Transcripts For KPIX 60 Minutes 20131125

Pelley weve seen a lot of stories about veterans and post Traumatic Stress disorder, but tonight, for the first time, were able to show you new therapies that are changing the lives of vets and their families. After eight weeks here, how are you doing . How am i doing . I dont know yet. Thats an honest answer. But i know deep down inside, things will work themselves out. People assume, when my hair is long, that im a lot cooler than i actually am. Im not opposed to this misconception. Cooper Malcolm Gladwell is a bestselling author who has made a career by challenging conventional wisdom. In his new book, he questions history, business, sports, even the wisdom of sending your kid to an ivy league school. If harvard is 60,000, and university of toronto, where i went to school, is maybe 6,000, so youre really telling me that education is ten times better at harvard than it is at university of toronto . That seems ridiculous to me. Im steve kroft. Im lesley stahl. Im morley safer. Im lara logan. Im anderson cooper. Im scott pelley. Those stories tonight on 60 minutes. I started parttime, now im a manager. N. My employer matches my charitable giving. Really. I get bonuses even working parttime. Where i work, over 400 people are promoted every day. Healthcare starting under 40 a month. I got education benefits. I work at walmart. Im a pharmacist. Sales associate. I manage produce. I work in logistics. Theres more to walmart than you think. Vo opportunity. Thats the real walmart. So, if youre sleeping in your contact lenses, what you wear to bed is your business. Ask about the air optix® contacts so breathable theyre approved for up to 30 nights of continuous wear. Serious eye problems may occur. Ask your doctor and visit airoptix. Com for Safety Information and a free onemonth trial. Theres a lot i had to do. Watch my diet. Stay active. Start insulin. Today, i learned theres something i dont have to do anymore. 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And tonight, youll hear it from the gaskos neighbors and, for the first time, from the federal agents who finally unraveled the case, with the help of a boob job and an alley cat. If you were forced into retirement, with a comfortable nest egg and a desire to be left completely alone, there is no place better place than santa monica, california. This low key, seaside suburb of l. A. Is shared by transients and tourists, hippies and hedonists, celebrities and lots of Senior Citizens attracted to the climate and an abundance of inexpensive, rentcontrolled apartments just a few blocks from the ocean. Places like the princess eugenia on third street, which is where charlie and carol gasko, a childless couple from chicago, lived for 14 years without attracting much attention from longtime neighbors or landlords. What were they like . Josh bond they were, like, the nice retired old couple that lived in the apartment next to me. Kroft good tenants . Bond excellent tenants. Never complained, always paid rent on time. Kroft in cash. Bond in cash. Kroft Janus Goodwin lived down the hall. Janus goodwin they had nothing. And they never went out. They never had food delivered. She never dressed nicely. Kroft you thought they were poor . Goodwin yes, without a doubt. Kroft the one thing everyone remembers about the gaskos is that they loved animals and always made a fuss over the ones in the neighborhood. Barbara gluck remembers that carol gasko always fed a stray cat after its owner had died. Barbara gluck she would pet it, you know, and be sweet to it, and then she put a plate of food, like, out here. Kroft she liked the cat . Gluck obviously. She loved the cat. We all liked the cat, but she was taking care of the cat. Kroft and what about Charlie Gasko . Gluck you know, he always had a hat on and dark glasses. I have to say it was mysterious to me why a lovely woman like that was hanging out with that guy, that old grumpy man. I could never figure that one out. Until i heard they had 800,000 something dollars in the wall. laughter and then i went, oh, okay, you know . Kroft money wasnt the only thing found in the gaskos apartment on june 22, 2011, when the fbi stopped by and ended what it called the most extensive manhunt in the bureaus history. Scott garriola weapons all over the apartment. I mean, weapons by his nightstand, weapons under the windowsill. Shotguns, minirugers, rifles. Kroft loaded . Garriola loaded, ready to go. Kroft what had started out as a routine day for special agent scott garriola, who was in charge of hunting fugitives in l. A. , would turn into one of the most interesting days of his career. After getting a call to stake out a building in santa monica, he notified his back up team with the l. A. P. D. Garriola i had four guys working that day, and i said, we got a tip on Whitey Bulger, and ill see you there in about an hour. And invariably the texts return, whos Whitey Bulger . Kroft really . Garriola yeah, a few of them. So i had to remind them. Gently remind them who Whitey Bulger was. Kroft that he was number one of the fbis most wanted list. Garriola number. Number one. Number one, yeah. Big east coast figure, but. So, on the west coast, not so much. Kroft the cops in l. A. Were