Transcripts For MSNBCW AM Joy 20160716

Here we are in erie island in ohio, relocating ourselves on for the convention that starts monday. In less than on hour from now, donald trump appears with az, quote, final, final choice for running mate, mike pence. They appear together shortly in new york for the first time as the president ial ticket. It almost didnt come to be. He was second guessing the pick until after midnight thursday hours before announcing it on twitter. Nbc is joining me from new york, katie, i understand that the Trump Campaign is pushing back on this idea that they that the candidate was unsure that he wanted mike pence as his running mate. What can you tell us about that . Reporter you know, i think unsure might be a strong way to put it. I was talking to more people today, and this is just part of the process of how donald trump makes his decisions. Is it the most appropriate way to do it now that hes running for National Office and making a decision that involves national the National Well being, maybe not so, but he has a tendency to talk to everybody in his circle, and find out what they think about things. Its his way of processing decisions and processing information, so he was making calls up until very late thursday night, trying to talk through the decision about indiana governor mike pence. Thats what im being told today. The campaign, though, pushing back saying governor pence was the first choice all along, donald trump tweeting that this morning saying he was the first choice. I spoke to the Campaign Chairman yesterday about this, and i asked him when donald trump made the decision, he said within the past couple days. Take a listen to how he put it. Sorry, i didnt realize we didnt have the sound. He told me he was making the decision in the past couple days that governor pence knew he was going to be the vp when he came here to new york, flew in on a private jet from indiana, landed in new jersey, and that he was not just coming here for talk. He knew he was going to be Donald Trumps running mate, but the leaks about it and the rumors that donald trump may have been waffling on his decision as late as thursday night has proven to be quite embarrassing for governor pence who was already in new york city. We are also told that it was a pretty close decision between governor christie and Newt Gingrich contributing to the idea that donald trump may have not been exactly sure who to choose regardless of any of that, joy, donald trump comes out on stage here in the new york hilton to introduce mike pence officially as his running mate in just about an hour. Its going to be the first public appearance together since they made this decision, and they are going to hope to press reset button, go forward, presenting a united front. All right. Thank you very much. My colleague, Chris Matthews is in d. C. Chris, you heard the spin and spin out of the Trump Campaign is that he always wanted mike pence, but youre hearing persistent stories not only of him waffling, pushing pence as the guy to unite the party that brings the paul ryan wing and evangelicals together and personal relationship with christie and beginnigingrich ant call to tell them about the decision they were not the pick. What do you think of this . We dont know the truth yet. We dont know for a fact. No one came out publicly to say that trump had called feat or that he tried to get out of that appointment, that selection. The whole thing, joy, reminds me, almost particular terms, to what happened with jack kennedy and lyndon johnson, the most Effective Team politically put together in a hundred years, perhaps, because without johnson, kennedy would not have won. Certainly, kennedy was not happy with the decision he made to pick johnson. Bobby kennedyfuls not happy with it, and for hours, that day basically, they tried to deal with the situation. Was there a way to get out of the deal. Historically, it turned out they decide there was no way to get out of the deal. Johnsonmented it, offered it, and he took it, and in the end, jack kennedy said, were going to go with this. In this case, there were two minds, two kennedy brothers all that day, but the difference was we didnt have 24 7 news coverage, leakers, have disloyal people. Who put out the word that donald trump had had second thoughts was not a loyal person to donald trump by definition, and so in those days, politics was about loyalty and keeping your mouth shut, but the same thing happened. He picked a running mate, and heard after he did the selection, all the arguments against johnson, from labor, civil rights people, et cetera, heard the negatives, but in the course of the day, the biggest negative is to drop johnson after offering him the presidency and johnson having accepted. The big difference is theres talk, stuff that may not be sub stanuated yet. Wait and see. Maybe me didnt have second thoughts. We dont know yet. Wait until he says, he didnt want pence. We have not heard that voice yet. Yeah. You mentioned the factions and loyalty question that points to the fact there are still a lot of factions within the Republican Party that, while they are rowing together, they are not necessarily in love with each other. It could be people loyal to christie or people who wanted gingrich are really behind it. We have numbers, talk about what each of the guys would have done were donald trump, and im wondering what you think pence gives them. Christie and gingrich gave more raw enthusiasm. Right. People more likely to vote for donald trump. Pence did not do that. Hes less wellknown. They dont agree on a lot of issues, for free trade, on record for the tpp, on record about the muslim immigration, and they are opposed. Doesnt he have to cow mike pence . Mike pence has to walk back everything hes believed publicly in order to be his guy. Does that help trump . Hes running as Vice President. Hell do what trump wants. Thats a normal condition. George hw bush was prochoice until he worked with reagan. Making adjustments all the time. In many ways, its like a real marriage. Its a meeting the compliments, people offset each others we weaknesses. What does trump need more . More tail or ballist to set the course for november . Trump makes noise, mistakes, and gaffes. He doesnt need somebody else out there freelancing it and making the same kinds of mistakes with more sail. What he needs i ballist. He needs christian conservatives, people who would have been for cruz. His stronger opponent in the end is cruz speaking to the radio conservatives, speaking to the christian conservatives. This guy is going to be perfect for them. I would say that if i were Hillary Clintons people, the smart people around her, id be a little wobbly myself right now thinking, my god, this guy, after all this zanyness may have hit a bulls eye here because when they come out this thursday, there will be a good show boater, trump, and theres a solid base to that campaign in mike pension, and i think itll work. I think its a rare case where somebody who seemed to be going all over the place if he picked Chris Christie, its bridgegate from now to november. If he picked gingrich, its the six wives club. The ridiculousness of two guys running on the family values ticket and traditional marriage with six wives among them. It wouldnt have worked. Yeah. So whatever went on in trumps mind, the people around him probably the family, the smart people around him said pick the guy that gets you elected. Not the guy you like. Not the guy you want to exactly what happened with jack kennedy and lyndon johnson. They were not soul brothers. They did not hang out together. They were not buddies. Bobby didnt like him at all, and yet, lyndon gave him the carolina, georgia, and texas, and the american presidency and his place in history. This is big casino. Its not about finding your match, but finding the person that takes you over the finish line, and if trump has a good chance, and i would say right now on average untroubled day when theres not any screwups by he or secretary clinton, looks like an even fight right now, and to do better than that, p s pence can help him do it. Youre picking a Vice President , not a best friend. Love that quote. Yeah, sure. I appreciate you, man. Thank you very much. All right, coming up, how would donald trump respond to a world in turmoil . Ill ask my guest as we continue here live from cleveland. Take on the unexpected with a car that could stop for you. Nissan safety shield technologies, available in the altima, sentra and maxima. Now get 0 apr for up to 72 months, plus 500 bonus cash. 80 of recurrent ischemic, strokes could be prevented. And im doing all i can to help prevent another one. A bayer aspirin regimen is one of those steps in helping prevent another stroke. 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Pg e provided all of the homes here with solar panels. The solar savings can mean a lot, especially for lowincome families. With the savings that i am getting from the solar panels, its going to help me to have a Better Future for my children. To learn how you can save energy and money with solar, go to pge. Com solar. Together, were building a better california. Translator given to the people, and im telling this, the end will be good. It will it will end in a good way. Last nights coup attempt in turkey and the attack in nice thursday has people wondering what a Trump Presidency looks like in a time of crisis. Joining us is howard fineman, and in new york, the daily beast columni columnist, and im deferring to the elected official first, congressman ryan, you saw this sort of responses right out of the gate of donald trump, which usually is on twitter, and Hillary Clinton, but both of them sort of opined about whats going on in the world. Give them a grade. How do you think they did . In the roll out . Well, just on responding to the world events over the 24 hours. Well, clearly, you see the sophistication in the Clinton Campaign. Theres always a deeper understanding where, i think, trumps trying to appeal to some quick emotional flash in the pan idea coming out where theres more substance coming out of the Hillary Clinton campaign, and i think both of those reflect the candidates. Lets listen to both of them. Starting with donald trump and what he said the United States ought to do. This was donald trump on fox news, and i believe this was after nice, lets take a listen. Would you go to congress and ask for a declaration of war . I would. I would. This is war. If you look at it, this is war coming from all different parts, and, frankly, its war and dealing with people without uniforms. This is a tunisian citizen attacking paris where he lives. Who would donald trump be declaring war on in this instance . Well, thats a good question. I dont think its one that donald trump is really considered. Those are details. As the congressman said, hes in it for the emotion. Its the combination of nice and turkey show there are serious complexities to whats happening in the muslim world around the world. You dont answer it by declaring war on an entire faith of 1. 