German parliamentarians to visit german soldiers and so we had to change that and pull our troops out so theres a lot of things where one is unreliable and now he needs our help and that is a moment where we should have very Firm Conditions under which we will give him financial it own posner president had wanted to play. Oh yeah definitely i mean. He started out as an economic reform. Important point and the west especially europe welcomed that and the idea was that turkey with this is a mild brand of islam is and could go Beyond Kemalist Nationalism and the. Kurds and turks and other minorities can find Common Ground in in being turkish and islamic and at the same time having this economic reform but. For whatever reason he abandoned that course he has abandoned the course of reconciliation of the kurds
hes also abandoned economic reform in favor of easy money looks good can build a huge president ial palace in a symbol can build a bridge across the bosphorus all financed with easy money most of it going to firms which in our in his orbit of the orbit of his family and that has ruined ruined the economy the problem is do the turks realise that its his fault or is it succeeding in in peddling the notion that its actually the fault of the especially The Americans with the sanctions and the west and so on who are anti turkish and so on so thats something we need to counter. Well as all of us just mentioned president one has accused the United States of launching a what he has called an attempt to economic against turkey lets get a feel for what the president himself and some of his turkish compatriots have been say. So there is no difference between the attacks on our economy and the attacks
on our religion and our nation the goal is the same and that is to bring turkey and its people to their knees and hold them hostage. Yupp them doesnt let The Americans impose their sanctions we have a president well find back on were not finished yet i had a few dollars and i went right out and exchanged them. Dont. You know if we stick together the u. S. Sanctions wont have any effect on us maybe this will bring us closer together. The addition to. Its commands this affects all of us became everythings more expensive prices have doubled what will happen next. Its bad enough for us older folks what about the young people of his and their future. Citizens are you were spoiling his will listen to that report yes because you can
because and another thing we ought to do. Dont you village definitely needs to get his turkish t. V. Program up and running and to really create an alternative source of information in turkey the way Radio Free Europe and other did during the cold war towards the east this is so important that the turks have nor tentative narrative of what actually people in the west feel about while we are offering this economic help which we should. Waiting for the government to do this and we should all know its not its not happening. Its not happening i think it should happen turkeys government violates human rights took he has arrested german citizens the. Court as we heard has prevented German Parliamentarians from visiting troops in the field serving for nato in turkey and youll saying there should be
a softly softly approach and lots further sanctions on turkey as i understand it. Yes firstly the softly softly of approach seems to of work for instance with my colleague dennis eugen who was imprisoned on trumped up charges no pun intended accused of spying simply for doing his job and there are hundreds of others still in prison who dont have a German Parliament passport as dennis did and and and. You know i mean its horrible but i still think. That we have to somehow at the same time is helping them economic help in turkey economically which important country mustnt break down and theres another reason for this when a country goes into economic downturns fire like in venezuela revolution doesnt happen thats when people are so busy scrambling for bread in a time to think about politics and changing regime its when people of more or less
ok that they think about politics and and so you know we have no vested interest in seeing turkey going down the sink crystal from russia you know but i would rather are not soft soft now is the time for pressure and for our influence to achieve corrections in the course of president hes trying to blackmail us all the time he just when he needs our help now he is offering or he released a german talking journalist just a few days ago to make nice weather nice feelings but he didnt change course and time is not on his site so the first country which would be interested turkey doesnt goes down the drain is talking and the first leader who should be interested should be president yes we can help him but under a very Firm Conditions and this is the moment where we can finally influence wrong talkers behavior and try to get him to correct his course and that is his financial
course this economic course and how he deals with allies he is an unreal. Able ally and you can be a free rider in nato just using nato when it needs when you need it and not paying attention to the interests of you are closest allies like United States and germany when you think you have other interests and russia or china is not a serious a turn a turf for. For the long range a policy where they want to find their place in the world. The question is before we talk about the conditionality in the terms they would have to be struck for germany helping turkey the lets just address the question of whats would happen if turkey and germany and europe to turn a blind eye to this time of crisis if they look the other way and say we cant support a country thats no longer committed to democracy what would happen heres a take on that question. The e. U. Is turkeys largest Trading Partner by far the biggest investor as well so
