Introduce our distinguished speaker. A veteran of more than 20 years of Human Rights Research and activism is a professor of law at ucdavis who grew up in algeria in the United States served as a Legal AdvisorAmnesty International todd wreckers in university of michigan why the publisher of fundamentalism and counterterrorism please welcome her professor. [applause] is an honor to be here i would like to think the Commonwealth Club for inviting me and for court the being the event and also the lovely introduction so what i want to do is share some excerpts from my book is the one to explain why i read it wrote the book it is a very big project interviewed 100 people of muslim heritage from afghanistan to molly specifically to learn about the work to combat extreme is them and persecution at the end of the fundamentalist those people were incredibly diverse i interviewed loggers, housewives, sexual rights activists people who excuse themselves to pray in the middle of the interviews and others who took in the birthday of the profit mohammad with a glass of wine so there was tremendous diversity. The u. N. Womens Rights Convention that u. S. Has not ratified but she believes the womens Rights Convention is reconcilable with her of muslim faith i interviewed the only will the chief prosecutor in afghanistan that has 23 bodyguards but yet despite the attempts of her life continues to prosecute the cases of violence against women and corruption all the while as the community may sell out afghan women to reconcile with the taliban. In the question that i ask myself time and again wired these people lot more wellknown internationally . Everybody knows osama bin on in but very few know about on the ground challenging people like him. What i set out to do is change that or contribute to the change. I did this very personal reasons because my own father was said anthropologist it lives his life to stand up but extremism in his home country of algeria. I remember even when he was driven from his home in force to stop teaching due to Death Threats he remained inside algeria and continued to publish criticisms of the fundamentalist and the government that they fought. In a three part series a very terrible time called the dark decade in algeria he produced an article hall fundamentalism produced a terrorist without he calls a radical break up true is job as lived by a the ancestors. The algerian democrats unfortunately received little support internationally at the time. In dili seems the International Community could not understand what was happening on the ground but they did not grasp the threat from the ideology of the euphemism itself three 9 11. In the ideology of islam is some that is practiced by so many people so many million ways but the misunderstanding of the nature of the threat to the cuban rights of people of that heritage actually persist today and we can see this at the moment of the press coverage what is happening in countries like egypt. Doing this kind of work without International Support or comprehension of the challenge is incredibly lonely endeavor. As i was told in december 2012 at a time when the entire northern half was under g hottest occupation she said international solidary is very helpful when you live such a crisis it is much more difficult to bear alone. So my book tries to break the wall of salinas and silence by correcting people to do the struggles on the ground around the World History of the tolerance in the quality and violence. So before it to your view of the stories muslim fundamentalism is a controversial term. And give the definition of that writes about the fundamentalisms not just islam but others as a Political Movement of the extreme right of the context of globalization to manipulate religion to achieve their political aim. As the radical politicalization of ideology. Not a spiritual or religious one. Calling some fundamentalism somewhere they also have their own diverse cities as they could have certain shared characteristics. With the imposition this sense that i called the muslim law are unitary monolithic imposed almost a rare. And what they would dispute entirely by their definition and by that you did terry version of what they advocate. A and we find that manifestly in Political Parties by in response to these movements of the contemporary period they seem to offer only two choices the open discriminatory flawed characters characterization the it is inherently fundamentalist and that is clearly not only offensive but just plain wrong and unfortunately on the left as ball sometimes the responses are too politically correct even to broach the topic of fundamentalism as out all. In to do a grave disservice to those the other living on the front lines provide try to create another way to talk about this in the west. As a backdrop i am painfully aware there has been of rise in the last few years with the right to attack on obama as punitive in this does not mean it is appropriate or productive and my contention is the way stooge, is discriminatory portions of people is precisely to display their diversity in one way to do that is to tell stories of those who are practicing muslims muslims, agnostic with the heritage and those who have chosen very bravely to challenge the fundamentalist movement. With the remainder of my time i want to introduce you to some people it is difficult because they have become tear to my heart. I will start with the story from the first chapter about visual artist it could for being our guest in places like pakistan in algeria it is no accident with it every context i visited or steadied their challenge a extremism that they thought would through the