focused on gangbangers and cartel members, not some retired irish mobster who hadnt been spotted in 16 years. But then, few mobsters have ever been as infamous in a city as Whitey Bulger was in boston, and his reputation was for more than just being grumpy. Besides extortion and flooding the city with cocaine, bulger routinely performed or ordered executions, some at close range, some with a hail of bullets, and at least one by strangulation, after which, its said, he took a nap. Special agent rich teahan, who ran the fbis Whitey Bulger Fugitive Task force, had heard it all. Rich teahan bulger was charged with 19 counts of murder. He was charged with other crimes. He was a scourge to the society in south boston, his own community. Kroft he was also a scourge to the fbi, and a great source of embarrassment to teahan, special agent phil torsney, and others on the fbi task force. Years earlier, Whitey Bulger had infiltrated the Boston Office of the fbi and bought off agents, who protected him and plied him with information, including the tip that allowed bulger to flee just days before he was to be indicted. Phil torsney we really had to catch this guy to establish credibility after all the other issues. And it was just a matter of bringing this guy back to boston, to make sure this guy didnt die or get away with this thing. Kroft when torsney, whos now retired, and agent Tommy Macdonald joined the task force in 2009, the joke was bulger was on the fbis least wanted list. There hadnt been a credible lead in more than a decade. And their efforts in bulgers Old Neighborhood of south boston were met with mistrust and ridicule. Torsney some people, they told us right out front, you guys arent looking for that guy. People just made the assumption we had him stashed somewhere. I mean, people really thought that kind of thing. Tommy macdonald despite that mindset that were not going to help you, the fbi still got it done. Kroft took 16 years. Macdonald took 16 years. Yeah, this was not a typical fugitive. Kroft the fbi says bulger had planned his getaway years in advance, with money set aside and a fake identity for a thomas baxter. During his first two years on the lam, bulger was in touch with friends and family shuttling between new york, chicago, and the resort town of grand isle, louisiana, where he rented a home until his identity was compromised. After that, it seemed as if bulger had disappeared from the face of the earth, except for the alleged sightings all over the world. How many of these tips do you think might have been true . Torsney boy, there was thousands and thousands of tips, and i think. I dont think that any of them were true. Kroft one of the obstacles was there were really no good photographs of bulger or his longtime livein girlfriend Catherine Greig, a former dental hygienist. The fbi often noted that the couple shared a love of animals, especially dogs and cats, and asked veterinarians to be on the lookout. There were reports that greig once had Breast Implants and other Plastic Surgery in boston, so the task force reached out to physicians. Eventually, they got a call from a dr. Matthias donelan, who had located her files in storage. Macdonald i was trying to leave the office a little early to catch one of my kids ballgames. And i said, well, listen, im going to swing by in the morning and pick those up. And they said to me, do you want the photos, too . And i said, you have photos . And they said, yeah, we have photos. I said, well be there in 15 minutes. Kroft the Breast Implant lead produced a treasure trove of High Resolution Catherine Greig photographs that would help crack the case. The fbi decided to switch strategies, going after the girlfriend in order to catch the gangster. This is an announcement by the fbi. Kroft the fbi created this Public Service announcement. 60yearold greig is the girlfriend of 81yearold bulger. Kroft it ran it in 14 markets on daytime talk shows, aimed at women. Call the tip line at 1800callfbi. Kroft and it didnt take long. The very next morning, the bulger task force got three messages from someone that used to live in santa monica, and was 100 certain that charlie and carol gasko, apartment 303 at the princess eugenia apartments, were the people they were looking for. The descriptions and the age difference matched, and deputy u. S. Marshall neil sullivan, who handled the lead, said there was another piece of tantalizing information. Neil sullivan the tipster specifically described that they were caring for this cat and their love for this cat. So that was just one piece of the puzzle on the tip that just added up to saying, if this isnt them, its something we better check out immediately because it sure sounds like them. A search of the fbis computer database for the gaskos raised another red flag not for what it found, but for what it didnt. Sullivan basically, like, they were ghosts kroft no drivers license. Sullivan exactly. No drivers license, no california i. D. , like they didnt exist. Kroft thats the apartment. Garriola right, that corner on the third floor. Kroft on the righthand side . Garriola yep. Kroft by early afternoon, fbi agent Scott Gariolla had set up a number of surveillance posts, and had already met with apartment manager