6 billion people in places of uncertain definition, and thats just what donald trump said he wanted to do. For contrast, Hillary Clinton calling into fox news thursday after the nice attacks. Lets take a listen. We got to do more to understand that this is a war against these terrorist groups, the radical jihadist groups. Its a different kind of war. We have to be smart how we wage it, but we have to be determined were going to win it. Absolutely. Thats going to require working with other people. And so, dean, you know, you have both of these candidates, or at least in a sense, talking about war, and talking about the United States being in a war footing. Theres not that much a divergen divergence, but did you hear anything different in what donald trump had to say and what Hillary Clinton was trying to convey . I did more specifically after the shooting in orlando. Hillary clinton made a speech that was beautiful not covered by the media the way it should have been. We have to work with the muslim community, they are partners on this, not demonized. Made it clear in a time when standing up for muslims does not help you here in america, and im a muslim, so i can say that. Heath propose a hunger games, honestly, i think with the muslims, and the idea of banning muslim, islam hates us, its bone chilling and plays into what isis wants, our elected officials to say to tell muslims in the west youre hated by our leaders, join us. Donald trump helps isis more than america right now. Speaking of demonizing, this is the dog that didnt hunt, right . Newt gingrich had thoughts of nice as well. I want to play them for you because i wonder, howard, whether it was an attempt to maybe change Donald Trumps mind. In fact, he was still on the fence, or maybe it was something else. Lets listen to Newt Gingrich on fox news on thursday. Western civilization is in a war. We should, frankly, test every person here who is a of muslim background, and if they believe in sharia, they should be deported. It is incompatible with western civilization. What do you think that was . Well, fist of all, donald trump had committed to mike pence at that point, but that doesnt mean Newt Gingrich was not still trying to claw his way on the ticket. I think thats part of it, and not long off newt made that appearan appearance, i got a text from the member of the inner circle of the Trump Campaign asking me what i thought of the remarks. I said they were way the hell over the line, obviously, and the response i got later on was, yeah, i agree with you. Yeah. So i think the trump inner circle said we got one bomb thrower here, namely, donald trump, we dont need a megadouble triple cheese burger here. We already got it. Yeah. I think, if anything, that solidified the determination to make their dad and their friend and their boss take mike pence. And, i mean, probably on the hill, your colleagues on the other side of the aisle probably feel well, do they feel better now knowing its mike pence who they feel is predictable even if he switches positions because he was for the iraq war, for instance, et cetera. Is he more predictable than Newt Gingrich . Well, he was personal relationships there, and he was kind of in the very beginning the freedom caucus, the guys, primarily guys, who have shut down the government time and time again, intractable group of people in the house of representatives who said were going to default on our debt, you know, that said, you know, shut down the government, were going to defund planned parenthood. He started that. Mike pence has those kinds of political ties with those people in the house of representatives, and, obviously, he seems to be close to paul ryan and the other folks, but thats what youre getting. I mean, youre going to get that hard line conservative position that is that led to government shut down and our inability, really, to have a functioning congress. And, dean, as a member of the group that apparently Newt Gingrich would like to test for your americanness or your adherence to sharia, do you believe that with Newt Gingrich not on the ticket that that kind of rhetoric dies down with pence, or do you expect to hear more of the same . I have to be honest, joy, im focusing on any Newt Gingrich sharia test. If you want to form a study group, im available. We do well in school. I dont think it matters. Donald trump and Newt Gingrich, hes part of an administration, hes a scary man who actually back pedalled on facebook with a more ominous message saying, if you pass the test, you should have nothing to fear, your children should have nothing to fear. Who says your children should have nothing to fear, he said, if you dont pass my test, your children should fear something, deport you, stateless for your views. I have no doubt he has no idea what sharia means, no understanding of islam, but he knows demonizing plays well with the republican base, and thats troubling these days. Absolutely. Thank you all for being here. I want to let congressman ryan know we were in ohio earlier this week talking with folks, and id love to have you come back and talk about whether you think that having pence on the ticket helps with the rust belt. Hopefully youll be back, but i cant leave the segment without declaring its the birthday of howard feinman. It is . Its not my birthday, but ill accept it. I was going to give you i thought you were going to congratulate you. Its your birthday . Oh, i got the wrong birthday. Blame the staff. When she said that, oh, my god, i have the same birthday as howard. Your gift is the same as howards. Excellent. You were wearing one of these yourself before you came on the air. I was. I didnt want to selfpromote. Selfdepp kags, you took it off. We have the same birthday. This is cool. Happy birthday to the right person now. I completely screwed that up. Howard is sticking around because its not his birthday, and thank you to tim ryan who is celebrating his birthday. And dean, studying for the sharia test. Donald trump is set to officially introduce mike pence for the running mate, and what does he gain from the pick . Anything . Anything at all . Talking to the Political Panel as we continue on a. M. Joy live from cleveland. How i stay active. And to keep up this pace, i need the right nutrition. So i drink boost®. Boost® complete nutritional drink has 26 essential vitamins and minerals, including calcium and vitamin d to support strong bones, and 10 grams of protein to help maintain muscle. In three delicious flavors. Im not about to swim in the slow lane. Stay strong. Stay active with boost®. Yesterday, governor mike pence heard the three little words any wouldbe Vice President ial cap dndidate likes hear. Any comment . Youre important now. Youre important now. Back with me, howard feinman, and from los angeles, democratic strategi strategist, bob. Assess the pick. We had a debate in the commercial break, and you said mike pence helps donald trump win indiana . I think you can check indiana off the list right now. I just do. Im going to debate you on this. Sure. Heres my theory about pence in indiana. Out of the governors race, Mitch Daniels is not running. So now you got two members of the house of representatives vacating seats to go for the governor spot as well as lieutenant governor, throw that chaos, give democrats two bites at the apple, but on top of it, the most famous name other than the president ial contenders on the ballot is evan buy. If he has coat tails at all and carries the state of indiana, hillary can carry the state of indiana. Didnt pence put eindiana in play . No, no. Running for the senate, if hes putting indiana in play, i just dont think so. I think indianas transformed into a pretty solid republican state, goods Political Party there, well organized, the job numbers are good, the job creation numbers are good. Bens is unpopular. Really unpopular. Well, yeah, but he was campaigning for governor. That hatters. People said he was in real risk of losing. People said that, but i dont believe it. I dont. Do you like my theory or the other lousy theory . You wont be surprised to learn that i like your theory. Yes i think pence was in terrible trouble. He wanted to be Vice President to get out of running for governor. Look, all the serious republicans who would have been strong Vice President ial candidates didnt want this because they think theres deft for donald trump, and they dont want to be tarred with his brand so pence is the best choice out of the group of Newt Gingrich, Chris Christie who would have hurt the ticket. I dont know that he hurt it, but i dont think hes an asset. Howard, the tie breaker here, whats pence get out of this . A ticket out of indiana is what he gets. Yeah. He was in bad shape, however, as the umpire here and the siding factor, im going in this direction. Oh because the reason your charm wins again. Well, no. I think evan can win in indiana as a fairly conservative democrat. I think indianas fundamentally the sort of geology of it these days is more republican. Right. Id be really surprised if the Clinton Campaign in the end puts a lot of time and effort in indiana, and pence is helpful in other ways with the base, of course, and also be being Irish Catholic by background, that thing matters. Yeah. He sends a small to these i dont know whether its a village here, im not sure, but sends a message here that trump is willing to play by certain rules of convention to make a pun. Hes actually ticked off two of the bases, old threelegged stool, the ultimate evangelical, pence, couldnt do better, and hes going to mull my the ryan wing of the party, but trump had those. The that wing con pitchlated a long time ago. He was going along with donald trump no matter, and the evangelica evangelicals, other than mormons, were with trump. I dont know they were passionately with trump, but what i found in 2008 in running a Political Party where i worried about down ticket races because obama did well in south carolina, my home state, really well in the primary, first overvote on us in years, and there was an Enthusiasm Gap that a gal named sarah palin filled for us. Takes 6,000 volunteers to win an election. Cutting your vote in half. Put it in half. Not the whole vote, but the advantage. What pence does is gets us tech anily, what we need, volunteers, the Prolife Movement understands who pence is, but surely after this week, the world didnt know pence. Yep. Thats one thing obama got. He got that it takes more than just activists and more than just political consul tapts, but bodies on the ground to win election, and trumps been running the other way. This is a help. Just a quick point here, weve done a lot of reporting at the Huffington Post whether donald trump has a ground game of his own, and the fact is, he has no organization, zero, so hes going to need this type of thing to have a shot in some of the states including ohio where the right to life folk isyeah. Quickly, you heard hes getting evangelicals on the streets, thats what he needs . I think hell get the evangelical votes, but this discussion misses the point. Were doubling down here on a shrinking republican coalition. Right. This is a guy who is at odds on immigration, womens rights, discrimination against lgbt people and stands for the 1 in terms of economic policies, not the Blue Collar Workers donald trump claims hes talking to. Yeah, yeah. In a larger sense, i dont think the guy helps, but hes a footnote in history. Wow. Hes given credit. Thank you very much. Dayton so charming. Staying around. How important is the pick with the evangelical voters . Well talk about that next. 