a recession in turkey would be bad news for many european businesses. European banks especially those in france italy and spain would be hit hard if turkish businesses couldnt pay back loans denominated in euros dollars. Fare the economic trouble in turkey could also have serious political consequences some experts predict a new set in refugees and warn that domestic extremist groups could try to take advantage of the economic and political turmoil. That the president added one keeps blaming the west for his problems he threaten to changi water authoritarian states like china and russia turkey might even decide to leave nato. What does the economic and political instability in turkey mean for the rest of the wild. How dangerous is an unstable turkeys i think its very dangerous i agree the first
to lose would be turkey thats true but maybe the second to lose would be europe its very close we have to think geographically. There are three point five million Syrian Refugees in Turkey Turkish government as a swarm of that around four million. There is a huge refugee deal that has been struck and it seems to be functioning what would happen if turkey were really to go down where are all these people going to go what about the turkish citizens look at venezuela. Of course turkey is not at that point but just thinking of the worst Case Scenario what is going to happen to all those people are they going to stay are they going to look for Better Options so i feel its very very dangerous for turkey and for for the European Union for turkey to be left alone at a time like this. The Refugee Issue is a very grave and serious issue here what about the status of turkey in nato could
turkey eventually withdraw from nato how serious is that for i dont think that the threat is really big of course theres a certain risk and we dont want to push them in that direction but if turkey has its census together they Wouldnt Leave nato because of their own Rational National interest and so the question is now how do we balance turkish interests and our interests and im rather im not for soft conditions im also not somebody is saying just we dont have to we can turn a blind eye on it doesnt matter of us or of course it matters but we should be aware of our own influence and how important we are for them and i for other the feeling that we are much more important to alto on and the well being of turkey than turkey is dependent and then we depend on talkies well being of course we depend on it but we have the better karts and that should be the condition for
a fair deal that we are aware of our possibilities and our influence and how much do one needs europe and the west to modernize turkey to stabilize turkey and to get sea economy going again and then these are the conditions for a fair deal and turkish would be interested in it we should be interested but we shouldnt make a too cheap deal from our side actually a good time to to help turkey to get back on the democracy trappy yacc and first on the economic stability track and then of course. Democracy how it works in germany and france i dont think its realistic to expect that this is the way turkish democracy will look like on the other one in the next years i mean he just its a country hes a new assault on hes hes almost an autocratic leader said. Is no longer going to be honest not all this talk of Pious Conditionality is not going to be listening
hes going to be looking the other way no no he is listening and you mentioned of the deal about the refugees this thing is working so if we if we strike a deal under the right terms hes willing to to respect the deal of that is that is my lesson i draw from the. Deal with turkey all of. This is. To say because its a german way of looking at things that somehow people states and leaders of states are rational actors theyre not look at putin look at trump. Look at some of the things our own leadership has done look at greece i mean you know. Look at venezuela look at mr maduro rationality does not impinge on politics especially not on autocrats therefore if turkey goes down the drain just turkey the this is will not mean the end of mr i dont just give him an opportunity to ramp up
his his autocratic way of dealing with society that everyone i mean its. People in times of stress people to dictators when they feel a little better they think about democracy thats the way things go and this idea that were all rational actors is just not borne out by reality so the point is now we are interested that Turkey Doesnt Go Down The Drain economically thats a prime interest because if it does go down the drain economic Everything Else goes down the drain now if we help them will that Help Democracy we dont know. We dont know but we should make that a conditionality if because they wont accept to they would accept it every every hour every i Wouldnt Make Democracy Point Part of the conditionality but i think leaders are behaving rationally its just a question what you call rational and irrational of course the facts are known i dont know of course the interest of mr. Is to get
a deal as cheap as possible and our interest is to get a deal which is not cheap but which meets most of our conditions so there is this and hes using and highway talking like mr trump is on that deals in time time is not understand out of sight and that is our possibility our options now to influence and speed in office since Two Thousand And Three doesnt look as though its going to be walking away from the presidency anytime soon. Yeah but he has changed a lot i mean at the beginning when when i do our first came to power we had still very much the thinking of a military regimes we had in turkey before and he was that at times European Union and that was our common interest to liberalize talk a society because it was his way to get also more religious freedom which was a no go under the military rulers before at that time we had to come an interest and now his interest has changed now he himself is you dominating factor he himself