josh bond to talk about his tenants. Bond he closed the door, threw down a folder and opened it up and said, are these the people that live in apartment 303 . Kroft did you say anything when you saw the pictures . Bond my initial reaction was, holy bleep . Kroft youre living next door to a gangster. Bond well, i still didnt really know who he was. Kroft but it didnt take him long to figure it out. While the fbi was mulling its options, bond logged on to bulgers wikipedia page. Bond and im kind of scrolling down. Its like, oh, wow, this guys serious. Its, like, murders and extortion. And then, i get to the bottom and theres this. This thing. Its like, from one of his old, you know, people saying, well, the last time i saw him, he. He said, you know, when he goes out, hes. Hes going to have guns and hes going to be ready to take people with him. I was like, ooh, maybe i shouldnt be involved in this. laughs kroft i mean, we were sitting here laughing about it, but he is a pretty serious guy. Bond yeah, yeah. Kroft and he killed a lot of people, or had them killed bond i didnt know that at the time. Kroft bond told the fbi he wasnt going to knock on the gaskos door, because there was a note posted expressly asking people not to bother them. Carol had told the neighbors that charlie was showing signs of dementia. Garriola so we were back there. Kroft so, garriola devised a ruse involving the gaskos storage locker in the garage. Garriola it had the name gasko across it and apartment 303. Kroft he had the manager call to tell them their locker had been broken into, and that he needed someone to come down to see if anything was missing. Carol gasko said her husband would be right down. Garriola we just rushed him. Kroft you mean guns out . Fbi, dont move garriola gave the words, hey, fbi, you know. Get your hands up. Hands went up right away. And then, at that moment, we told him get down on his knees and he gave us. Yeah, he gave us a i aint getting down on my fing knees. Kroft didnt want to get his pants dirty. Garriola didnt want to get his pants dirty. You know, wearing white and seeing the oil on the ground, i guess he didnt want to get down in oil. Kroft even at 81, this was a man used to being in control. Garriola i asked him to identify himself and that didnt go over well. He asked me to fing identify myself, which i did. And i asked him, i said, are you Whitey Bulger . He said, yes. Just about that moment, someone catches my attention from a few feet away by the elevator shaft. Kroft it was Janus Goodwin from the third floor, coming to do her laundry. Goodwin and i said, excuse me. I think i can help you. This man has dementia, so if hes acting oddly, you know, that could be why. Garriola immediately, what flashed through my mind is, oh, my god, i just arrested an 81 yearold man with alzheimers who thinks hes Whitey Bulger. What is he going to tell me next, hes elvis . So i said, do me a favor. This woman over here says you have a touch of alzheimers, and he said, dont listen to her, shes fing nuts. He says, im james bulger. Kroft a few minutes later he confirmed it, signing a consent form allowing the fbi to search his apartment. Garriola as hes signing, he says, thats the first time ive signed that name in a long time. Kroft there was a sense of resignation . Garriola i dont think he had it. I did ask him, i said, hey, whitey, i said, arent you relieved that you dont have to look over your shoulder anymore and, you know, its come to an end . And he said, are you bleep nuts . laughs kroft but, in some ways, Whitey Bulger and Catherine Greig had already been prisoners in apartment 303, which appeared to be a mixture of the murderous and the mundane. Alongside the weapons and all the money, they had stockpiled a lifetime supply of cleansers, creams, and detergents. The fbi took special interest in a collection of 64ounce bottles with white socks stretched over the top. Garriola i said, hey whitey, what are these . Are these some kind of molotov cocktail youre making . He goes, no, he said, i buy tube socks from the 99 cents store, and theyre too tight on my calves and thats the way i stretch them out. I said, why you shopping at the 99 cent store . You have half a Million Dollars under your bed. He goes, i had to make the money last. Kroft its been said that one of the reasons it took so long to catch Whitey Bulger is that people were looking for a gangster, and bulger, whether he liked it or not, had ceased to be one. Torsney he said it was hard to keep up that mindset of a criminal. And thats part of the reason he came down to that garage. He said, if he was on his game, you know, 15, 20, 30 years ago, he probably would have sensed something there. It was hard to stay on that edge, that criminal edge, after being on the lam as a regular citizen for 15 years. Kroft the master manipulator gave credit to Catherine Greig for keeping him crimefree, hoping it would mitigate her sentence. She is now serving eight years for harboring a fugitive. On the long plane ride back to boston, bulger told his captors that he became obsessed with not getting caught, and would do anything to avoid it, even if it meant obeying the law. Whitey bulgers biggest fear, they said, was being discovered dead in his apartment