Oversight of the nsa. You are looking live right now at the House Intelligence Committee holding a hearing on that very issue. Witnesses include the director of national intelligence, james clapper, who sounded a wri note on the outrage over u. S. International spy efforts. I have to say, chairman rodgers, some of this reminds me a lot of the classic movie kasa blanka, my god, there is gambling going on here. The same thing. Indeed it is. The president faces an uproar including from chancellor mer l merkel, whose cell phone was tapped. The administration has denied the president knew the extent of the spying. And the president said last night he has ordered a fuel review. In an interview on the new fusion network. The National Security operations generally have one person, and that is to make sure the American People are safe and im making good decisions and im the final user of all the intelligence they gather. What we have seen over the last several years is their capacities continue to develop, and expand, and thats why im initiating now a review to make sure that what theyre able to do doesnt necessarily mean what they should be doing. And today the president and his administration are also, of course, facing heightened scrutiny on his health care law. In a warmup for testimony tomorrow by hhs secretary Kathleen Sebelius, todays hot seat belonged to medicare administrator, marlin tavenner, the federal official who oversees the new Health Insurance exchanges. And she became the first senior official to apologize for the troubled rollout. To the millions of americans who have attempted to use healthcare. Gov to shop and enroll in health care coverage, i want to apologize to you, that the website has not worked as well as it should. I want to assure you that healthcare. Gov can and will be fixed and we are working around the clock to deliver the Shopping Experience that you deserve. Now, you didnt think that would be enough for congressional republicans, did you . No, indeed. They have already moved on to their newest, latest favorite line of attack. If you like your Health Care Plan, you can keep it. Is that a true statement . The white house. Gov website says if you want to keep the Health Insurance youve got, you can keep it. And now theyre being told they cant. Thats a lie. Yeah, thats the one. The claim that millions of americans are losing the insurance they know and love. Ms. Tavener did come with an answer when she was allowed to give one and the white house weighed in on the effects of the Affordable Care act on the 5 who currently purchase on the individual market. That market has been like the wild west. They could throw you off, they could jack up your premiums. They could change your coverage. The fact is that millions of americans who have been subject to the whims and vague arrestees of this individual Insurance Market are going to have security they never had before. Bonus, its going to lower everyones Health Care Costs when people with those shoddy plans upgrade and no longer end up in the emergency room for care. So lets all calm down and Work Together to get the law up and running. Right, Speaker Boehner . There is no way to fix this monstrosity. Thank you for that. And a very happy halloween to you, mr. Speaker. Joining us onset, im delighted to welcome msnbc contributor, joy reid, of the grio. Com and msnbc political analyst, our very own black sock r sock roties. Michael eric dyson. This week they say the president is a liar so i guess they are making progress in the way theyre moving forward on the Affordable Care act. What was interesting about the hearings today and the questions from republicans, they had to do less with sort of the actual operation of the Affordable Care act. And more to do with sort of relitigating their complaints about there being an Affordable Care act. You have the chairman, i believe, of the Ranking Member of the chairman of the house ways and Means Committee say the problem is over the law. The law itself is bad. So therefore, all of our sort of points about the website and things not working, we dont really care about the website. We still just hate the law so were going to find ways to question ms. Tavenner, to relitigate that. Professor dyson, Speaker Boehner claims there is no way to fix this monstrosity. One of the things you never hear is the monstrosity of preAffordable Care act market, where three quarters of medical bankruptcies happen to people with insurance. I mean, isnt that a monstrosity . Oh, its a horrible monstrosity. And speaking of halloween, we were tricked and not treated to what we should have been treated. As you indicated already, martin, most people who were poor used the emergency ward as health care maintenance. What does that do . It jacks up the prices exponentially, because by the time their diseases are caught upon scrutiny or scan in an emergency ward, youve got to pay now hundreds of thousands, if not millions of more dollars collectively for those people. Yes, absolutely, the preexisting conditions of being a woman or being poor without health care, the individual market will be accommodated, because now 1 Million People will have insurance through medicaid, and those with individual abilities to pay will have a better plan. Those who are grandfathered in, had preexisting insurance already, wont be penalized to the degree that the boehner and others have suggested. They say this is a monstrosity. Its not a monstrosity. The monstrosity