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We love the art of the deal, but the bible is far, far superior, right . Yes, we just love the bible. That was donald trump back in december loving the bible, trying his best to woo evangelical voters, and a recent poll showing trump support with e evangelicals, it worked. Now trump doesnt have to try to prove hes a true conservative christian because in picking an indiana governor, mike pence as running mate, he has the real deal. Pences record of allowing faith to guide policies on abortion and gay rights and Everything Else helped win the president ial straw poll at the voter conference in 2010 when pence described himself this way. Im a christian, a conservative, and a republican in that order. [ cheers and applause ] all right. Lets bring in the guests, our National Republican sorry, not a National Republican consultant. Jeff charlotte by remote, professor at Dartmouth College and author of the family, and, jeff, going to you on this first to have you on today just to talk about the sort of nexus between republicanism and e evangelicalism in washington. Where does mike pence fit into that . Mike pence is one of the brokers of that and to understand mike pence and that religious conservative politics, you have to not think of social conservativis conservativism, but pence says, our goal, mission, is to marry fiscal and moral values. He sees them as one in the same, so when you go back in the record and look at his speeches about abortion, which are really something. Hes probably the most antiabortion president ial or vp candidate weve had. You see him also bringing in financial. He sees if we dont stop abortion, our economy will collapse. Hes the guy who sort of stands in the middle between those two factions of the Republican Party. And just to make that point, just a few sort of bullet points on mike pence as far as the issue, banning abortion because of genetic anomalies and signed a law mandating, and this is weird, women who have a miscarriage or abortion have to have a burial for the fetus and must cremate after a miscarriage or abortion. Signed a law religious believes diskrim nation in lawsuits, and after a backlash, revised the law to exclude lgbt discrimination that got him in trouble with conservatives in indiana. On prison, he reinstated a tenyear minimum drug sentencing, and expanded the Affordable Care act, but supports repealing it all and enacted modifications modified version of the obamacare expansion, which got him in trouble with conservatives, and lastly, planned parenthood, cut funding in half in the state of indiana forcing closure of districts at the same time there was an hiv outbreak that caused, you know, really a lot of panic, and with that kind of a record, this is an expansion sort of pick, right . Right. Somebody who doubles, triples down on evangelicals. Those are far right positions. Hard right positions. Look, we can debate whether vp nominee helps the top of the ticket or not, but what are the things that you look for is how does the top of the ticket look to expand his or her reach to bring in people beyond the ticket. You got to pull in people who are in the middle. People who are independents. People who could go one way or the other. If thats your goal, having someone like governor pence on your ticket is not reaching out at all, and its, to me, it says that donald trump is desperately trying to hang on to the base and convince the base to actually come out and vote for him rather than stay home because they dont believe hes truly conservative, truly that e evangelical voice they want in the white house. I wonder how, you know, big of a deal you think it is. Theres been backlash on the right to the pence pick, some people who say he flipflopped on amnesty, immigration, and too much in favor of it in congress, but specifically on the roll back on the religious freedom restoration act in indiana where he walked it back signing a bill that amended it a little bit, right around the federalist flat out called him a fraud in part based on doing that. What do you think of the backlash on the right, trumpism or real . I think its white noise. At the end of the day, hes a Vice President ial pick, and i go back from my friend on why the pick is going to be a good pick. I didnt bring the historical numbers of the obama election in 20 that turned out to be a base election. The obama election of 2008 had huge numbers in it. We left 6. 5 million republicans on the deck that didnt vote that voted for mccain and george bush, so theres a base election coming, and weve got two candidates with these extremely high negatives, so i want to know how you turn that into this wave election because this, i dont think is coming. So if youre talking about the base and making the base happy, the base was uneasy with donald trump. Sure. This is going to help that just in the mathematics of we need to win ohio. We need to win the rural county. We need to win the kasich coalition in ohio, and i think that helps in the state. A good reminder that blom won indiana in 2008. Right. Jeff charlotte, the evangelical community, theres a debate how big it is, white e even jell call who tend to be republican voters. Were they a retracted factor . Did they walk away in large part from the 2012 election . Is that a real thing they are the disappearing white electorate pollsters say are out there, but could they be reactivated by a pence pick . Absolutely a base that could be reactivated, and look at the history, theres a media history here of about every four to eight years the press carries the religious right gone and dead. That goes back 40 years, and they keep coming back, and they keep coming back and changing. Remember, pence is he describes himself as a catholic evangelic evangelical. A catholic, but also goes to evangelical megachurches, theology formed by that that expands his reach. Absolutely. Thank you. That is our time. Thank you for being here. Really appreciate it. Wish we had more time. Up next, the First Official appearance as trump and pence or known as trumpence. Thats after the break. Stay with us. At experian, we believe credit isnt just a score. Its a skill. And like anything else, you can get better. So we make it easy for you to spot trouble in your report. Or know if fraud is hurting your fico score. And if you need it, a dedicated fraud resolution agent can help you set things right. After all, watching over your credit is one of the most important skills of all. Go to experian. Com to enroll in Experian Creditworks today. Incr. Think it wouldotection in a pwork, but it does. Dnt. Its called always discreet for bladder leaks, the super. Absorbent core turns liquid to gel. I know im wearing it but no one else will. Always discreet for bladder leaks. Who do you talk to for military advice right now . Im Hillary Clinton and i approved this message. Well, i watch the shows. I mean i really see a lot of great you know, when you watch your show and all of the other shows. While donald trump watched tv, as secretary of state, Hillary Clinton negotiated a cease fire in gaza. A reduction in nuclear weapons. Took on vladimir putin. And stood up against the trafficking of human beings. A steady leader in an unsteady world. Good day from new york, Brian Williams here with you, and were going to be broadcasting from just down the street from rockefeller plaza, the new york hilton, where, behind that curtain, donald trump and mike pence will soon emerge. What was billed as something as a conference, though, the seats for the news media kr behind those of the honored guests up front. In front of the curtain, in front of the flags. Well be hearing from and seeing both men in about 15 minutes. Katie has covered the Trump Campaign for a year now. Shes there. Katie, this has been called an off Brand Selection for donald trump who went with a real politician, a real conservative, a washington veteran, a standing governor of indiana. Reporter this is a traditional pick for a nontraditional candidate, and it is surprising in that it is something that is not surprising in a way because donald trump usually picks something who is a little bit more off brand, as you said, brian. Apolitical, but the campaign realizing they needed somebody to smooth things over in washington, somebody who knows the ropes, who gets legislation through. Governor pence, not only a governor of indiana, but served formally in congress and is wellrespected by leaders there. Paul ryan calling him a a great friend. This is a pick that hopefully helps unify the party going into the convention, as there is still worry about a potential coup trying to be raised at convention before donald trump officially gets the nomination for the party, so that should help. They are also trying to, hoping this helps solidify the base of social conservatives in the swing states that surround indiana, places like ohio, but not only ohio, but other rust belt states like pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin, those types of places. Will he be able to lure in moderate voters, expand Donald Trumps base of support, not necessarily governor pence is a social conservative, and hes one who has been quite controversial in indiana for signing the religious restoration act which critics said allowed businesses to discriminate on people based on their sexual identity. There was blowback from that in the business community, and after that, he tried to back away from it, and then angering social conservatives, so hes certainly not the most unifying character in indiana, and already, the Hillary Clinton team and supporters of hers and lgbt communities jumped on pence for that. They have to face that in the general Election Campaign with pence, but, ultimately, the Campaign Says its Donald Trumps ticket, his platform, and pence plays a supporting roll. This is the first time they will be seen together since officially making the