and he had a plan to avoid it. Torsney if he became ill and knew he was on his deathbed, hed go down to arizona, crawl down in the bottom of one of these mines, and die and decompose. And hope. Hope that we would never find him and still be looking. Looking for him forever. Cbs money watch update sponsored by glor good evening. The nuclear deal gives iran access to 4 billion in frozen oil revenue, but its not allowed any new sales. Japan airlines is pulling airliners from two routes because of an engine icing problem. And Online Gambling is legal in new jersey as of tuesday. Im jeff glor, cbs news. You really love, what would you do . [ woman ] id be a writer. [ man ] id be a baker. [ woman ] i wanna be a pie maker. [ man ] i wanna be a pilot. [ woman ] id be an architect. What if i told you someone could pay you and what if that person were you . When you think about it, isnt that what retirement should be, paying ourselves to do what we love . Paying ourselves to do what we love . Pelley weve seen a lot of stories about veterans and post Traumatic Stress disorder, but tonight, for the first time, were able to show you new therapies that are changing the lives of vets and their families. Two million americans have served in afghanistan and iraq. The Veterans Administration tells us that one out of five suffers from p. T. S. D. One reason were seeing so much of it is because many of our troops have been ordered on combat tours three, four, or even five times. The v. A. , overwhelmed by the need, decided to try new treatments that were originally designed for rape victims. Over two months, we were allowed to sit in and listen as our troubled veterans fought the war within. How can you live the life when everyone is afraid of you . You go to town and people say, thats the crazy vet. Dont mess with him. My wife told me, somethings got to change or we got to leave. Anthony apellido when you try to talk to somebody that hasnt been there, hasnt experienced it, they dont understand. And so you just kind of get laughed at. Pelley the 16 men around this table arrived via afghanistan, iraq, or both. Some are here from vietnam. I see that i do have the opportunity to pick myself up at 63 years old and start all over again. Pelley theyve started over again many times, but their path has led back to isolation, drugs, booze, and suicide attempts. Now, theyre in the v. A. Hospital in little rock, arkansas, where they will live for eight weeks to break through the emotions that have derailed their lives. Eric collins depression, anxiety, anger, worthlessness, guilt. Pelley guilt . Collins survivors guilt. Why me . Why am i alive . Why are they not . Thats one of the hardest thoughts to deal with, you know . Pelley eric collins was wounded in a rocket attack in afghanistan. Over a year, 17 of his buddies died. How did you cope with these feelings of anger and depression and guilt when you first got out . Collins alcohol, and lots of it. Thats where it started off. And the alcohol led to my depression worsening, which led to more substance abuse. Crack cocaine is my drug of choice. So my whole life spiraled downward out of control. Pelley to take control, collins volunteered for one of the new therapies called prolonged exposure. It forces him to work at remembering every detail of what hes tried to forget. Collins next thing, i hear a loud boom, my ears start ringing. And i wake up, open my eyes and im on the ground. Pelley dr. Kevin reeder runs the program. Dr. Kevin reeder how are you feeling at this point . What were you. What were you feeling at that time . Collins anger. Im scared. Im feeling pain my leg, my back, my arm, my whole body. Reeder okay, lets go from the beginning. Got to keep doing this. Collins the next thing i know, i hear a loud boom. Pelley they call it prolonged exposure because collins will relive the story of the attack five times a session. Theres a tape running, and hell listen to his memory throughout the day to break its power. Tell me about prolonged exposure therapy. Reeder sure. Theyve done everything they can to push these memories away. In the process, they havent gained a full realization of the impact and the meaning that these stories have on their lives. I like to use the term, were staring the dragon in the eye. Pelley where do these therapies come from . Reeder a lot of these therapies came about with survivors of physical or sexual abuse, those types of traumas. Pelley what are the similarities . Reeder the symptoms. The symptoms the avoidance, the isolation, the hyper vigilance, extreme anxiety, the irritability, inability to sleep, nightmares same thing; different sources, but same thing. Collins i cant move my legs, cant move my arms. Pelley what does that do for you . Collins it helps me to get past the guilt, survivors guilt. And thats a building block. Every time i get through it, i get stronger and it helps every time. Pelley its okay to be alive . Collins yeah. Pelley and you werent sure that was true before . Collins no, i didnt want to be alive. I wanted to. I wanted to be right there with them. My whole purpose of life was gone. Apellido to lose one of your buddies in a firefight, you dont want to see that, you dont want to feel that again. And so, when you