is the inability of americans to afford to be able to take for granted what people in europe afford can take for granted. That is, if i get sick, i can go to the hospital, they dont ask me where is your card, let me see if you have enough money to pay. And we know hundreds of thousands of people have died as a result of being checked for insurance they dont possess, or they have been their health has been ruined as a result of lack of access. Thats the real monday trosty. Yeah, and, of course, we saw something of a monstrosity earlier with ms. Tavenner, but tomorrow is the big game, the one they have been waiting for and longing for. Kathleen sebelius. What do they do to her tomorrow . Its sort of a strange political strategy. You take a political figure that 90 of americans probably have no idea who this person is. And you sort of make them now the symbol of your discontent. Its not a smart political strategy in the sense that after tomorrows hearing blockbuster though it may be, even if they produce numerous youtube sound bites, 90 of people will still not have any idea. God bless her. So you have picked an enormous target what if they get her head on a platter, what if they force her to resign . Here is the down side and this is going to be very difficult to break to our conservative friends. There will still be an Affordable Care act. Even if Kathleen Sebelius was taken away by martians tomorrow. If they could get her to resign. If they can get the entire administration of barack obama to resign. The Affordable Care act is law. And what we still havent gotten to is acceptance of the fact of this act having passed, having passed scrutiny by the supreme court. It will exist no matter how many people they grill on their committees. Okay. Professor dyson, republicans are focused on the horror that people will be forced to get better care than they currently have. Thats correct. And i would like you to take a listen to this. Analysis has shown that if youre between 18 and 34 right now, about half of the people can get highQuality Health care for less than 50 bucks a month. Less than your cell phone bill, less than your cable bill. And about 70 can get it for less than 100 bucks a month. But heres the point, professor dyson. Thats what the Koch Brothers are spending hundreds of millions of dollars on preventing young people from doing. Preventing young people from taking it up. Absolutely. As opposed to putting it in a fund, set aside for those who they claim will not be able to take advantage of it. Why not use that Koch Brothers money to permit them to afford the very care they claim wont be available under obama care . I love watching the president there. Im reminded of sades smooth operator. Hes clear, calm, smooth, telling the truth. Less than 50 bucks a month. What your phone bill would cost. Here is a man breaking down in the digestible form, a complicated thing like the Affordable Care act. And the reality is, as joy reid is saying, we cant say it enough. That it is law. It has been enshrined. It is there, regardless of their feelings, they cant remove it. If they co starred with Sandra Bullock in gravity and george clooney, they cant remove it. Thank you for that. Joy, i just wanted to one other question with you, though. This debate about individuals on the private Insurance Market losing their plan, it seems as though the republican preference now is that if your plan gets worse, right, you should be able to keep it. As opposed to the president s proposal, which is if your plan gets worse, it doesnt qualify, because it doesnt have those ten important essential elements that the Affordable Care act enshrines for all of us. Yeah, its a strange argument. What theyre essentially saying, if you have really bad but expensive insurance, that has high copays and deductibles, really horrible. And you can be tossed off at any moment. Your doctors can resign at any moment. This is the worst possible insurance. But at least you have something. If you are forced to change that for better insurance, that this is somehow an assault on your liberty. Theyre saying, for instance the only example, if you are feeding your kids extruded Chicken Nuggets and horrible, made of chicken paste. And the government says you know what, from now on, it has to be chicken breast. Well, you have now assaulted my liberty. I have a right to feed my kids you have assaulted my liberty. It doesnt make sense. Were saying youre going to get a better product for a lower price. How that is an assault on your liberty, rather than your current policy being an assault on your dignity and good health, i really am not sure. Because theyre in bed with the insurance company. Theyre not into health care. Theyre into insurance position. Professor, before we go, i want wanted to get your thoughts on whats happened with regard to the nsa and the issue of spying on over 35 World Leaders. And senator Dianne Feinstein saying its a big problem, and the president apparently not knowing that Angela Merkels cell phones, both tapped. How damaging is that for this president s status as someone who is in control and in touch and one we can trust . Yeah, its a slippery slope. Because on the one hand, you want to look like you know whats going on. But you cant say the butler did it. This is something that youre responsible for, right . Its in your house. Colombo cant come in and save you. Neither can pj rourke or whoever else can be i think the problem here is that