choice, so we can say that governor pence is only the presumed Vice President ial pick at the moment because, ultimately, donald trump, as weve learned, can be quite unpredictable. The campaign trying to push back on those rumors he was still trying to make a decision late as thursday night. I spoke to the Campaign Chairman, and he said he knew the decision for a couple days prior. He wouldnt tell me the exact time that donald trump made the decision, but he said that governor pence when he got on the plane to come to new york city knew he would be the vp pick. Certainly, not the smoothest rollout of most campaigns. Donald trump certainly hoped it would be a little bit easier than this, but it is not unexpected. He was on the cover of the new york post, knowing he was not the pick, but cheney picked himself. He was the vetter for Vice President ial picks, he picked himself. Its not unheard of these things dont go so smoothly, but the campaign hoped to have control over the message and said he was frustrated out the inability to control especially when leaks came when he was still in california. Thank you. Again, in the ballroom at the new york hilton where, again, were inside 15 minutes before the scheduled time when we will see trump and pence. They rolled out the new logo of the campaign yesterday incorporating both of the names. Chris matthews is standing by for us. Chris, this was supposed to be an announcement at 11 00 a. M. Yesterday. It was originally the terrorist attack in nice, france that postponed it. In the interim last night, by the way, covered an attempted military coup in turkey, but all of it just adds to a backdrop that politics is Serious Business at the end of the day, and just some of the work awaiting the next president. Yeah. The world doesnt stop. It keeps turning. So does terrorism keep happening, and military coups, attempted coups, shows its a dynamic. I have to say, brian, you know how much i love history, and you do as well, theres an echo here, all this confused, reporting at this point, because its not been clarified yet, how cold trumps feet were midnight thursday night of the election of pence. Ive been doing a work on this on Jack Kennedys selection of lyndon johnson. Probably the most successful teaming up weve ever seen, teaming up which was essential to the victory of the democratic ticket in 1960. Without johnson, kennedy would have lost texas, the carolinas, and probably georgia, but he won them because of lyndon johnson. Bobby kennedy was trying to stop that from happening. Jack wobbled. Finally, kennedy realized he couldnt get out of the deal struck with johnson and went ahead with it with anger and confusion on the labor and liberals who thought it was Scoop Jackson or stu. Cold feet does not mean a bad marriage. Theres a lot of marriages out there that have been very successful that began with cold feet, and in this case, we saw cold feet. Chris, there will be history in the air. The new york hilton is where Ronald Reagan declared in 1979, so theres that that will be looming above this event. Yes. But i want to ask you, ill join your history point and ask you this, is jfks selection of lbj, wasnt that, couldnt you argue, the last time a Vice President ial candidate truly delivered a definable block that we can look back and say it helped to make the difference . Well, it surely did, and its hard for me to find a clearcut case. Well, certainly people added to the stature of the ticket later on, and gore helped clinton establish the fact they were the new breed, welleducated crowd from the south, the new south, if you will, that solidified that. Youre right, though, hard to find a tangible, countable example of where a vp candidate delivered, brought in states that the president ial nominee could not have possibly won, and i think were going to see it here, and, by the way, i really think everybody wonders why he picked pence. Well, pence gives him the hew hew wits, the christian conservatives, probably the editorial page and oped page of the wall street journal, a good backup for any republican candidate. That gives him, i think, a base that he wont fall below, a floor where i dont he wont go below 40 in november now. He probably has that so bounce up from, and meaning its not a wipeout necessarily at all. I thought for months, as many people did, if the waters calmed, hillary wins, but if its calm now, it may be dead even, so i think this guy gives them a very good fallback position of christian conservatives, true conservatives, radio conservatives, people people he did not have, and he lost consistently to ted cruz. He got cruz without the personality in mike pence. Stand by, listen with us, were bringing in a friends of ours, the Washington Post political reporterer, msnbc political analyst. Robert, chris ran through the positives. Remind our viewers the areas where these two men previously disagre disagreed, and, also, i need you to go through just how close it was thursday night in trump land, in Donald Trumps thought process. Brian, good to be with you. On your first point, you began the broadcast talking about governor pence as perhaps an off Brand Selection for donald trump. In terms of policy, ideology, it certainly is an off brand or unusual selection because pences career going back to his days as a talk radio host in indiana, then his time in the house and time as governor, he really is a movement conservative, someone who identifies with the right wing of the Republican Party, someone who on social issues, which trump rarely speaks about on the campaign trail, hes against abortion rights, samesex marriage, and for defunding planned parenthood, but theres a tonal contrast in that trumps combative popularism is different from pence who is soft spoken, a way of talking about conservati conservatism, and identifies with mid western conservatives and country club republicans. The way the decision up folded over the course of thursday was confusing to many of us who were trying to report it out because we had signals that pence was the choice, but theres no word for hours about whether a former offer was made. Adding to the confusion, brian, was the fact that donald trump was in california. Well, his Campaign Chairman and top aids were here in cleveland getting ready for the convention. They were in touch with the candidate, but he was, in a sense, ice lated in california reaching the final stages of the decision, and until late thursday, trump insisted he had not made a final decision, and during the course of the day, he was talking to Chris Christie, talking to others in the pear, and there were signals going to pence that he was the pick, but the formalization of the decision and the offer, well, those details still remain murk ki. Robert in cleveland where we note the weather, it might as well rain now, get it out of its system so everyone can get around over the next several days of the Gop Convention without worrying. May it be sunny and blue skies for the rest of the week. Steve scmidt is with us. And, steve, i have yet to talk with you since the selection made. Lets have the first conversation on air with friends listening. Id love your reaction to the selection of mike pence and just told the short motorcade is underway from trump tower for donald trump over to the new york hilton on sixth avenue. First observation, brian, is the unveiling of the Vice President ial pick is the occasion where the Campaign Signs pages. It remains trump, not trumppence. That signifies something about the ticket thats different. This is Donald Trumps Republican Party. This is Donald Trumps convention. You have in mike pence a social conservative warrior, somebody who made hearts gleeful in the hearts of the movement of the Republican Party, made people happy inside the House Republican conference, but someone who is off brand from trump. You think about Vice President ial candidates, you want a couple of things. The president ial candidate is the person who drives the ballot. Thats who people are voting for. You want to deliver a great speech in convention and do a great job in the debate with 40 Million People watching, and so for donald trump, he had three choices, Newt Gingrich, Chris Christie, mike pence. Two of those, Chris Christie and Newt Gingrich, superior communicators, two people who woef done well in the debate, and mike pence is a blank slate on that. Whats the speech going to be like at the Republican Convention . What will his debate performance be like . Donald trump, i think it bears mentioning, built his brand in opposition to the republican establishment, and in making this pick, he pleased that republican establishment, but its very much off brand from the combative chain style that weve seen donald trump embrace, and that i think Newt Gingrich and Chris Christie embody as a Vice President ial candidate. What about the interpersonal relationship . Its not everything, but as you note, it is important, and in a lot of marriages, political or civilian, opposites attract. Look, theres no question about that, we dont know yet what the deal is, the governing deal that donald trump and mike pence have. We dont know what those conversations have been, or rather they had them at all, but you know, brian, the Vice President ial, the Vice President , you know, serves at the discretion of the president. They have one constitutional responsibility to be the president of the senate, and in the modern era, really starting with Walter Mondale through dick cheney and joe biden, weve seen tremendous power accrue to the office of the Vice President where they become real government partners, real governing partners. You know, of course, theres the famous moment where harry truman, you know, short time after being sworn in as Vice President with Franklin Roosevelt dies on april 12th, he had no idea the United States was on the edge of testing the first atomic bomb. He spent just a few minutes with fdr. It remains unclear whether theres a continuation of the expanding role of the Vice President or is there a reset back to the time when a Vice President was a fairly player in the administration. With donald trump, you dont know which way the wind blows on that. Truman said he felt like the sun, moon, and stars fell down upon him. Steve, youve played in the game. Youve played on the feel. Tell us from the inside when it works well, what is the coordination, fast forward to its mid october, the campaign underway, is there a kind of concert that needs to happen . Is there a Conference Call everyone morning . Several of them every day, the candidate, the Vice President ial candidate are preferably for a welloiled campaign, hitting two different constituencies, two different parts of the country making targeted appearances. This is kind of like a ballet, two members of the same team, correct . Ultimately, brian, this Campaign Comes down to seven