very content. One of the people that i met her early on here at the time was the artistic director in pakistan and since the 1982 the Production Company that they ran named after the playwright father brought 24,000 for four reid artist from 86 countries to perform in pakistan to simultaneously promote the performances of local pakistan the artist as well. They brought joy to generations but at the height of the key hardy violence it is a target they begin to receive threats that they were told were sinful that were threatening so in 2008 a bomber struck the performing Arts Festival with three separate bombings as what was described as a rate of the last nfl injury space. The 12 yearold potato chip vendor cave in carrying idd with his packets and this is very upsetting because there were so many children in the audience at the event as well but luckily the boy was caught before he could deadly his device. So there was a terrible decision the festival was hit, people injured, a threat the attacks would continue should they call off the performing Arts Festival . They ask those debating the question and they decided ladies and gentlemen, this eight going to work this festival is going to continue he said if we bowed down to the islamist there will never be anything we will just sit in the dark corners of they announced it would continue the next time the next day. Thousands of people poured into the venue to show their support for the performing arts a of the opposition to the bombers in a that festival could go on and continue through the scheduled conclusion but they were terrified as well. He saw a young woman come did with the two Young Children ian said you do know there was a bomb here yesterday and there is a threat to be a bomb here today . She said i used to come to a festival with my mother and i still have images in my mind. She insisted the only way for her children to have a cultural life was for people to be there at the defense. Unfortunately they lost their sponsors and could not put it on the next year but then i could attend the first event they could do in the same within new in the spot where the bombs went off watching the schoolgirls performing a musical called the not with the subtitle title dont tie your tale to a coward. I thought nobody in this venue has done that. It was packed. It was remarkable we targeted girls schools but you could see leaning forward as if he could leap onto the stage if necessary to protect the girls and everyone exhaled isnt burst into applause and some people were we being you could see the sense of hope that peace is still possible. And also his teenage daughter told me in spite of everything that happened she wanted to grow up to become a theater director like her father and when i was the been the venue i came across the drawing space and somebody had written the two words. No fear. Everywhere i went people were in the of forefront that chapter is called the liberated daughter and other sturdy stories. And i see the relationship between womens rights and fundamentalism was well explained by sociologists and the west african nation who is deeply worried about the rise of the al qaeda terrorism even targeting Health Care Workers said she said something very smart to me that was the theme of the chapter of womens rights defenders every step forward for womens rights is a piece of the struggle against fundamentalism and that is important to think about you cannot trade away with the extremist goes to the core of the struggle against fundamentalism. One of those in gauged in the struggle was a 70 yearold retired College Professor from seven call the has end of an organization of a network of women living under muslim law she is very a greek of sentences of Corporal Punishment of a 23 all condemned to study for adultery. Every day there is a case acquitted be attacked for what they wear or what they do and i find it very depressing. A practicing muslim herself she stresses she does not resist is of the the islamist discourse that crystallizes around the rights of women. I aster is secular or religious discourse was more useful to challenge fundamentalism and she insisted the best approach depended on the context. It may be entirely appropriate to make the islamic feminist argument but she says she will change the family not not entry into the religious to be today. She argues above all else to combat fundamentalism sp the religious terrain where they wished to trap us. Now i also met an 18 yearold at the time and better in kabul afghanistan. She had just founded the Organization Called the young women for change that did something rather remarkable july 2011. They organized a street protest against harassment of women. But i have the right to walk freely in my city. They both made the argument because of the profit mohammad said nobody those who are inferior will disrespect women. And it also asserted in human rights terms that women are equal to men and deserve the same dignity. Before the march took place they actually gave interviews on tv and subsequently getting threats over the phone in facebook get email but she refused to give up her own beefier issue would put other women in danger. But they held the march and it was a success. A few male supporters than 50 women walked through the dusty streets passing hellfires against street harassment. They were receiving catcalls at various points but it was seen as a victory but one thing that struck her that the afghan policeman that were assigned to monitor the demonstration started off being skeptical about the march, when they saw the harassment were so affected they took the flyers and the they began to pass them about