get back to the rear, youre pissed off because you dont want to get close to anybody anymore. Pelley anthony apellido experienced those multiple tours we talked about. He fought for a year in afghanistan, spent one month at home, then went to iraq, and later, afghanistan again. Apellido the more deployments you get, the more time you spend out there, it just keeps on stacking. I mean, the first one, it hurts, but you dont get really time to heal. And then, another one happens and another one. Pelley on his first tour, apellidos patrol was ambushed. Two buddies died and 20 were wounded. Apellido i had no weapon, no one had my back. Pelley they write about days like that in the other key therapy here called cognitive processing. Reeder after a trauma or multiple traumas, often, a person can believe the world just is a dangerous place. And so what we do with cpt, cognitive processing therapy, is they write an impact statement at the beginning of therapy to show them the impact of the trauma on their lives and on their beliefs. Pelley they read that statement about the trauma to the group, and then they discuss how their lives are still held in the grip of war. Gable darbonne i never had a fear of life. I never had a fear of living. I never had a fear of going to the gas station and getting shot while im pumping gas because i needed gas in my car. Pelley they plow through a workbook that challenges their guilt with statements like, i shot a woman in combat, therefore, im worthless or my friend was killed by the enemy. Im responsible. Cognitive processing tries to put the war in the past and help them reexamine who they are today. Its tough. We noticed this on apellidos workbook. Reeder how many of you would go back to a deployed environment with your branch of service right now if that opportunity was available to you . Lot of hands up. Real quick, why are your hands going up so much . Darbonne you miss everything about how hard it was, how bitter you got, how angry and emotional, the things you saw. And you missed that camaraderie, that brotherhood, your buddies, the struggling with things. Man, you. Its everything, but you miss it. You mourn that. Its weird. Its that intimacy. Its. You dont. I will never get that back. None of us will ever get that back. Pelley Gable Darbonne never planned to be part of that brotherhood he mentioned. In 2001, he was out of high school, headed to college. But then 9 11 pushed him to an Army Recruiter instead. Darbonne my mom, she was crying in the kitchen. She goes, gable, you dont know what its like for boys coming back from vietnam, how hard they had it and what they came back with. I said, mom, its different, though. We got attacked. We got attacked. I said, im volunteering. I said, ill take anything. You know, im willing to give my life. Thats how strongly i felt. Pelley darbonne was one of the most thoughtful people we met. He served in afghanistan and iraq. One day, his unit was clearing a house. It exploded and two buddies were burned. Darbonne you know, we got angry, got mad. We get very angry, and we took it out on certain people, you know, and you enjoyed it at the time. You did. Pelley you did things to the iraqis that youre not proud of. Darbonne of course, but that was surviving emotionally, mentally. I was never a violent man. I became different, slowly. We all have that instinct, that survival instinct, and that survival instinct is very real. Pelley at home, the survival instinct didnt let go. Darbonne was like most other vets here; certain triggers brought the instinct back the smell of diesel returned him to his combat outpost, crowds made him fearful. Darbonne i started isolating, and i couldnt do anything. My dad had to come over and mow my lawn. My mom had to come over and pay my bills. I just. I wouldnt leave my house for a day or two. I didnt want to make small talk. I didnt want somebody to ask me, hey, how you doing . I didnt like those words, you know . I just, i got very secluded, like a recluse. Pelley for nine years, darbonne told himself he was okay or would be okay. And then, the folks at work urged him to get help. This was darbonne after seven weeks of selfexamination, as they all prepared to go home. Darbonne when i went in, i had a heart, i volunteered. I dont blame nothing on anybody. I dont blame nothing on myself, i dont blame nothing on my leaders. In fact, i had good leaders. I blame nothing on the army. I think it is just the way it is, and it sucks. I hate it, i hate it. I dont want to go home. People would always ask me when i came back, so, what do i tell my boyfriend when he comes back . Or, how do i approach this with my son . I said, when he starts talking, just listen. Yeah, dont. Dont judge it. You know, just listen. Pelley there is probably a soldier or a marine sitting alone, watching this on television right now. Collins thousands of them, id imagine. Pelley and to them, you would say what . Collins i hope you can find the courage to get help, because all youre doing is killing yourself. And you dont have to live like that. There is good people in this world that are willing to help you. And its been the hardest thing for me to do, but i wouldnt have changed coming here for the world. Pelley in our two months here, 28 men sat around the table. Three couldnt endure it and dropped out. The v. A. Finds that, nationwide, about 77 graduate with a drop in their p. T. S. D. Symptoms. Its progress, but they also have a saying around here there is no cure. Reeder i dont think there is a cure for what were talking about. Were talking about living and putting people more in touch with their lives and emotions and good days and bad days. This isnt cancer, we cant go get it. We have to teach people that they can live with this and live a valued life, a life they want. Pelley after eight weeks here, how you doing . Darbonne how am i doing . I dont know yet. Thats an honest answer. 