or eight states and roughly 10 of likely voters who are undecided by mid october, and so the Vice President ial candidates job is to get attention to prosecute a message to prosecute a message of change against the democrats, against Hillary Clinton, and so theyll be coordinating with the campaign. They want mike pence to be out there, to be delivering a tough message that at the end of the day, president ial campaign, theres two types of campaigns, right . Change versus more of the same. Donald trump is the change agent in the campaign. Professional politician, indiana governor, mike pence to prosecute the change message when we get into the middle of october. Steve watching along with us here in new york. Joy reid is out in cleveland having hosted the last hour. Joy, nothing goes past steve, and we want to show our audience what the podium looks like and the fact the logo rolled out yesterday that combines trump and pence. There it is. The Art Department was at work, but its not what is displayed on the podium. Joy, youre among those who will watch this marriage starting from this ceremony on forward. Yeah. Im not surprised theyre not using that logo, baa, of course, it was a distraction when it was an object of ridicule on social media. It was not the best idea from the Art Department of the new trumppence campaign, and it was widely panned and ridiculed. I think they are wise to not deploy that on the stage. Theres a couple interesting points. Donald trump was ase met try call candidate, and everything about the campaign has been about really going directly at the face of the establishment, and then he winds up picking somebody who is very much establishment. Hes very much steeped in both the washington wing of the Republican Party and the evangelical wing of the party, and i wonder if for donald trump that is going to create a Comfort Level for him. Steve knows well what happens when you have a long time political figure choose someone he doesnt really know. The sarah palin pick similar in the sense they didnt have a relationship at all going into the campaign and didnt know he was 100 getting with sarah palin, but she was an enhancer to the brand, which is maverick. Mavericks, designed to be an enhancer and designed to get skeptical base republicans, tea party type republicans on his side, later tea party, that republican on his side. For donald trump, the polling shows he already had evangelicals. The washington wing of the Republican Party with with him. Paul ryan, even when he called the comments racist said he was with him 100 , rubio with him 100 . It is an interesting pick from that point of view. Im not sure what the relationship will be like. What i do think hes done with pence, though, is, number one, made this a lot about the Supreme Court. This will be a pick that signals to the base of the party that votes on the court that hes going to be listening to somebody like mike pence. Helpful to him, and he gives the down ticket cap dndidates someo else to campaign with. That was important to do. Joy from rainy cleveland ohio. Its not just raining, but coming down. Get it out of the system now. Back to Chris Matthews in washington. Chris. It was said early on when we learned it would be mike pence that this would unite the Republican Party, perhaps, before i heard someone shoot back that donald trump has dissembled the modern Republican Party. Thats the point of this campaign, the point of the convention. Were about to witness, chris, a convention, again, for us political history buffs up like any other gathering weve seen. Well, yeah, because theyll be trouble. We all know that. Were all taking precautions for that. We expect to be a lot of protests. Hopefully limited to peaceful protests, but theres a lot of action outside Convention Hall grabbing the attention of the cameras. To be an event next week. We know that because trump is a mag innocent, a lightning rod, whatever the metaphor is, he causes trowel with other people who see him as the enemy. Africanamericans, we saw that at that Downtown Chicago rally that he held. We saw it in san diego with the hispanic, latino population showing up. Sometimes it seems like hes out there trying to royal it up to create trouble, but it comes, and all those groups, organized or not, are going to see cleveland as a chance to express themselves. They dont like being called rapist. If youre a latino, you dont want to be a rapist. You see the guy as a man who called the president of the United States basically an illegal immigrant, somebody born in africa who somehow pulled wool over our eyes making himself eligible for the presidency. Thats not to be forgotten, and so theres a lot of enemies out there of donald trump who will show up in cleveland. Lets hope they express themselves with the right way, with the way with words and loud noise and, perhaps, some excitement, but not in a violent way, but we know that thats going to be a big part of the story here. This convention could be like 68, the Democratic Convention in chicago. Its not the same as having a war going on, the people find to be awful like the vietnam war, but it is a country in division right now, and so i think its going to be one hell of a week out there, and i dont think the Vice President si or the things we talk about on the platform, really, will be able to compete with the natural clatter that were going to hear. Its going to be noisy. Chris, i was not even talking about trouble. I was talking about the fact that the two living former republican president s who both happen to be named bush will not be there. I was talking about the two previous standards, mccain and romney, and how about the host governor, john kasich, who was part of the 17 republican field, and who had a base of support, a constituency in the race and kind of marketed himself as the sensitive real guy from ohio. I think the gathering, even the part we see at home on tv is just going to look so dramatically different. We are seeing in life the disappearance of the Republican Party youre describing. This and the rest of them, and bill and christy, the North Eastern republican establishment, personified by the bushes, even though they moved to the southeast is the Republican Party that disappeared. Its the abolitionists and the wigs, they are the wig part of the Republican Party. The question to answer is can he replace them with the working class working people of ohio state, wisconsin, and michigan, bring people out to replace the establishment people. The ivy leaguers, if you will, can they be replaced . Can he do it . Its there. Weve seen it. Weve seen it from erie, pennsylvania, from parts of ohio, parts that have been basically pulled back from in terms of manufacturing. The parts that have. Hallowed out. The angry white families up there that have. Left more or less marooned economically. A lot of people out there ready to express themselves for trump. We hear it a lot. The Vice President , joe biden, will be set up there to appeal to them, but thats a lot of job for just biden to pull u off. I dont know that he can pull it off, and im not sure that president obama has any swag up there either. That part is replacing the new york dominate, the republican establishment. If that happens, trump wins. If not, he loses. Middle case could well be trump loses arizona. Trump loses a couple other states, surprising states because of the antiimmigrant status. He could lose utah because hes too secular. Too many marriages and new york attitude. Could lose offsetting that. Democrats could get all the women, big chunk of them from the northeast, those who live along the Railroad Tracks along the amtrak route, husbands in the old days took the train in likely dad did to philadelphia, where they have ads for new york broadway shows on the tracks. You sense that culture, and those people could all come out against trump. The erie people, the working people from upper pennsylvania, you were right, you said it ten minutes ago, this Republican Party, if it wins, is totally different than the won with george bush senior winning pennsylvania winning that election 5746 against mike dukaukis. We have been talking about the politics of emergency. The politics, and, steve, look at the last 48 hours. This announcement was put off by a terrorist attack, and in the interim, we had an attempted coup in turkey. This is kind of the big boy politics, geopolitics that happens, that will happen, and that is bound to affect this race along the way. I think one of the deficiencies of coverage, brian, of a president ial campaign is on any given day we sit and we analyze and try to predict whats going to happen in november based on events that have already occurred as opposed to taking intoing the events that have yet to occur. And so if we just go back a couple of weeks in this country, we have seen a terror attack in orlando. We have seen two inexplicable, outrageous Police Shootings on videotape. We have seen the assassination of five police officers. Weve seen the attempted coup in turkey. Weve seen another mass casualty terror attack in nice, france, and, for sure, theres more of this to come. And so as we look ahead now to the Republican Convention, to the Democratic Convention, were entering the stage of the campaign where the consequential events of the campaign are beginning to take place, and you can break it down to six important moments in a general Election Campaign that are fixed on the calendar. Theres the Vice President ial selection, which is now underway in the rollout. Theres the nominating speech, the three debates in the fall, and the Vice President ial debate. The debates, i believe, are the most watched broadcasts in American Television history, probably the most watched global broadcasts since the moon landing, and its the six events plus how do the candidates react to events that are unfolding around them, whether its a mass shooting, whether its a terror attack, whether its a terror attack on a key ally like france, and its through the reaction to the events that the American People take the measure of the temperament, the confidence, the judgment of the candidates for president , but for sure, were moving into to a general election now in Tumultuous Times where theres rapidity to consequential events coming in the living rooms of peoples homes on a daily base. You said this about debates since way, way early in the cycle. Steve here in new york, checking in with katie who is in the room. Weve seen what appears to be remarks brought out to the podium and told that one of the songs weve become familiar with and associated with the Trump Campaign you cant always get what you want has been piped into the sound system. In fairness, it is used at just about every trump rally, but, perhaps, a print reporter or two uses it to craft a lead about this choice and the rumors of what went on thursday