the president has been talking about transparency and clarity, and hes got to get ahold of whats going on here. Angela merkel doesnt want to come to the white house because youve been snooping and spying on her. Ive been trying to listen to see if they have been on my two phones. If theyre not on my phones and World Leaders spy on each other all of the time, we can make him a scapegoat. He has to be culpable and responsible, but at the same time, its a lot more pervasive than we thought. Isnt this about the permanent intelligence bureaucracy . And we learned president bush was trying to get involved in invading iraq. I thought theyre spying on our allies to see if theyll vote for the law. There is this bureaucracy and when you give an agency or any entity power it never gives it back willingly. I think it is up to congress, decrepid though they are, to reign and continue after this one. Which means it will never happen. It will be permanent and go on. Absolutely. Professor eric michael die son and joy reid, wish you could join me for the whole broadcast. Dont let republicans tell you they have a magical alternative to the Affordable Care act. Our next guest, a democratic congressman, is having none of it. I started parttime, now im a manager. N. My employer matches my charitable giving. Really. I get bonuses even working parttime. Where i work, over 400 people are promoted every day. Healthcare starting under 40 a month. I got education benefits. I work at walmart. Im a pharmacist. Sales associate. I manage produce. I work in logistics. Theres more to walmart than you think. Vo opportunity. Thats the real walmart. Medicare open enrollment. Of year again. Time to compare plans and costs. You dont have to make changes. But it never hurts to see if you can find better coverage, save money, or both. And check out the preventive benefits you get after the health care law. Open enrollment ends december 7th. So nows the time. Visit medicare. Gov or call 1800medicare but chantix helped me do it. I told my doctor i think im. Im ready. [ male announcer ] along with support, Chantix Varenicline is proven to help people quit smoking. It reduces the urge to smoke. I knew that i could smoke for the first 7 days. I knew that i wasnt putting nicotine back into my body to try to quit. [ male announcer ] some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. If you notice any of these, stop chantix and call your doctor right away. Tell your doctor about any history of Mental Health problems, which could get worse while taking chantix. Dont take chantix if youve had a serious allergic or skin reaction to it. If you develop these, stop chantix and see your doctor right away as some can be lifethreatening. Tell your doctor if you have a history of heart or blood vessel problems, or if you develop new or worse symptoms. Get medical help right away if you have symptoms of a heart attack or stroke. Use caution when driving or operating machinery. Common side effects include nausea, trouble sleeping and unusual dreams. If i could describe being a nonsmoker, i would say awesome. [ male announcer ] ask your doctor if chantix is right for you. The highlight of Todays Health Care hearing had to be an exchange involving a democratic congressman who decided to take a gop colleague to task for having the audacity to suggest that republicans have ever offered a viable alternative to the Affordable Care act. Its a false choice to say its obama care or nothing. There are numerous proposals, including the one that im a co sponsor. Are you serious, what you just said . Are you really serious . After what we have gone through . After what we have gone through in the last threeandahalf years . Have you you can sit there and say that you had a legitimate alternative . After these years . Weve gone through 44 votes. 48 votes now. Of you trying to dismantle this legislation. You call that cooperation . I dont joining us now was a man sitting front and center for that exchange. Democrat joe crowley of new york. Good afternoon, sir. Hey, martin. Great to be with you again. Now, you were sitting next to congressman pass equal of new jersey when that exchange occurred. Right. Did you begin to wonder if you started hallucinating or perhaps someone had spiked your Morning Coffee with rohypnol when you heard a republican claim with clear face, they had offered viable alternatives to the Affordable Care act. Well, i think, martin, that congressman pass crawl, i think, expressed the exacerbation and frustration i think we as democrats are feeling about our republican colleagues. You know, if this wasnt a serious hearing, we would all be laughing right now. Because we all know that theyre not about fixing the problem as democrats are. Theyre about trying to find a problem they can exploit. Theyre exploiting this as best they can. As i pointed out, the attention of the other side of the aisle, the republicans, is not to fix the problem. They want to undo unravel the whole, as mr. Reichert said in the hearing, he wants to take a chain saw to this. Youve anticipated my next question, congressman. Okay. Because as youre saying, things didnt seem to get much better. The hearing moved on from drunk karaoke to the Texas Chain Saw Massacre with, as you said, David Reichert of washington saying we should take a chain saw to the act. Now, can you please explain how making sure that Insurance Companies cannot deny coverage, because of preexisting conditions, how insuring that