themselves and began to shout back at those that were heckling though women. Worry about the future of her country when troops leave next year and theres good reason to be worried i hope we will continue to engage with and remember afghanistan but somehow she remains positive about the future. She said in this is striking i may not be alive to see the day but i think tv is important that our daughters can walk in this country. I have five minutes left . I will tell what course story of wish i could tell somebody more you can find them in the book. Want to end with the story from my fathers home country of algeria. Said the armed fundamentalist groups poorly targeted the civilian population we dont know the exact numbers but they killed somewhere between 100 and 200,000 people. I want to end the foot of those people because it is a reminder how urgent the need is to support those that do that. She said your father i will study lot and you always have your head high she was a 22 yearold with the save dreams that i had she refused to give up her studies despite the fact there groups threatened eddie one that continues university education. 60 years ago she boarded the bus where she was studying to go home to spend the ramadan the evening with her family and would never finish law school as a result. They stopped at said checkpoint from an Islamic Group carrying her school by she was taken off the bus and killed in the street in front of all the other passengers. Them and cover throat been told the others if you go to the university the day will come that we kill all of you just like this. She died at exactly 5 70 p. M. With which we go because when she fell industry her watch broke. Her mother showed me the watch and i noted how owe the second head and points up word she told her mother please put this in your head nothing will happen to us god willing but if something does happen to west also talky barristers you and dad must know that we are dead for college and hold your head high. As those of fundamentalist groups in the 90s no one has ever been brought to justice for her murder most or amnesty through the 2005 charter for peace and i should say clearly the only way to a dance to real democracy is to defeat fundamentalism it seeks to exploit any opening and i also believe that has to be accomplished in ways that they respect human rights and International Law like that People Struggle detailed n auerbach and i return to the memory as the watch stopped at 5 70 p. M. At the unimaginable loss but as i wrote in the book your fatwa does not apply here i found hope into things. The first is the strength of her family to continue telling her story despite an visa and going on with their lives and in factor sister overcame her own grief and went to law school in her sisters memory and practices today it is only possible because the fundamentalist groups did not take power in the country. But also a source of hope that for me her memory lives on today with ever people continue to fight against fundamentalism peacefully like in turkey or to be shot. So for me the hope lives on wherever people continue as she did to strive for knowledge even in the face of extremists of and to keep their heads held high. I would ask you if you are moved by the store is helping me to order them by sharing them and by sharing your fatwa does not apply here. Ultimately what this book is about comes from a slogan of the association of algerian victims and what they plucked at the center of their work is what they called the duty of memory about learning from the history that we and others do not have to relive its. Think you very much. [applause] they q professor bennoune. It is time for question and answers i your moderator. We have a large number so lets begin. To what extent is the fundamentalism movements used as a vehicle to advocate social change or are there other changes that will bypass the movement . Also what is the attraction of the fundamentalism . A and what happens to Government Protection and . We will start with three. In a certain context these movements are advocating political change and sometimes social change although more often in the social aspect of the project is more about charity they and shifting the distribution of wealth. What we have seed when the movements come into power but they dont really have is a political agenda and what has happened in egypt i think of a wonderful from a rights advocate who says saying a prayer over a broken pipe does not fix it. Saying is long is the solution looks great on a poster but what you do when you do with health care and in than make a modern economy function and . So what changes are they advocating . They seem pretty occupied with those certain issues having to do with witted and sexuality but there is a great question and to it would have to be specific but we dont have the time for that so forgive me i will generalized i see it depends on what is going on in that particular country they have positioned themselves to be against corruption although as we have steve they seem to carry on that tradition that they have inherited an end and now they have a religious cover to make it more difficult to criticize. Certainly the of repressive nature makes it seem like a better alternative in a certain context that they represent a continuation or a worsening of that and as a staunch opponent at first was hopeful when they took power in to visa and in some ways a step forward but within six months they understood that there is a transition at all but for them to be empowered to run the same system. The attraction to use religion in the name of god to appeal to people in what a wonderful