night, and before i can get to you, lets go to the podium. Donald trump has appeared. [ applause ] thank you, everybody. Great honor. [ cheers and applause ] great honor, thank you. [ applause ] this is a wonderful day. [ chanting ] wow. On a saturday morning yet. Isnt that nice . Thank you, all. Were going to have an incredible convention. Its going to go well. Well have an incredible convention, and were going to get things solved and do wonderful things for our country, most importantly. So im here today to introduce the man who will be my partner in this campaign, and the white house, to fix our rigged system. Were in a rigged, rigged system, and to make america safe again and to make America Great again. [ applause ] i want to also address the islamic terrorist attack in france. Weve witnessed horror beyond belief. No matter where you look. And now its happening more and more. Its never going to stop. We need new leadership. We need new thinking. We need strength, we need in our country law and order and if im elected president , that will happen. [ applause ] i want to express unyielding support for the people of france and we mourn their loss as a nation, and as far as turkey is concerned, so many friends in turkey, great people, amazing people, we wish them well. It looks like they are resolving the difficulty, but we wish them well. A lot of anguish last night, but hopefully, itll all work out. Now, as, hopefully, the next president of the United States, i want to refer back to whats happened over the years. The middle east today is more unstable than ever before. Never been like this. Out of control. After four years of clinton, who really led the way, and let obama down a horrible path because i dont even think he could have made these decisions so badly, she led him right down a horrible path. He didnt know what he was doing. Iraq, syria, all into chaos, and iran is on a path to nuclear weapons. On top of that, we gave them back 150 billion dollars, and we didnt get our hostages until the end now were seeing unrest in turkey, a further demonstration of the failures of obamaclinton. You just have to look every single thing they touched has turned to horrible, horrible death defying problems. We need to bring back this country because we saw what happened. Our industry, our manufacturing, our jobs, they have been taken away. Taken away. And were going to bring them back. I found the leader who will help us deliver a safe society and a prosperous, really Prosperous Society for all americans. Indiana governor mike pence was my first choice. Ive admired the work hes done, especially in the state of indiana. Im going to go over some of those accomplishments in just a minute. I also admire the fact that he fights for the peopling and hes going to fight for you. Hes a solid, solid person. [ applause ] governor pence served indiana with distinction in congress. He rose to leadership and served as the chairman of the entire House Republican comp. Number one. Hes really got the skills of a highly talented executive, leading the state of indiana to jobs, growth, and opportunity in spite of the relentless obstacles put in his way and every states way by the obama administration. Its horrible out this. High taxes. Regulations. Its out of control. Mike pence is a man of honor, character, and honesty. We know that. Hillary clinton is the embodiment of corruption. Shes a corrupt person. What shes done with her emails, with so many things, and i see the ads up all the time. She bought and paid for by wall street, special interests, the lobbyists, 100 . Shes crooked hillary. [ applause ] and i think that while she got away with murder, in fact, i think it might be her greatest accomplishment, escaping the recent scandal and her lies and loss of 33,000 emails, but it was a loss, she discarded that in itself is a major crime. Other people have bchb paying tremendous prices which is peanuts compared to Hillary Clinton. 33,000 emails are missing, and thats okay . Didnt give them to the fbi . Didnt give them to the attorney generaling and thats okay. Wipes the server clean, and thats okay . These are crimes. These are crimes. How she got away with it, i dont understand it, i dont any a lot of people dont. While i dont believe she didnt price she needs to pay, shes going to pay the price when november 8th rolls around. Shes going to pay it at the polls. [ applause ] i believe that. On top of Everything Else, she made 21 Million Dollars giving speeches to special interests in a short period of time. Shes owned by wall street. We believe in americanism. She believes in globalism. Its not that she believes in it, but its the people who give her all this money believe in it, and shell believe in whatever they want her to believe. Believe me. Thats it. [ applause ] one difference between crooked Hillary Clinton and mike pence. [ cheers and applause ] mike pence will never be afraid to speak the name of our enemy. Radical islam. Radical islam terrorism. You saw it the other day with the truck screaming out the window. You heard what he was screaming out the window. You saw it in san bernardino. You saw it at the world trade center. You saw it in orlando. How horrible was that . You saw it in paris. You see it all over. And hillary is a weak person. We are the law in order candidates, and were the law and order party. Were going to change things around. Theres going to be respect again for law and order. [ cheers and applause ] Hillary Clintons policy helped launch isis. You knowings shes talking. I see the ads she puts on. If i make one statement, which is fine, shell take that statement and put on a totally dishonest set because shes got a lot of money given to her by the lobby iists and special interests. She has a lot of money. I see the ads on Foreign Policy, donald trump doesnt have Foreign Policy experience. Of course not, ive been a very, very successful business person, but if you look at my calls, i said, dont go into iraq. Nobody cared because i was a business person. I was a civilian. [ applause ] take the oil. Many, many calls ive made. You take a look. I said, scotland, the u. K. , that was going to happen, i predicted it. They said, hes wrong, hes wrong, back of the line, which is probably one of the reasons they lost, because i consider that a win, i think it was a win for them. They dont want to be told what to do. They dont want to be told when people pour into the country, they take them even if not qualified, even if they dont have paperwork, even if they have no idea where they come from. I said that brexits going to happen. I said they are going to break away, and everybody laughed at my, and the odds were 20 , and when it happened, she took an ad, saying, oh, donald trump said this or that, but i said it was going to happen. Some of the more fair reporters, 30 of them [ laughter ] said he was right. I appreciate that. Thats 70 that didnt, so thats okay. Mike pence will never be afraid to speak the name of our enemy, so important. Now, i think if you look at one of the big reasons that i chose mike, one of the reasons is part of kwlunity, i have to be hones. So many people said party unity. Im an outsider. I want to be an outsider. Its one of the reasons i won in landslides. This was not close. This wasnt close. [ applause ] now, this was not close. This was a history of the Republican Party. With 17 people running, you have to understand, other people reason against one, two, and three. I say we because im the messenger, im a messenger, im doing a good job, but im a messager. We got almost 14 million votes, more than any other person in the history of the Republican Party in the primary system running for president. Think of that. Thats more than reagan, who we love, more than nixon, more than dwight d. Eisenhower. We won the second world war, thats pretty good, more than the bushes, and people dont oversay that. That means our message is unbelievable. We have loyal, sump inbelievable people, and they displayed that just yesterday in cleveland, whats so amazing, but they displayed it. It was on display where we had a group of people who, many of whom ive known, and i wont say, because for party unity, wonderful people. Oh, never trump, never trump. They got crushed. They got crushed immediately because people want what were saying to happen. They are tired of a country that has horrible trade deals, that has no borders, that has taxes that are through the roof, highest taxed nation just about in the world. That has regulations that dont allow you to start a business and destroy your business if you do start, and, by the way, speaking of destroying businesses, were going to take care of the minors and were going to take care of the Steel Workers and put them back to work. [ applause ] so they are tired of it. I want to thank all of those people that delegates on the ticket, because, boy, was that something. Showed them something. Essentially, 11212, this was the vote that was going to put it on the floor, well have a fight. Were not going to have a fight. People agree. They want the wall. They want the borders. They want these things to happen. And what were doing [ applause ] and what were doing that im so proud of, and nobody else would think of doing it, i fought hard for it. He took away from the e evangelicals, and i want to thank the evangelicals because without them, i could not have won the nomination. The evangelicals have been unbelievable. No, ma dominated. A lot of people are surprised. Saying hes not perfect, but they know im going to get the job done, and they are really smart. [ applause ] and i says for the evangelicals that were going to do something that nobodys afraid to do. You have the Johnson Amendment passed, and he was a powerful president and knew how to get things done. He got bogged down in a war that was a disaster and it destroyed him. He was a powerful president. And we call it the Johnson Amendment where you are just shunned if you are evangelical if you talk religion. You lose your tax exempt status. We put into the platform, were going to get rid of that horrible Johnson Amendment, and were going to let evangelicals, christi christian, jews, and people of relion talk without being afraid to talk. I saw this. So many great leaders up to my office, the absolute top evangelical christian leaders, jewish leaders, believe it or not, some muslim leaders, people surprised to hear that, i had the top leaders up to my office, and i said, why is it that youre so powerful as an individual, but yet when you get out there, youre timid . They didnt know how to answer the question. Took three meetings before i figured it out. One great, great gentleman that everybody knows, but whose name i will not reveal said, mr. Trump, we live in fear in our churches and our synagogues. We live in fear that were going to lose our tax exempt status if we say anything