much better than we were in past years. Thank you sheriff and i hope this committee would consider strongly take the position of Department Justice should proceed carefully with any effort to eradicate accountability and involvement and work towards establishing the best relationship is possible. Thank you and i yield back. The gentleman from new york with yields back. The chair recognizes gentleman for from michigan for purposes of giving his Opening Statement. Thats what i want to do. I asked renounce consent. The chair will recognize the gentleman from texas. Appreciate the witnesses being carried and appreciate even more the jobs that you do for the people in the cities in the country. I want to followup on the Consent Decree issue and i guess we are all affected by her own personal experiences that based on my experience as a prosecutor and mainly civil litigation and doing Court Appointments from time to time and also being a felony judge and the chief justice seeing it from a lot of different angles and it led me to believe that my friend who is a brilliant intellect in the supreme court, just a smart guy. He had said he felt like the Consent Decrees were being used to federalize local Police Departments and it certainly appeared from what i have seen personally when departments were having to spend money and time on the experts, they really do. They make a career out of eating expensive and being indispensable under Consent Decrees. There is a lot of money waged on those people that should be not wasted but spent for its more productive on people, manpower and equipment to keep them safe. It always seemed to me having watched a federal judge in my hometown take control of the state prison system. He was the Legislature Executive and Judicial Branch all in one as he managed prison systems in texas for over 30 years i think, that certainly seemed unconstitutional but no one person should have that kind of authority for that period of time to run facilities and systems but again that was under the decree that was agreed to basically giving the federal government and one federal judge that kind of control. But i had a Court Appointment who told me after the federal judge to control of the texas prison systems he had been in prison before and he had then and after and there was a night and day different after the federal judge took control. He he was in much more danger and it was much more difficult to do time in prison. In any event i would like to see , come idina seems like if this is a problem i always felt like there should be a lawsuit to get it straight that the oversight doesnt continue. Just ends up if we have to come back its going to be more expensive again and then leave it to the locals to clean it up with the knowledge that if they dont the federal government would come back in and it will be more expensive and costly next time. I dont believe houston had been under Consent Decree. I dont think you had. No sir i dont believe we have. Ive only been there for six months. I would hope thats not something you are looking forward to. Thats not something in a police chief would like to have. Sheriff mcdonnell i get the impression thats not someplace you want to be either. Thats correct. I also wanted to ask something that is constantly come up over the last eight years and thats the emphasis on people in federal prison for simple possession and the public was given the impression that we had lots of folks in federal prison for simple possession. My experience was if there was nothing but simple possession the feds went back to the state for prosecution. About the only time we have ever seen said take a simple possession when somebody agreed to plead agreement to testify and in return they would only pursue the possession. For those who say drug crimes are victimless crimes i would just like to finish by gearing each of your opinions on whether or not simple drug offenses are victimless crimes. Sheriff mcdonnell. You know i look at simple possession cases in the state of california based on prop 47 not just once but every time you are caught in a decimated the type of drug. We are probably in a different place in many states but the drug market, the drug industry if he will drives crying. Its organized crime and the cartels are involved. There is Violence Associated with it from the lowest level to the highest levels. So to say its a victimless crime i think is very wrong. When you look at what has happened across america with their Opioid Crisis and we are losing money when people a day in this country to overdoses primarily from opioids and you look at that and you just see these are primarily young kids 18 to 25. Fentanyl has now been introduced to the market which is extremely powerful and deadly in some cases with carfentanil in particular. If you look at where that is the same time we are moving away from using the tools of the Justice System to be able to deal with drugs and i dont believe those are the tools that should be used solely. It needs to be dealt with as a Health Problem but i think we also need to be able to have leverage to be able to get people into treatment. We have lost that in california by having thats leverage in using the criminal Justice System we have the ability to get people in treatment and hopefully get their lives back on track. Without that leverage people dont have the ability based on their addiction to give themselves the treatment and get them to break that cycle or dysfunction that we have seen too often. C i ask your indulgence if i could have all three answer the question. The only one that hasnt asked a question yet, trying to get done by a new but if you can accommodate judge with whether or not drugs are victimless crime im happy to wait longer. C not a victimless crime but we try to do for what we can from the type of assistance that they need. Most of the cases are at the city and counsel level or state level with state statutes. The