tunisian activist said and i want to put it on a tshirt no one has the right to appoint themselves as the spokesperson of god. Sometimes these movements to that. Government protection is a very big question in that context where fundamentalists are in non governmental roles he attacked the the up population we have seen what is required and that is the case if algeria where i tell the story of the book there was a season and early in 1983 where they are targeting intellectuals for every Tuesday Morning a researcher with fall to a bullet and one tuesday somebody started to pound on the door at our house. We cannot figure out who it was and we never did but my father was terrified. Not for himself but because i was there with him and he called the police a and nobody answered the phone. To be fair. They were being slaughtered so police are also taking some very serious risk to protect the population but the regimes are more interested to protect their own interest identify and of the democratic opposition so may not have all the motivation they should have. That is why the International Community house to speak up when i spent the summer in to be sure there was an assassination while i was there of a deputy of the constituent assembly the outspoken critic of the government isnt now we find out they were warned by foreign intelligence agencies that he would be targeted and they did nothing to protect him. I cannot prove this but some on the ground may have been involved with the International Community has to step up to protect these people who are doing this work to challenge extremism. Great dancers and long question. On the issue of speaking up the next cluster address that. Who is responsible for the lack of voices criticizing the fundamentalist . Also the big population muslims in the u. S. White to the peaceloving people are not local to deals the atrocities . And often the issue of authenticity arise is when individuals criticize a certain cultural ideas dealing that secular individuals speaking against muslim fundamentalism were dismissed for not being authentic muslims and if so how do they make their voices heard . I was warda there ribby great questions. The with the lack of voices there is no lack of voice is those that do not get the microphone that is part of what my work was about those that may be working in languages other than english the work is not making it here. Somebody said what can we do to help . Get this peoples work from arabic or four c or russian translated heard here that is so important. It is hard even if you write in english even at the anniversary of September September 11th living in the area 10 years after retired wrote the piece why i hate al qaeda. It is a denunciation of this terrorism that has claimed the lives both of the 9 11 attacks we could not get it published. I tried so hard. By the by a feminist international lob logs saw the light but there are many people out there trying to make yourselves be heard but if you blow something up it is very easy to get on tv. Lets look at the complexity it is much more difficult to be heard and we need to change that. Now to Say Something that will sound contradictory but i do believe this is brilliant that you have to think two things at the same time and i think that is true. I would like to say a lot that is being done and must more be done it that would appeal in particular to those of the arab and Muslim American diaspora to the as courageous to speak out and i know it is difficult to do this. It is a threatening environment and if americans generally say what can you do to facilitate part of it is also combating discrimination to create the space that people can express themselves. So i was just in houston they cave very nearly on a saturday morning with their level of commitment people in the pakistan the community had the alliance for tolerance and compassion bringing pakistan these better shiites together to counteract violence in their country to build a coalition around the opposition in these efforts are so important even though a key and be done. Authenticity. This is a huge issue. I feel now you have a certain idea what it means to be muslim positive or negative stereotype that if you are a muslim woman you cover your head anyone that comes from the middle east war Northern Africa would call themselves a muslim rather than a citizen of their country or a man or woman or the ethnic group. We have stereotyped that in ways that are positive or negative but still a generalization that doesnt reflect the reality on the ground people of muslim heritage have just as many diverse religions relationships as those within the other background. Some practice different ways but it is still not the way that they would choose. I am turkish, algerian or south asian or so on. If there is one single thing those of what we now call muslim. And member of the audience says i have worked in International Development 50 years living in afghanistan in egypt and iraq this dialogue has been ongoing but prior to 9 11 activists were calling for a and intervention because of the treatment of women but nothing happened. Are we passed the point of dialogue . I take as if i ever think the use of force is necessary . Yes i do think it is inserting context menu are confronting groups that believe they are at war with the states or arm to occupiers to killed large numbers of a civilian population but the use of force whether local or international has to be carried out with humanitarian law to avoid civilian casualties but also respecting the u. N. Charter rules when force may be used also if we do use force we must follow through and it is the tragedy of afghanistan