thats slightly political. I looked out the window in trump tower and pointed to people walking down the street. I said, well, they have the right to speak, but you dont. That means they are more powerful than you. We have to do something about it. How did it start . How did it start . [ applause ] and they said, it started because of lyndon johnson. And he actually had a problem in texas with a certain religious leader, and he did this, and he got it done, and were going to undo it so that religious leaders in this country and those unbelievable people, and not because they backed me in such large numbers, but so that religion can again have a voe because religions voice has been taken away. Were going to change that. Okay . [ applause ] all right. Back to mike pension. So one of the primary reasons i chose mike was i looked at indiana, and i won indiana big. Remember, they were going the fire wall. Winning pennsylvania, and indiana was going to be, and i got to study new york, and i saw how nafta, signed by bill clinton, drained our manufacturing jobs, just drained us, like never before. Nafta, again, signed by bill clinton. Nafta is the worst economic deal in the history of our country. Manufacturing down in some states 5560 . Its a horror show. Moving to mexico, moving to other places. I have a friend who is a great builder. What he builds is plan plants. The biggest in the world from what i hear. With him the other day, hows business . He goes, unbelievable. I said, really, wow, im surprised. Why is it unbelievable . Because i think of the building in the country. He says, donald, what we do in mexico, you wont believe. We build plants in mexico the likes of which weve never seen. I said what about this country . Not much, not much. Nothing special. He said exactly that. Not much. I said, but mexico . He said, you never seen anything like it. Its incredible. Folks, thats going to stop. Were going to reverse it. Were going to bring our jobs back to this country. We cant be the stupid people anymore. [ applause ] okay. And he was better than a pollster, better than a consultant, how are we doing, a big report that costs millions of dollars. Dont cost me millions, me, i give 10,000, okay. [ laughter ] of course, other people cost millions, other campaigns millions to get a report, it costs millions, but tell you what, a guy like this is better than anybody you can hire to do a report. He said it. He didnt say it from the standpoint of, just a fact. In fact, he said i never, ever seen anything like it. If you look, ford is building massive plants, build them in michigan. You know, and i know, how to do that. We but theyre not going to do and theyre not going to take advantage of us without retribution. There are consequences when you fire thousands of people and move to another country and think you make a product and sell it here, theres consequences. Those consequences keep hurting the country. Every knows what the consequences are, but i wont say that because im much more interested right now in mike. Indianas Unemployment Rate, and this is the primary reason, other than he looks very good, other than hes got an incredible family, incredible wife and family, karen is amazing. [ applause ] incredible family. Highly respected. If not for another four years, he would have won very easily in indiana. Indianas Unemployment Rate fell when he was there, when he started, 8. 4 when he took over, to less than 5 in may of 2016. Since january 2013, indianas labor force increased by more than 186,000 jobs. Understand ive been around to all these states, and every time, i say this give me the stats on this thing, and its bad, down, down, down. Down 40 , 50 , 60 in some cases. Private sector job growth is up by more than 147,000 jobs since 2014. Theres a, like, very unusual. Pence balanced the budget. Can you message a balanced budget. Our budgets is so out of whack, we dont know what were doing. Soon owing 21 trillion dollars. He balanced the budget. They dont know what that means. He balanced the budget, produced a surplus, and maintains a 2 million reserve fund in the state of indiana. Its also rated aaa, their bonds, rated aaa. Few states have that. Aaa. The best. Thats as good as you can get whether your company or whatever, aaa. Indiana was recently recognized by chief executive magazine as the number one state in the midwest for business. Number one. And its not even close. There are approximately 34,000 fewer hoosiers on Unemployment Insurance now than there were when mike pence took office. So you have few hoosiers, fewer people from indiana. Besides that, bobby knight, my friend who helped me. If you want a reference, bobby knight in indiana, we love bobby knight, but he agrees with everything im saying. He loves the governor. [ applause ] indiana has the Second Lowest Unemployment Rate in the nation. For veterans where nobodys fighting for the veterans like im fighting for the veterans. They have been left behind. [ applause ] if you remember months ago, Hillary Clinton said the vas doing a much better job than people give it credit for. People die in line waiting six days for doctors. People are dying. They cant even see a doctor. Its a scandal. Look whats happening with the va in arizona. Look whats happening with gist the veterans administration. Its a scandal. Its corrupt. Its incompetent. Its a scandal. And Hillary Clinton says its just fine. Boy, am i going to win big with the veterans, i mean, we know that for a fact. In 2013, when mike pence took office, the rate for veterans was 36th in the nation, one of the bad ones, and now its almost the best. Got them jobs. Got them jobs. Indianapolis is ranked second in top ten metro areas for Young College graduates. Thats a great thing. Theyre going to stay there. Thats a great thing. Mike worked hard on that. He said it was not easy. Under governor pences leadership, indiana enacted the largest k12 Education Funding increase in the states history. So you balancing budgets, and yet youre giving more money to education. Isnt that a great thing . [ applause ] indiana has just about the Largest School Choice Program in america. School choice is where its at, folks, get rid of common core fast. Governor pence enacted the largest income tax cut in the states history. Think of that. Were cutting taxes and balancing budgets. And along with Corporate Tax reform, just about number one in the country. Cnbc ranked indiana first in the nation for its infrastructure. So with all of these cuts and all of these balancing budgets, were spending more money on education, and the infrastructure is kept up. That had so much look, as a builder, in the history of this country, has ever known so much about infrastructure as donald trump. I build infrastructure. Do i know how to build a wall . Do i know how to build infrastructure. Its interesting. Were building i won the, which pretty amazing, the obama administration, but won the right to have pennsylvania avenue, right near the white house, and probably the best location, one of the most sought after projects in the history of the services, and i really like what happened. Were going to have an opening very soon. They did a fantastic job, and i thought the other day i was going over the numbers, under budget, a year ahead of schedule, and the quality of the work is better than originally were going to do. [ applause ] under budget and ahead of schedule. They almost fell off because they never heard the words before. Never heard. When i see what happens, to indiana, which was having tremendous problems, when i see what happened in indiana under mikes work, also his predecessor did a great job, by the way, who is now a duke, who is now at purddupurdue. When i see what happened with respect to the numbers, the state, and Everything Else, that, to me, was probably the single most important appointment because its something that has not happened almost has not happened in the whole country. The turn around and the strength of indiana has been incredible, and i learned that when i campaign there. I learned that when i won that state in a landslide, and i learned that when governor pence under tremendous pressure from establishment people endorsed somebody else, but it was more of an endorsement for me. If you remember. He talked about trump, then he talked about ted, a good guy, by the way, who is going to be speaking at the convention, ted cruz, good guy, but talked about trump, ted, back to trump. Who did he endorse . Even though he was under pressure, because im so, you know, outside of the establishment, it was the single greatest nonendorsement i ever had in my life, i will tell ya. [ applause ] with that, i would like to introduce a man who i truly will be outstanding in every way and i believe will be the next Vice President of the United States. Governor mike pence. Thank you, thank you, everybody. Thank you. [ cheers and applause ] on behalf of my family here and looking on, would you join me in thanking donald trump and his entire family for the sacrifices that they are making to make America Great again . [ applause ] i thank donald trump, the confidence you placed in us, and i accept invitation to run and serve as Vice President of the United States of america. [ applause ] i come to this moment deeply humbled, but with a grateful heart. Grateful to god for his amazing grace. Grateful to my wonderful wife, karen, and our three incredible kids, michael, charlotte, and audrey, and grateful tos this fighter, this patriotic american who has set aside a legendary career in business to build a stronger america. Donald j. Trump. Having had the privilege of spending time with this man and his family out of the lime light, i know what america will all soon know even better. These are good people. Donald trump is a good man, and had will make a great president of the United States of america. [ applause ] donald trump understands the frustrations and the hopes of the American People like Ronald Reagan. The American People are tired. Tire the of being told this is as good as it gets. Were tired of having politicians in both raerts in washington, d. C. Tell us well get to those problems tomorrow. As Ronald Reagan said, were tired of being told that a little intellectual elite in a far distant capital can plan our lives better for us than we can plan them for ourselves. Donald trump gets it. He understands the American People. [ applause ] i truly am deeply humbled to be at his side today, and when i got this call last wednesday, i can only think of that ancient question, who am i, oh lord, and who is my family that you have brought us this far . So let me try to answer that question for a few minutes. A people who know me well know im a basic guy. Im a christian, a conservative, and a republican in that order. [ applause ] while im currently having the privilege of serving the state that i love, im really