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Current lessees with an expiring lease get this 2014 ats for around 299 a month. Cooper everyone loves an underdog, a tale about a little guy who takes on the establishment favorite. But is our understanding of the underdog accurate . Can a disadvantage, a weakness, actually lead to a hidden strength . Its a question thats been asked ever since david took on goliath, an almost 3,000year old story that writer Malcolm Gladwell believes weve been getting wrong all this time. Malcolm gladwell when we look at battles between lopsided parties, we exaggerate the strength of the favorite and we underestimate the strength of the underdog. Cooper Malcolm Gladwell believes underdogs win more often than we think because their limitations can force them to be creative. David couldnt slay goliath with a sword, but with his sling, he could be deadly from a distance. And gladwell says theres plenty of modern research to explain why. Gladwell i had a conversation with this ballistics expert with the Israeli Defense force who had done the math and pointed out that the projectile, the rock coming from davids sling, was moving at about 35 meters per second, and would have hit goliath with the stopping power equivalent to a bullet from a. 45 caliber handgun. Cooper how did you find an israeli ballistics expert who had done this study on the throwing power of david . Gladwell because there was a paper presented at the International Ballistics conference, like, seven years ago, whatever, by. Cooper how. How did you even hear about the International Ballistics conference . Gladwell if youre as much of a nerd as i am, this is the kind of stuff that you. You get interested in, you know. Cooper this is what you do. Gladwell this is what i do, yeah. Cooper what gladwell does has made him hugely popular and very wealthy. His new book, david and goliath all about underdogs has already topped the New York Times bestseller list. Gladwell when youre an underdog, youre forced to try things you would never otherwise have attempted. Because david. There was no way he could do a duel with swords, he feels emboldened to try something totally outside the box, right . And thats a pattern that you see again and again with underdogs that, because they cant do the thing they are required to do, they look for alternate routes. Cooper gladwell began writing about the successful strategies of underdogs after meeting an indianborn software mogul named vivek ranadivee. What interested gladwell wasnt software, but how ranadivee coached his 12yearold daughters Basketball Team, seen here in white, even though ranadivee knew nothing about the game. Growing up in india, did you play basketball . Vivek ranadive i never actually touched a basketball in my life. Cooper never touched one . Ranadive never touched one. When i went to coach my daughters team, i had physically never touched a basketball. Cooper his lack of knowledge about basketball wasnt his only obstacle. His daughters team had absolutely no talent. The girls on your Basketball Team, they werent tall. Ranadive no. Cooper could they dribble . Ranadive a couple of them. Cooper could they shoot . Ranadive not very well. Cooper did they have a long experience playing basketball . Ranadive for the most part, no. Cooper so ranadivee relied n his mathematics talent and devised a computer algorithm that turned out to be a winning formula for his girls. The strategy force the other team to turn over the ball. Gladwell he says, look, im not. Were not going to bother practicing shooting, its pointless. Were not going to practice dribbling. Im going to teach you to run around like this the entire game. Were going to play the most maniacal defense known to man. And were going to score by stealing the ball and shooting layups. Thats it. Ranadive it didnt really matter that my girls couldnt shoot as well. If i could get the ball under the basket and if i could win the turnover battle, then i could win the game. Cooper ranadivees girls played a neverending full court press. They won every regular season game. Your daughters opponents, they just werent used to playing basketball like this. Ranadive no. No. I. In fact, their coaches were not used to playing that way. Cooper they didnt like it. Ranadive they didnt like it. One guy, a big guy, was so upset that he said he wanted to meet me in the parking lot after the game. Cooper he wanted to beat you up . Ranadive well, he wanted to meet me in the parking lot. laughter cooper ranadivees underdogs made it all the way to the state championships. You