and. , i do believe the conflict that was legal and what was not people assimilate they are different but where we got afghanistan wrong was going into iraq not spending the money on the ground for development but to so many people in afghanistan in 2005 were so happy the taliban was overthrown. Taxi drivers, but we took our eye off the ball and did not follow through and now i fear this situation reid will leave them in and. One of the afghan women i interviewed for the book, of very prominent humanrights activist who lost family when the International Community what had happened in her country she said when the International Troops leave, if the International Community does not care about what happens here we will find ourselves in a worse situation than we were in before. The great fear is womens rights and keep the womens issues is the bargaining chip for that the west will make peace with the moderate taliban but with the rush to get out of afghanistan with some form of honor we will make those concessions and then the the terrible situation on the ground another woman a interviewed said everybody talks about leaving afghanistan with dignity but baby their dignity but not the Afghan People we have to evade committed it is equally important and in fact, the two things are related. Sari. That was a very long in conservative very important question. I will go ahead and ask this anyway so what should or what could moderate muslims do in the face of islamist terrorism . There are so many things that could be done. What people did on the ground is a womens group in algeria that means prepuce in arabic but also the acronym of the organization and after a bomb attack they would go out and protest at the bomb crater. They would say you can protect us or not but we are staying in the day mobilized thousands and thousands over time those that to go out to have these mass demonstrations when they could be cave met target. With the Security Forces were important to curb the worst of the terrorism this mobilization was absolutely critical. This is the people can do on the front lines but theyd need to do much more every single time there is an attack to have websites or issue statements and with the arab and muslim populations their organizations that work against discrimination that will speak out with u. S. Violations or israeli violations and i support all of that but we need to be just as vigilant a and outspoken it shocks me every week there are scores of iraqis killed in ordinary men and women killed in sectarian violence and i dont hear espy as vocal as we should about that and overtime of frantic calls it the third world body count it happens every week he and you dont notice. But if we responded each time with a statement that could become to make a difference so the rest of the user is in the book. Which is fabulous i could not put it down and i was in tears for many parts because people are so incredibly brave just beyond the imagination we live in a cushy society and these are people putting their lives on the line to fight extremism. Wind of the suggestions is that the source of follow the money . Many of these have Copious Amounts of funding in this is another place the u. S. Has to ask questions about its own policy why were such strong supporters of these regimes why theyre called a moderate when they are anything but but instead arabia women cannot even drive what you hear a girly is we dont want to be like the gulf they can live the way they want even in that context they would say there are new ways of living impose on people that do not reflect how people used to live 20 and 30 years ago in egypt and external funding for the Muslim Brotherhood was a huge issue to hundreds of millions of pounds end the question is what types of resources is there to support the upon the . Because then there hypocritically exercised for an external support but what they actually receive is minuscule compared to what the opponents are receiving but i do think we need to follow the money and where our money has gone in the past. The causes of fundamentalism that there are an external and internal consequences and cause is to do have to look and all of those you dont put the blame on the edge external funding but what weve poured into the program regardless of how extreme the ideology was even the group added is headed by those that have terrible consequences by both when the cold war was over but also across the region because he alone disaffected men came from military and morocco it was a huge issue period they participated in the jihad and they got trading in and learned how to use weapons then they went back paul and the problem metastasized so following the money is absolutely critical. There is a question in here about what will it take for women to realize there 50 contribution to the process . As the twig is beat so goes the tree for a living are the first of the cautious to murder the women of the young girls. That is interesting women are implicated all aspects just as men are but i would not say that so many women have sees that responsibility to breakout to organize against fundamentalism in i have met them with their regions of afghanistan in west africa and so on. Many women have the critical roles they can play inveigled support they are fighting the uphill battle and sometimes taking a great risk to fight that battle and for example, there is a small section of a lesbian access not how they define themselves they use a different descriptor but that is how we would define them here but i cannot even use their name but they are on the ground in pakistan in a very difficult environment continually in the ways