just a small town boy. I grew up in Southern Indiana with a big family and a corn field in the backyard. Like donald trump, my grandfather immigrated to this country, and in many ways, i grew up with a front row seat to the american dream. I watched my mom and dad build everything that matters, a family, a business, and a good name. The heros of my youth were john f. Kennedy and Martin Luther king, jr. I started in politics in the other party. When i came of age, i was inspired by the ideas and eloquence of our 40th president , and i became a republican. Most important thing in my life was 31 years ago i married the girl of my dreams, karen pence, who will make a great second lady of the United States of america. [ applause ] and while this office is an Extraordinary Office to which to aspire the highest role i ever will play is dad, and im a proud father of a college student, a graduate turned righter, and a United States marine. [ cheers and applause ] you know, my career, i ran for congress before the republican revolution led gi Newt Gingrich in 1994. I was not successful. By the time i got elected to washington, d. C. , sometimes i felt like i was elected after it was over. From first day in congress, i found myself battling big spenders in both political parties, whether opposing no child left behind, the prescription entitlement, or the wall street bailout, i fought every single day for taxpayers, and fiscal responsibility when i was a member of the congress of the United States. After the republicans lost the congress in 2006, i was unanimously leadership, and we fought back against the nancy pelosi congress. We opposed obama care. We opposed tax increases. We opposed capandtrade, and i was part of the team that won the congress back from democrat control in 2010. [ applause ] and all that happened before i went back home again to indiana. But i want to say i answered this call for two reasons. First, because i know from firsthand experience that strong Republican Leadership can bring about real change just like weve seen in the hoosier state, and, secondly, because Hillary Clinton must never become president of the United States of america. [ cheers and applause ] now [ applause ] on the first point, i know what im talking about we talk about a growing economy, balancing budgets, low taxes, while making record investments in education, roads, and health care, we like to say indiana is a state that works, and it does. [ applause ] indiana works because republican principles work every time you put them into practice. Today, we have a 2 billion surplus and highest Credit Rating nation. And since i became governor, hoosier businesses large and small have created nearly 150,000 net new jobs. And we have more hoosiers going to work than ever before in the 200year history of the great state of indiana. Thats what Republican Leadership gets you. [ applause ] and let me say from my heart, thats what the nononsense leadership of donald j. Trump will bring to washington, d. C. [ cheers and applause ] elections are about choices. Elections are about choices, and i also joined this ticket because the choice could not be more clear. The stakes could not be higher. Americans can choose a leader who will fight to make america safe and prosperous again, and bring real change, or we can elect someone who literally personifies the failed establishment in washington, d. C. 7 1 2 years of barack obama and Hillary Clintons policies have weakened americas place in the world and stifled our nations economy. Terrorist attacks at home and abroad, grim and heartbreaking scenes from france just a few short days ago, the attempted coup in turkey, all attest to a world spinning apart. History teaches us that weakness arouses evil. Hillary clinton and Barack Obamas Foreign Policy of leading from behind, moving red lines, faning resets is a testament to this truth of history, and we must bring a change to americas stand in the world. We cannot have four more years of apologizing to our enemies and abandoning our friends. America needs to be strong for the world to be safe. On the world stage, donald trump will lead from strength. He will rebuild the arsenal of democracy, stand with our allies and hunt down and destroy our enemies of freedom. [ cheers and applause ] and at home, the choice is just as clear. Where donald trump wants to cut taxes, Hillary Clinton plans to raise taxes. On working families, small businesses, and family farms. Where donald trump is committed to repeal obamacare, lock, stock and barrel [ applause ] Hillary Clinton looks at obamacare as a good start and wants to take Bernie Sanders down the path of socialized medicine. On coal, Hillary Clinton actually promised an energy plan that would close american coal mines and put coal miners out of work. Where donald trump wants to build a wall, and temporarily suspend immigration from countries compromised by terrorism, Hillary Clinton plans to ignore the Supreme Court, reimpose executive amnesty, and would increase increase our Refugee Program by more than 500 . And where donald trump will appoint justices like the late Antonin Scalia who will uphold our constitution, Hillary Clinton will appoint Supreme Court justices who will legislate from the bench, abandon the sanctity of life and rewrite our second amendment. To every american who shares our convictions, i say to you, join us. For the sake of our security, for the sake of our prosperity, for the same of a Supreme Court that will never turn its back on our godgiven liberties, lets come together as a party and a people and a movement to make America Great again. And that day begins when donald trump becomes the 45th president of the United States of america. [ cheers and applause ] thank you for the honor. Thank you for your support. And god bless the United States of america. [ cheers and applause ] there is the ticket. There is the extended trump and pence family members coming out on stage. Lets listen in here to see if theres going to be anything further. Were plugged into the inhouse audio system. Chris matthews, i was watching you watching the event. Your reaction . It was a barn burner. And it had all the elements of a keynote speech for next weeks convention. Clearly, both these guys were warming up today. I know were just supposed to get an announcement of a Vice President ial announcement already made, but they used it to get network time, cable time, to basically give us a draft of what well hear next week. I thought the speech by governor pence was reminding me of oldtime republican speeches, people like walter judd. This is the whole powerpacked conservative argument. Its about building, its about infrastructure of all things. But manufacturing jobs. And he was talking about his own state of indiana. If you go to places like Michigan City down at the bottom of michigan, Lake Michigan there, you see cities with nothing left, but maybe a blockbuster thats gone now. Maybe a diner is still there. Theyve been hollowed out. The great irony, of course, brian, is he brags about his states a1 bond rating, balance budgets, create 40,000 net jobs, at the same time basically decrying the economic state of the country, the loss of jobs to mexico, et cetera. Theyre trying to have it both ways in the rust belt by saying its terrible. But also bragging about their own successes there. I would say overall, his reference to the presumptive president ial nominee, donald trump, as the builder is a pretty good place to start in terms of branding this ticket. Chris, were you surprised no one pointed out that Ronald Reagan declared announced his candidacy in this very hotel . Well, thats iconic. You know, i dont know how much thats a great question. Did somebody plan that because they wanted it to resonate. If youre looking at this from the headquarters across the east river, in brooklyn, if youre watching this alongside the smart people in the Clinton Campaign, what are they thinking . Theyre saying, i dont quite get this. Heres a guy who seems zany in terms of his public statements, who breaks all the rules of political correctness. Yet won the republican nomination quite easily. Heres a guy who out of nowhere, had the possibility of picking Chris Christie with all his troubles, or Newt Gingrich with his incredible rap sheet politically, and he picks this guy. You go, wait a minute, why is this guy somehow able to end up solid after days and hours of cold feet and confusion, and yet ends up on solid ground once again. Hes a billionaire. How did he get to be a billionaire . If its 11 billion or 4 billion, hes successful. How does he end up solid after all this weaving and craziness . Is this guy capable of success after all the nonsense . They must wonder, maybe he is. Thats something to worry about. Which is good for our democracy. Theyre going to be on their toes over there. Theyre going to say this guy is at least 50 . In the latest polling, this guy is going to be a contender. Weve got to beat him. The American People have to be given a positive choice from Hillary Clinton. Shes got to figure out the trust factor she has, which is her deficit right now. She has to figure this guy out. And she hasnt done it yet. So hes the builder. Hillary clinton is the enemy, that clearly the republicans in an almost unimaginable way hate her. Hillary clinton must never become president of the United States, that was the big crowd pleaser from the vp nominee now. Clearly theyre going to run negatively, and maybe successfully on that negative camp. They have to build donald trump up, who will rebuild the Manufacturing Base of the country. They can laugh about the wall, but what people want is sewers and highways and bridges that dont fall down, and new Transportation Systems that save energy. And allow us to catch up to asia and europe where we should have been years ago. Why are we falling behind in everything in terms of efficient use of energy and transportation. Were just not keeping up with europe, with france, with japan and china. So i think there is a road there for trump to take. Whether he can stay on it, well see. Steve schmidt, your reaction. First to the trump speech, and then to mike pences debut. I think its interesting, as you consider Donald Trumps speech. What will we see when he accepts the nomination of the Republican Party. Will he be on a teleprompter. Will he be reading from script. Will he be disciplined, or the meanderi ining prose that we sa this morning. Not to say his stream of consciousness is not effective, and not effective communication, it clearly is, it clearly has been for republican voters. My view of mike pences speech is that fairly pedestrian. He needs a lot of work before he gets up and talks to 30 million, 40 million americans who will be watching his acceptance speech later this week. Very clear that they dont have a firstrate speechwriter working on that