clearly started to like basketball after that . Ranadive i did. I did. I ended up falling in love with the game. Cooper and youre still a software c. E. O. Of a multi billion dollar company. But i understand you recently made a big purchase . Ranadive well, i did. I bought the sacramento kings. Cooper you bought an nba Basketball Team . Ranadive i did. Cooper an underdogs disadvantages can be converted into advantages, and gladwell believes thats just as true apart from sports. Gary cohn is one of gladwells favorite examples. Gary cohn i was a troubled student as a young child. And at that period this is the early 60s the world of dyslexia hadnt been as developed as it is today. You know, i dont think anyone really knew how to diagnose the problem. Gladwell he couldnt do school. He acted up in class. He got kicked out of schools. His mother never thought he would graduate from high school. When he graduated from high school, his mother cried. Why . Because it. It was a day she thought would never come. Cooper cohn still has difficulty reading, but hes figured out ways to work around his disability, skills that have led him all the way to the president s office at goldman sachs. Gladwell an incredibly High Percentage of successful entrepreneurs are dyslexic. Thats one of the littleknown facts. So many of them, in fact, its like a joke among dyslexic researchers that you go into a room of very successful businesspeople, and you. You have a show of hands on who has a learning disability, its like half the hands in the room go up. Its fascinating. Cooper although dyslexia remains a challenge for many people, cohn figured out a way to overcome it. His disability forced him to become a good listener and made him unafraid to take chances. Cohn people that cant read well, we tend to build a great sense of listening. We also tend to build a great sense of being able to deal and cope with failure. Cooper this is not something, though, you would wish on anybody else . Cohn no, i would not. Cooper gladwell is fascinated with people who achieve success by forging their own path, perhaps because thats what he has done. He is a staff writer for the new yorker magazine, but he doesnt actually have an office. He writes in small cafes in new york, and does most of his research in a library where he hunts out obscure, often dull academic papers and mines them for interesting, counterintuitive ideas. David remnick, editor of the new yorker, calls him an original. David remnick there are people that cover science. There are people that cover business. There are people that cover trends. But this strange amalgam of reading academic journals, interviewing ordinary people, thinking, storytelling, this is something that malcolm really. That was a territory that he carved out for himself. Cooper what do you think hes interested in achieving . Is it that hes got an opinion and he wants everybody else to agree with it . Remnick absolutely just the opposite. I think what hes interested in is testing and pressing against received wisdom. Most of the time, what we think of our ideas about the world, its received wisdom. Weve read them. Weve assumed its correct. We dont have time to test everything. Cooper gladwells testing of everything has made him a goliath in the world of publishing, but he began as an underdog. Not a particularly strong student, his upbringing in rural ontario, canada, was, well, a bit odd. Gladwell we had no tv, we had no stereo. We never went to the movies. We never even went out to dinner. Like, i think we. Like we once went out to dinner in. Like, in sort of the mid70s. Found the experience not to our liking and didnt go back. Cooper not to your liking. laughter i mean, what youre what youre describing is a childhood from the 30s. Gladwell i thought i had. No, i had. I read a lot of books. I thought i had a fabulous childhood. I mean, when i would sometimes get bored, and my mother would say its important to be bored. Youre giving your brain a rest. Cooper his jamaicanborn mother is a family therapist, his english father a math professor. Gladwell says being biracial and feeling like an outsider has given him a perspective that still informs his writing. Gladwell we lived in england. Then, we moved to canada, where we were sort of outsiders. And then i moved to america, where im a kind of outsider. So i feel like ive constantly been in this situation of shaking my head and thinking, this is a strange place. Cooper gladwell finds americas obsession with Ivy League Colleges strange. Gladwell you moron cooper he argues the presumed advantages of Ivy League Schools can actually be disadvantages. Gladwell went to the university of toronto and says hes better off for it. Gladwell i have a massive chip on my shoulder. I went to a state school in canada. You kidding me . I come to new york, and all kinds of people who went to harvard and yale are mentioning that in every second sentence. It drives me crazy, so. So i have taken it upon myself. Cooper i went to yale. Gladwell i know that, but you havent mentioned it until now, so ive. Cooper i never mention it. I really dont. He says the assumption in america that students should go to the most Prestigious School they get in to is simply wrong. Gladwell if you go