all americans can have Health Insurance. How is that such an horrendous thing . Well, i think thats the problem they have been tripping over all along. They know there are wonderful things in this bill. And yet they cant bring themselves to embrace it at all. In fact, what i said today, to the witness was that to understand that theyre not here to see you or this law succeed. Understand that. The questions theyre asking you about the rollout, or about how poorly it was done, they could care less. They dont care how poorly it was done, because they just want to exploit the issue. You know, what we are about is finding solutions to this problem. And that is the website can be fixed. We know that. Its a website. Yeah. But their broken agenda cant be. They have to throw their broken agenda out. They have to take a chain saw to their agenda. I guess you would accept, given what the president has said throughout his tenure, both first term and now the second, that hes always wanted a smart government. An effective government. You would accept, im sure, that this has not helped that particular ambition. No, in many respects, it continues the dumbing down and lets go out and try to exploit, you know, an issue that is highly exploitable. Lets face it. We understand that. But the end of the day, martin, what people have to understand is that for the first time, people will be able to afford insurance in this country. People have insurance are going to get better insurance. Because of this law. And we cant lose sight of that. Our republican colleagues want us to lose sight of it, they want to distract us. They want to do what they can do undermine this law. And our job is to see this law through, just like when Medicare Part d was passed on the republicancontrolled house and by republican president. Democrats didnt sit on hands and say dont sign up, we helped our constituents. Would i like to see one republican do that. I havent seen any do that. So would i. Today also maximum marks the oneyear anniversary of hurricane sandy. How do the residents in your district react, sir, when they hear that republicans like tom coburn, who voted against a single cent of funding coming to new york, yet come here to the city to raise money for their own campaigns. I think they probably have the same reaction i would, martin. In other words, we welcome them to new york. New york is a welcoming city. But you know what, we would like them to go to staten island, the rock aways, go to long island. See the damage done from sandy thats not repaired yet, that lives are still overturned. Theyre not back together get. And when a disaster struck their state, i didnt say, well, they didnt help us. Therefore im not going to help them. I dont believe america should ever turn its back, congress should never turn its back on suffering americans. Thats what they did when new york and new jersey and connecticut and pennsylvania were suffering. But martin, its important to note, we didnt do the same thing to colorado. We never would. We didnt do it to any other part of the country. Thats the lesson to be learned here. Congressman joe crowley, thank you for never doing that. Coming up, senator rand paul stars in gafika. In the movie gafica in the not too distant future almost verbatim in the wikipedia entry. In the not too distant future building animatronics is all about getting things to Work Together. The timing, the actions, the reactions. Everything has to synch up. My expenses are no different. Receiptmatch on the business gold rewards card synchronizes your business expenses. Just shoot your Business Card receipts and theyre automatically matched up with the charges on your online statement. Im john kaplan, and im a member of a synchronized world. This is what membership is. This is what membership does. Mom . Come in here. Come in where . Welcome to my mom cave. Wow. Sit down. You need some campbells chunky soup before todays big game, new chunky cheeseburger. Mmm. I love cheeseburgers. I know you do. When did you get this place . When i negotiated your new contract, it was part of the deal. Cool. [ male announcer ] campbells chunky soup. It fills you up right. [ male announcer ] campbells chunky soup. My dna. S me. Every piece is important. This part. Makes my eyes blue. I might have an increased risk of heart disease. Gallstones. Hemochromatosis. Ill look into that. The more you know about your dna, the more you know about yourself. Now i know. Know more about your health. Go to 23andme. Com and order your dna kit for only 99 dollars today. Learn hundreds of things about your health at 23andme. Com nothing says, youre my 1 copilot, like a milbone biscuit. Say it with milkbone. Could save you fifteen percent or more on Car Insurance. Yep, Everybody Knows that. Well, did you know the ancient pyramids were actually a mistake . Uhoh. Geico. Fifteen minutes could save you. Well, you know. Still ahead, the days top lines as republicans eagerly wade back into womens preproductive rights. But first, that smiling young woman on the page of healthcare. Gov. Well, she has just vanished. Ill tell you why the change. Death panels got her. Prove me wrong, obama. Okay ladies, whenever youre ready. Thank you. Thank you. I got this. Oh, no, ill get it let me get it. Uhuhuh. I dont want you to pay for this. Its not happening, honey. Let her get it. She got her safe driving bonus check from allstate last week. And its her treat. What about a tip . Oh, heres one. Get