federal penitentiary for simple possession. Tonight the vast majority in the federal sector are very involved in the violent side with our cossax. Its a misnomer that a federal prison is full of nonviolent drug offenders. Thank you. I dont have the data with me but i think we need to be smart on crime especially at a time where we have limited resources. We need to distinguish between those that are simple users and has instructor kelly is that we need to get those people treatment and not put them in prison. We were charging people with felonies for having three bundles of cocaine for personal use. We have to differentiate chew dealers out there pushing on the streets. Treatments goes a long way in getting what rid of the underlying problem. The chair now recognizes himself and i would like to thank all four of you for being a divan for your service to our country. Im going to find binders interactions with my own police chief. Want to start by thanking you and your family who is with you today for your service to our community and other communities throughout your distinguished career. We are really fortunate to have you and tim scott and i want to thank you for helping us with our police Community Relations roundtables. As you know they are confidential. We want people to tell the truth and your voice is an important one that we benefit from. Your predecessor was a really good friend of mine. Thats tony fisher. He also is a Law Enforcement officer of color without him i never would have been elected district attorney. So if folks are looking for someone to blame for me being in Public Service tony fisher would be the person to blame. And tony and i would lament from time to time the notion deeply held notion within certain communities that victims of color were valued less than white victims and homicide cases in particular if the sentences didnt reflect valuing the lives of lack victims, the same as white victims and its interesting to have that conversation with an officer of color who well knew prosecutions are only as good as the evidence that we are given so when you say Community Relations, the first thing id take a guess how do we get the community to trust you and your officers enough to give us the information we know that they have two present the evidence we know that they possess so we can value the lives of people of color in exactly the same way we do as white victims. How do we do that . I dont think its an easy fix but its what you do before situations arrive. There is no substitute for quality professional medical service in all areas of our city but breaking down these historical traditional barriers between the police and the community are hard that i will say without the police giving us what we need is as significant as we may think it is. Information is definitely power. If we are not given the information rarely at the scene will cause the relationship of someone giving us was necessary to identify the ones responsible and bring them to do justice. Like you and mr. Fisher is a tremendous frustration because we value life thats being hurt and stepping up to do whats necessary to bring the people responsible for the cause of the pain and hardship to justice. Relationships, if theres one thing that i could just stress when we go to calls we are not being the invited over for tea obviously but if we can get together at noncontentious time to break down those barriers where we have a single purpose we do care about community. For example i tried to leave by example by being mentors. I chaired the boys and girls club in South Carolina. These are kids that have run from the law. The people see you are sincere in your efforts to assist and we are not just some entity that comes in at rest and writes a ticket and leaves her that starts is on her way to giving what we are needing. You and your officers are incredibly active in our community and i regret deeply that it takes a funeral for some of your guys and gals to know how appreciated they are. The community outpouring of support for your agency was incredibly tragically beautiful to watch. I just hate that its a jason harris life and it doesnt have to do that but i hope your officers feel appreciated even on the days they come home safely. I will say this when you were making your Opening Statement i was sitting there writing a summary. The pay is low and the work is hard. The danger is intense and the scrutiny is exacting and the margin for error is zero. I dont know how in the hell you recruit anybody for that line of work. I just dont so when the world clamoring for bipartisanship and a political causes i hope you can take back all of your agencies and entities that republicans a democrats at least on this subcommittee greatly value your work and we are cognizant of the sacrifices that not just you but your officers and their families make. If you would let them know that and to the point we will try to communicate not just this one. Mr. Chairman let me first of all ask unanimous consent that my statement be put in the record and a letter dated may 17 without objection. To associate myself with the chairman as he concludes is that there is a blue line and its what you call a thin blue line but theres no for the affection that we have an office in the questions we have asked i believe are both constructive and productive for us ensuring that we are both working in a commonality and respect and dignity. We certain offer our sympathy this week for those who have fallen and we commit ourselves to make that zero as we work with our communities and our young people across the nation and thank you mr. Chairman for yielding. Agriculture secretary testified about the importance of the rural economy. Later a preview of the president s Upcoming Trip to the middle east. The Senate Commerce science and Transportation Committee held a hearing on efforts to promote Athletes Health and safety. Doctors officials and athletes