to an elite school, where the other students in your class are all really brilliant, you run the risk of mistakenly believing yourself to not be a good student, right . Cooper even if. Gladwell even if you are. Right . It doesnt. If youre last in your class at harvard, it doesnt feel like youre a good student, even though you really are. Its not smart for everyone to want to go to a great school. Cooper so if you had a child, would you want them to go to harvard . Gladwell no, of course not. Id want them to go to school in. To a state school in canada where their tuition would be 4,000 a year. If harvard is 60,000 and university of toronto, where i went to school, is maybe 6,000, so youre really telling me that an education is ten times better at harvard than it is at university of toronto . That seems ridiculous to me. Cooper he doesnt like to talk about money, but gladwell earns millions from his books and lectures. In person, however, there is little sign of his wealth. He lives alone in Greenwich Village on the top two floors of a walkup brownstone. A selfdescribed hermit, he doesnt even have a doorbell. Gladwell i dont want a doorbell. I dont want anyone ringing my doorbell. Why. Why. Seems to be so intrusive. Cooper so when people come visit, what do they do . Gladwell they call me on their cell phone. Cooper for all his success, on the streets of new york, hes nearly invisible, save for his signature cloud of curls bobbing above the crowd. Gladwell people assume, when my hair is long, that im a lot cooler than i actually am. Im not opposed to this misconception, by the way, but it is a misconception. Thank you for buying six books cooper at 50, Malcolm Gladwell has reached a level of success few writers ever will. His previous four books have sold nearly five million copies. His first one, the tipping point, was published 13 years ago, but remains on the New York Times bestseller list. His fans fill lecture halls, and Companies Pay big money to hear about his latest observations. Gladwell how do you get to be that person who just is completely indifferent to what everyone around you is saying . And you get to be that person if you have been through the absolute worst the world can throw at you and come out fine, right . Cooper while readers find his writing accessible and perceptive, his critics say his conclusions can be formulaic and obvious. Gladwell im not afraid of the obvious. I think the really obvious questions are the great ones. Cooper youre a superstar in the world of publishing, and you have a lot of people gunning for you. A lot of people probably would like to see you fail with a book. You dont feel like a goliath . Gladwell well, im not lumbering and. Am i . I try not to think too much about what has happened in my career and draw too many conclusions about it. I think its always best if you pretend that youre exactly the same as you always were. And im perhaps as befuddled by my success as my critics are. So in that sense, i see eye to eye with them. When they say, i cant believe gladwell did this. I say, i cant believe gladwell did that, either. How on earth did that happen . laughter welcome to the cbs sports update. Im james brown with scores from around the nfl. Today chargers upset the chiefs as Philip Rivers throws for three scores. The cards win their fourth straight over the colts. Panthers come from behind the win their seventh in a row. Bucs upset the lion, extending their win to three. Baltimores defense smuggles the jet, and big bens two touchdown passes lead the steelers to a Third Straight win. For more sports news and information, go to cbs cbssports. Com. And a lot of planning. 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Kroft in the mail comments on a story we called the giving pledge about billionaires who have committed half their fortunes to philanthropic causes. Liberal senator Bernie Sanders questioned one of the participants priorities. 60 minutes calls wall street billionaire Pete Peterson a philanthropist. What Pete Peterson has done is throw hundreds of millions of dollars into lobbying campaigns to cut social security, medicare and disabled veterans benefits. That, to my mind, is not philanthropy. Some viewers suggested the billionaires watch bob simons story about the childrens orchestra in paraguay and its instruments made of recycled trash. Cannot the billionaires spare a few million to buy instruments for the landfill harmonic . Im steve kroft. Well be back next week with another edition of 60 minutes. Captioning funded by cbs and ford captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org [ male announcer ] this is joe woods first day of work. 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Com for Safety Information and a free onemonth trial. Previously on the amazing race six teams continued racing through abu dhabi. Starting in last place, nicky and kim dug themselves into a deeper hole. Stop, top. Oh, my god, im so mad right now. And travis used their express pass to jump leo and then targeted jamal with a uturn for lying. The fact that they would awes in us in our ace and lie to us, it was like whatever. Hil tim and marie head to beauty and then pay back nicky and kim with a uturn. Stunt at the airport cost you a uturn