an allstate agent. Nice [ female announcer ] switch today and get two safe driving bonus checks a year for driving safely. Only from allstate. Call 8669056500 now. Here we go hold on man. Is that a leak up there . Thats a drip. Whoo. Okay. Aah. Now thats a leak. That is a leak and if you dont have allstate renters insurance. Game over. [ female announcer ] protect your valuables from things like water damage for as low as 4 a month when you add renters insurance to your allstate auto policy. Call 8669056500 now. Plus, drivers who switched saved an average of 498 a year. Just a few more ways allstate is changing Car Insurance for good. [ female announcer ] call an allstate agent and get a quote now. Hey lady noooo no [ tires screech ] nooo nooo nooo hey lady, thats diesel i know. From Science Fiction of the 1990s to womens rights of the 1890s, here are todays top lines. Dont be cheeky. Conservatives think that liberals are dumb. But liberals think that conservatives are evil. In the movie gattaca, in the not too distant, eugenics is common that line appears almost verbatim in the wikipedia entry on got at that. Plays a primary role. Dna plays the primary role in determining social class. Hey, thats what rand paul said. Are you going to plagiarize the whole thing for us . Do you have any thoughts of your own on this matter . Vincent freeman is conceived the Old Fashioned way. My name is vincent, Vincent Anton freeman, and a faith birth or whatever you want to call it. Genetic discrimination. Vincent faces genetic discrimination and prejudice, a borrowed ladder. In your lifetime, much of your potential, or maybe lack thereof, will be known simply by swabbing the inside of your cheek. Wont be cheeky. Imagine a world where there is no interview, they take a swab of your cheek. I dont want to know. In the process, will we perhaps eliminate something . Some part of our human papillomaness . Some part of our specialness if we seek perfection . Im sorry i was born with this perfect bone structure, that my hair looks better done up with gel and mousse. My hope is we dont lose the appreciation that a miracle springs forth from tiny strands of dna. Do we have the strength of character to resist a world where eugenics is practiced voluntarily . Thanks, senator. Lets get right to our panel, joining us now in new york, National Reporter for msnbc. Com,errin car moan, and my friend and colleague, co host of the cycle, krystal ball. Krystal, this scare mongering of eugenics i dont know what that sound is i think its the eugenics alert. Theyre coming for us. Everybody prepare. Okay, thank you. So you know, i kind of it reminded me when i was listening to rand paul of the kind of culture wars of the 1980s which tried to rehearse the idea that if a woman had had a right to choose, then the doors would be flung open to endless abortion, infantside and euthanasia. The last time i polled folks in virginia and it is my home state, eugenics was not really at the top of the list of their sort of daily concerns. Of course, neither is anti sodomy laws, which is another focus of Ken Cuccinelli and rand paul, but thats another story for another day. The only thing i can figure here is its hard for, quote, unquote, libertarians, right, to square their socalled love of freedom with an overbearing federal government that wants to tell women what to do with their bodies and essentially force them to give birth. So i think this eugenics thing is a way to say, well, if we dont force all women to have births, then the government is going to go to this place of eugenics. Thats the only thing i can figure. Its a very bizarre situation. Good try. Erin, Ken Cuccinelli has already been struggling with female voters, in the most recent polls down a whopping 24 points. Now hes got rapid paul going off about Science Fiction and the reason behind denying a woman control of her own body. Is that a way to win back female voters . Its not the way to win back female voters. If youre looking at this double digit gap continuing to yawning and continuing to grow, these are people who supported personhood amendments. They are trying to Ken Cuccinelli himself is actively involved in shutting down clinics that provide health care to women. I mean, its happening every day. You dont have to look like rand paul did towards a distoppian reality. Ken cuccinelli is already trying to do it in virginia. Didnt they learn anything from the last election . They did not. You can see them doing i look at the news out of texas this week, look at virginia. Every day brings a new list of regulations, restrictions. A draconian abortion restriction, trying to shut down clinics. I think that they think that this is a base strategy that there are people who really worried about women having reproductive freedom. And there was a more moderate potential choice in virginia for the republican party. Bill bowling, Lieutenant Governor under bob mcdonnell, much more centrist guy and probably would have had a better shot in this election. But because it was the activists that controlled the primary process in virginia, as they do its the story we have seen play out time and time again. They ended up with this guy who is an extremist, and who a purple state like virginia, they have no interest in having this guy run. And also a Lieutenant Governor who has said that planned parenthood is worse than the kkk. If youre a woman that gets her care at planned parenthood, that doesnt resonate with you. Let