is the autocratic factor in the political spectrum and here we are dont have the common interests here we try to correct his course and that was the moment to do that but at that time with the European Union do they they they said ok we dont want turkish membership well give them a Privileged Partnership so this Again Drew Turkey back and now at this point i think its really really important that turkey doesnt feel itself left alone again you are so much mistrust between the two sides the. America who always made it clear that she opposes turkish entry to the e. U. Which was always viewed as an insult and at the same time. President her once ranting and raving about german german nazi procedures and attitudes which she just has done on a many occasions has been perceived as insulting as well and how is it possible to see Uncle Americal and president one sitting down trump style and striking a deal. Its very difficult. But it is i think believe
both leaders should should really sit down and look for a reasonable solution we would we expect them to be reasonable this is what its not always the case as weve seen it im very optimistic thats exactly what what they will do its not going to happen over the next case but i expect to see this russian no deal and compromise over the next weeks and maybe two three months because the house is on fire and when the house is on fire. Fire you dont have the luxury to discuss things just call the firefighters in this time its as if a natural firefighters that is the International Monetary fund this is help from the European Union and the other one has to meet certain conditions set us all what im saying im expecting that that is going to happen i still believe in this kind of rationality of course he has to sell it to mystically and he will sell it. The restore its how he sell it will sound very different than how we will sell it to
our audience but that small in International Politics is that. I mean i hope youre right ok i hope youre right but look. Argentina was in a similar situation a couple of months back and they called in the i. M. F. The five five s. As you say and they have back on course with i am and directives of whos being called by mr Out Hes Calling Qatar qatar which is basically the arab agent of iran and they were going to lend him billions of billions of dollars and i feel you know if we dont make an alternative off and say look dont take the money from qatar the conditions are going to be awful youre going to lose everything you say take our money we also impose conditions you know which are nice to you but at least were back on the right side of history thats what we should be doing thats what im saying is that of sort of keeping off as if it was nothing to do with us because every of the same side except of course the alternative up not to trip
rather a little bit more come to saida i think a lot of our viewers will be listening and thinking asking themselves the question whether there is a sense that germany has a special responsibility for turkey and its population of eighty Million People given that there is such a subset a large Turkish Community in germany which many very many people are aware of what would your take be on that question of course theres this extreme historic tie there all these people with turkish original living here about three Million People so of course its a very very important partner in turkey and theyre very important part so this is a window of opportunity where that where there could be a reset on Turkish German relations. He hopefully hopefully thats what im what im hoping for if if if president are to one doesnt make interesting statements as he did in the previous two years it would be it would be an opening for for turkey and germany to get closer again. Let it be known she hasnt actually come out and
spoken exposed explicitly on what you know all that weve been talking about but she has let it be known that she herself does not favor Financial Aid from germany to turkey at this point in time is she getting it right or is she getting it wrong. Well first theres theres this upcoming summit in turkey on syria theyre going to be meeting there and then present on is going to be coming here before that the Finance Ministers are going to be again meeting and berlin so i think this is a process thats going to kind of allow the leaders to see and talk Behind Closed Doors and im a little bit look at how they can manage a deal probably self course more who doesnt want to give an open check to to iran that would be a long wrong thing to do definitely. Getting it right or getting it wrong i want. To get enough right. Now still far from where she is getting it right because this is not about a Bilateral Agreement its the deal with the United States with the i. M. F. With europe ok thank you all for that thanks very much indeed for joining me today
crisis in turkey showdown europe proper veteran thats been our debate i hope we can. Come back next week by bike. World according to the. Fifteen. More. Money its all happening books of british after the flood sure link to news from africa and the world. Your link to exceptions stories and discussions hello and welcome to news after coming from family from born in germany. From the news of easy to our website debbie and it comes to the traffic come join us on facebook at g. W. For go for. His creations fix his brand mystical calm left office icon of the fashion world. Look what do we really know
about the man behind the dark sheets what motivates him how does he think and feel good moments in the life of a great Fashion Designer business on smash and cut off from the start september ninth two w. In may Nine Hundred Sixty Eight and now crying and going around the world. Young people are dead against the current Generation Big make up was an obsolete and dusty full of stupidity endlessly. They demanded nothing less than a whole society full blown wide maelstrom of Incest Gun Violence plaguing girls her remember them. For the first time i had a feeling of being a part of something. The seeds of civil rights the peace movement. For a plan. Nine hundred sixty eight. The global revolt starts september
vimarsana.com © 2020. All Rights Reserved.