that they cant with a support group for clear people to beat each other to have a social life to promote publications of the Lgbt Community and of way to take on the issue and what they really needed is now working to have a transnational network of support that their opponents but those living under muslim law that is a wonderful transnational that work from west africa to south asia with a diaspora to allow women to come together through the internet to share strategies what has worked in what have they been to read to get others to campaign are there women in nigeria . Trial servers going from malaysia to the woman in fiji as an incredible model and id think that really needs to be supported to facilitate the taking of responsibility. What is the difference between the brotherhood and fundamentalism . You would get a lot of very different answers if you ask different people that question and this is what i struggled with in my book because i have to do strategically essentializes to speak generally well still recognizing the peculiarities of the movement to end you can see the language i use of the book. The moslem brotherhood is a trance national Political Movement or social movement with Political Parties and a different context starting in egypt but now we see it is in many countries of the gulf across all of africa and to visa. To be shot. It is described as a misnomer i seek is a radical project to change the way people live not preserving it but they are argued to have the most rigid interpretation of islam and the career and i would actually defend they come from outer space i am not quite sure where they come from but this is controversial if you talk to a lot of people on the ground right now confronting the fundamentalist. Theyre frustrated we refer to them as moderate but they say actually fit is opening the door for the Orange Movement pushing us in the direction of a more a and more radical interpretation of islam so just protect perhaps that is worse it does not mean you should use the label moderate. 84 risk student of mine wrote it email that said that means that you kill your fellow muslims that dont kill westerners. So wild it is important many people on the ground see the relationship between these movements and the networks that is important to understand as well. This is a Commonwealth Club program the book is your fatwa does not apply here todays speaker is professor Karima Bennoune author of Karima Bennoune unfortunately we have time for only one last question how are moderate muslims fair rain today . The easy question for last. [laughter] how were they ferrying today . From what i have been hearing from what i have heard there is frustration about the lack of International Understanding they are critical of repression but also extremely critical of the violence of the Muslim Brotherhood a and the fis supporters with the brotherhoods threats against violence against christians against muslims that are known to speak out there is a very moving oped from a journalist described life is like now due to the level of threats he gets from the Muslim Brotherhood and it reminded me so much of algeria in the 1990s. Is so vital will look at their reid to threats so that is the challenge that is posed for humanrights that is what they would impose an that was not the ideology what they revolted for they wanted more freedom but what they got unfortunately is less, less free them for women but with syria that is a complex topic beyond my scope to respond at the end of the presentation but i have heard very disturbing reports of sexual assaults of women very grave rapes perpetrated by the state forces but also armed groups ian as i said we have to look very carefully at those threats by the regime but also the of gravel rebel groups cetera al qaeda people of the religious minorities are also very frightened what it means if those rebel groups took over the debate cannot be a simple one if we use force or we dont that we dont do anything else in the International Community has to be engaged not just with chemical weapons but trying to produce a situation that is a greater humanrights we have seen the transitions that women have a lot to lose so in the transition is not necessarily a good wide. 82 professor Karima Bennoune author of your fatwa does not apply here we also think our audience as well and those listening to us on the radio and on the internet id and sees p. M. To. I would like to remind the audience there will be a book signing after the talks so stick around to get your copy signed by a teeeighteen. Find out more at Karima Bennoune. Com. Karima bennoune. Com. This meeting of the Commonwealth Club of College California celebrating 100 tenures of enlightened discussion is adjourned. [applause] almost 80 years since they bought the house of the all white neighborhood on the side of detroit. Not in defense of eddie grand principle but they simply wanted a home in a safe and secure neighborhood a home to raise their baby daughter. But a simple decision did raise principles because it forced them to confront the power of racial segregation. By then the south had embraced jim crow but at that moment this summer of 1925 segregation was spreading north as well splitting cities along the, forcing africanamericans into neighborhoods and creating the racial ghetto. So which has happened in the intervening decade the system of apartheid toppled of what is the greatest accomplishment of american democracy in the 20th century. The law under separate waiting rooms are rules of the back of the bus but in what is largely in place almost all of urban america including this extraordinary city we hear it at the moment