me quote what wendy davis said following the federal judges ruling yesterday. Which prevented the closure of these clinics, that, of course, the texas governor, rick perry had been hoping to close. She says, texas families are stronger and healthier when women across the state have access to Quality Health care. Im not surprised by the judges ruling. But didnt that ruling expose the singular lie of that whole campaign, that it had absolutely nothing to do with Womens Health . Well none nothing whatsoever. Right. Quite the opposite. Yeah, i mean, i think the judge did a great job, at least in acknowledging that there is absolutely no valid reason, no medical reason, no scientific, Public Health reason, to require these things. These admitting procedures, is what were talking about. Yes. Very similar laws passed in virginia, as well, and states around the country. I think when you actually evaluate this, besides their phony pretext this is to protect women. As crystal pointed out in her monologue in the cycle there are women now already seeking the equivalent of backalley abortions by going to mexico. This is not about a concern for Womens Health. Already, yeah. And just to provide a little background on the admitting privileges, mississippi passed a very similar law. Mississippi, a state where there is only oh one remaining abortion clinic. The providers there went to all of the surrounding hospitals and basically and asked to have admitting privileges and basically none of them would even consider allowing them. So all these laws are, they have no concern for Womens Health. Its all about shutting down abortion clinics. Thats all its about. And in mississippi it was also found unconstitutional. So luckily the judiciary is finding somewhat some relief. Thank you both so much for joining us. Coming up, standing her ground. The mother of Trayvon Martin goes before lawmakers, and indeed, this conversation is far from over oh. What kind of message are we sending if our kids because remember, these are our kids in our communities. Dont feel safe. [ male announcer ] when it comes to doing what you love, more is better. Thats why we designed the allnew nissan versa note, with more technology, to get you into, and out of, tight spots. And more space so that you always have your favorite stuff. 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So we listened when you said gogurt should have only natural colors and flavors and no high fructose corn syrup. Thanks, mom. Why would i take one pepcid® when i could take tums® throughout the day when my heartburn comes back . cause you only have to take one. [ male announcer ] dont be like the burns. Just one pepcid® complete works fast and lasts. The person that shot and killed my son is walking the streets today. And this law does not work. Sybrina fulton, the mother of Trayvon Martin, testifying earlier today on capitol hill, about socalled stand your ground laws. These laws, i with are now on the books in no less than 22 states, have made it much easier for people to claim self defense when they fire their weapons. But they make it too easy. Thats the question right now. And joining us now is lucy mcbath, who also testified before the senate today about the loss of her son jordan, who was killed by a man that later claimed he was justified under floridas stand your ground law and also representative marsha fudge, democrat of ohio. If i might begin with you, ms. Mcbath, we would like to express, obviously, our condolences for your sons loss and also our gratitude that you are speaking out so courageously on this deeply troubling issue. And i would like our audience to take a listen to some of your testimony earlier today. But you can never really know my boy. Because an angry man who owned a gun kept it close at hand and chose to demonstrate unbridled hatred one balmy evening for reasons i will never understand. These laws empowered his prejudiced beliefs and subsequent rage over my sons own life. The end of your sons life began as an argument about playing loud music inside a car, is that right . Yes. Tell us about that. Well, the boys had come from a day at shopping at the mall. It was the day after thanksgiving, black friday, in jacksonville, florida. And they had simply stopped at a gas station, a convenience store, to get cigarettes, candy, things of that nature, as they were on their way to jordans fathers house. And they were going to play video games. And in the time that they were sitting there, michael dunn comes beside them, drives beside them, and tells them to turn the music down, the socalled thug music, he calls it. And the children turned the music down. Then jordan asked that the music be turned back up, because in jordans mind, you know, theyre not doing anything wrong. Theyre just playing their music. And its inside their car. Inside their car. And what happens next . Well, michael dunn was agitated and angry that they werent turning the music down, and he decided that, you know, they needed to Pay Attention and do as he instructed them to do. And an argument ensued between michael dunn and my son. And michael dunn simply says, you cant talk to me that way. He pulls his. 9 millimeter gun out of his glove box, and he shot ten rounds into the car. And three of those bullets killed my son instantly. And i should say that nobody in the car that your son was traveling in was armed. Is that right . Absolutely. There were no guns, no alcohol. Nothing of the nature that could be intimidating or threatening to anyone. Congresswoman, since firearms are so ubiquitous in this country, do laws like stand your ground make sense if they actually encourage people to use their guns whenever they feel, quote, threatened . Absolutely not, martin. I find it most interesting that the same people that consistently talk about people being accountable, taking responsibility for themselves, have now decided that there should be no standard of responsibility, no standard of accountability. If you are in a place where they think you can legally be. And just decide that someone is threatening you in some way. I mean, martin, think about it. We teach police officers, those who are trained with weapons, to only use that force which is necessary. But we are now absolving everyday citizens of the same standard of responsibility and accountability. We have decided that any level of violence is okay. That everyone should be able to have a gun and defend themselves. What happened to humanity, number one. Number two, what has happened to the people who have all these years talked about responsibility and now there is none. Something is very wrong in america, martin. When we allow people to carry guns, when we know, in fact, that the more guns that are on the streets, the higher the incidence of homicide is. But yet they would deny the data. They would ignore the data and say, you know what, everything is going to be okay. As long as everyone has a gun. We have to stop buying into that foolishness. Absolutely, we have to. Ms. Mcbath, the man charged in your sons death has written some letters that made it out to the public. In one of them, he expresses his hope that the trial will move to counties that are, quote, predominantly white and republican, and supporters of gun rights. To ask you, how much hope do you hold that justice will be served in the case of your sons death . Well, we have to believe that justice will be served. The Justice System that we have here in this country is the best that we have. The two cases are very different. Theyre very similar, very different. The letters that michael dunn wrote are very painful. Theyre very hard to read. Its very hard to understand that how he could have such disheartening feels and opinions and ideas about people that are not like him. If we are posed with a trial being moved, if any of those things should happen, then we will have to deal with that at that time. Whatever comes out of the letters, whatever happens because of Michael Dunns letters, that will be of his own doing. We are not insinuating anything thats going to be racially biased. We have decided that we are not going to buy into any of that. That we are not going to incite the country to racism. That what jordans father and i are doing is for all children. Its for everybody. And we are not going to let his opinions and ideas about race, about our son, or about what hes done determine the course of our future. Thank you so much for your grace, your courage and your dignity. Congresswoman, the hearing was originally scheduled, as you know, to take place on september the 17th, one day after the navy yard shooting. But i have to ask you this question. Were you surprised that only about four senators actually decided to attend today . Im not surprised at all. I listened to a woman who lost her son. And i tell you, martin, it would be laughable, if not so serious, that someone who talks about wanting to get a fair trial would believe the only way to do that is to have an allwhite jury. Where, in fact, in todays hearing they talk about the fact that stand your ground laws benefit africanamericans. It is the height of hypocrisy. For people to use race in an environment that is already charged because of the death of an innocent young man, to use race to say, you know what, something is wrong with them. I dont want to see another trial. Where the person who was killed is on trial, and not the person who did the killing. Absolutely. Representative marsha fudge and lucy mcbath, thank you both. And ms. Mcbath, thank you so much. It was a pleasure. Thank you. And well be right back in a moment. [ male announcer ] what if a Small Company became big business overnight . Like, really big. Then expanded . Or their new product tanked . Or not . What if they embrace new technology instead . 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Eric cantors history i dont knowics aside, the shock of receiving a letter that says your Health Insurance policy is about to be cancelled should not be dismissed lightly. But neither should the reason for why the Affordable Care act no longer allows many of these policies on the individual market. Because theyre not very good for your health. Take this Harvard Medical School study from 2007, which found that while twothirds of bankruptcies were due to high medical bills, about three quarters of those medical bankruptcies involved people with insurance. In other words, its often people with medical insurance who are forced to declare bankruptcy, because of high medical bills. Now, why is that . After all, the report says most medical debtors were wellhe d welleducated, owned homes and had middle class occupations. Two reasons, according to the authors. Many were so sick they lost their jobs and therefore their insurance. Also, many of these plans came with onerous copays, deductibles and, or loopholes. In other words, the coverage turned out to be meaningless. Joining us is josh barrow, politics editor for Business Insider and jared bernstein, who is senior fellow at the center on budget and policy priorities. Josh, nobody, you nor i nor jerryd is suggesting this episode is a shining moment for the administration. But the point of these regulations is to create basic standards of care for everyone. Yeah, et cetera one of the points of this. So one of the key reasons peoples premiums are going up, coverage is going to be better. Also the premiums are going up because you have to get the Coverage Even if you have a preexisting so there is a protection for the consumer. Right. In california, they did a study and found 27 there was about a 27 premium increase, attributable to that. So thats bad for you if youre a young, healthy person who has a high income and wont qualify for a subsidy. But if youre sick and couldnt get Health Insurance, thats good for you. And the law overall is meant to make the Health Insurance system work better for america as a whole. So thats creating a lot of winners in people who were really screwed by the system before. But there are some losers. The thing is, you have to weigh those things against each other. The critics are not really doing that. Theyre picking these sort of unicorns, these young, healthy, 27yearold freelancers with high incomes who indeed will pay more and the old system worked pretty well for those people. There just arent that many of those people. Unfortunately, there arent. Jerryd, the individual Health Care Market has always been volatile and subject to the vagaries of medical Insurance Companies. And you never had a guarantee that the coverage you bought today would be available and for the same price next year. Wouldnt that message be less shocking to policyholders, were the republicans engaging in this debate honestly . Yes. And, in fact, its some of those issues that are at the bottom of this dustup. An argument, by the way, that we were having about three years ago. I just read your blog. You write about it in detail. I remember it well because i was working for the administration back then. Look, the idea here is that in order to enable people to keep their coverage that they got on the individual market, which is shaki shaky the way you and josh were just describing, some of these plans were grandfathered in. So that happens to have been the case. But if those plans have changed for the worse since then, in ways that undermine the very Consumer Protections that are at the heart of the Affordable Care act, then theyre no longer consistent with the act. If their copays have gone up a lot. If they have cancelled the coverage of certain conditions. If they dont cover preexisting conditions. They are now out of sink wi sin with the Affordable Care act and changed since they were grandfathered, at which point they are nongrandfathered and should be cancelled. So if the president were speaking more accurately, and youre right, there has been a messaging problem here. If you like your plan and your plan doesnt change in a way that makes it a lot worse, on the individual market, you can keep it. And remember, 271 Million People are not the ones were talking about here. Theyre the ones who get their coverage through their employer or through the government. The individual market is relatively small. Yeah. Josh, we have discovered the republican plan alternative. Ted cruz has it. And basically, it involves marrying a managing director at is it Goldman Sachs . Goldman sachs, yes. Yeah, thats the answer, is it . Right, yeah. The New York Times did this story four years ago that the plan that Goldman Sachs provides to its Senior Executives at the managing director level and higher costs 40,000 a year. Now, to give some perspective, at that time a typical family plan would cost about 15 or 16,000. So its more than double the normal cost. I dont know what a 40,000 a Year Health Plan gets you. Im sure its some pretty great things. The cruzs get to deduct all of that 40,000 for tax or that income is never taxed. Thats a subsidy worth about 15,000, more than it costs to cover a family of four under medicaid. So this is a crazy feature of our Current Health care system. And i would note, the cruzs are probably not going to get to keep their Health Care Plan. There will be an excise tax on these extremely highcost plans that will push employers like Goldman Sachs to give their employees Smaller Health plans, pay them more in cash. So i think the president shouldnt have said if you like your health plan you can keep it. One of the key objectives was to change the way in which americans are covered in ways that cover more people, more reliably, at lower cost. And so some people will change plans because of that. Absolutely. Josh barrow, jared bernstein, i wish we had more time. We dont. But thank you. And well be right back. When we made our commitment to the gulf, bp had two big goals help the gulf recover and learn from what happened so we could be a better, safer energy company. I can tell you safety is at the heart of everything we do. Weve added cuttingedge technology, like a new deepwater well cap and a stateoftheart monitoring center, where experts watch over all drilling activity twentyfourseven. And were sharing what weve learned, so we can all produce energy more safely. Our commitment has never been stronger. Gives you a longlasting fresh breath feeling. So you have the courage to jump in. 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