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somebody disrespects our flag? to say, get that son of a -- off the field. >> i have a daughter. i do whatever i have to do to make sure she can look at her dad and be, like, hey, he tried to make a change. >> it was divisive. >> for him to use this platform to divide us more is not something i can stand for. >> if you're a multi-millionaire who feels oppressed, you need a therapist, not a publicity stunt. >> they can do the free speech on their own time. >> he should apologize. they're not sobs. they're thoughtful, smart guys. the latest push to overhaul obamacare may be in critical condition again. >> can only afford to lose two, and they already have. >> it is difficult for me to envision a scenario where i would end up voting for this bill. >> republicans are attempting to sweeten the deal, offering a last-minute change to shift money in the bill to alaska and
maine. politico reported that kushner has been in the white house and used a personal e-mail account. >> there were fewer than 100 e-mails sent to this personal account. >> his lawyer confirmed yesterday, dozens of times to correspondents, like steve bannon, reince priebus. >> president trump is doubling down, tripling down on his comments about nfl players not standing during the national anthem. >> mentioning nothing about puerto rico and the 3 million people suffering there. the president tweeting, many people booed the players who kneeled yesterday, which was a small percentage. in total, these are fans who demanded respect for our flag. adding, the issue of kneeling has nothing to do with race. it is about respect for our country, flag and national anthem. nfl must respect this. president trump, that's wrong. also tweeting, proud of nascar in its supporters and fans. they won't put up with disrespecting our country or flag.
>> from nfl spokes mman to form press secretary for bill clinton, quote, yesterday was an important day in the nfl. this is what real locker room talk is. >> tom brady did not go to the white house when the patriots were invited after they won, yet the president made no comment. over the weekend, he attacked steph curry of the golden state warriors, who decided back in june not to go to the celebratory party with his teammates. his teammates who now decided they're not going to the white house either. it caused such a stir that fellow basketball superstar lebron james tweeted, calling the president a bum. all of this after a wave of protests across the nfl took place yesterday during the anthem. more than 100 players kneeling in defiance. others joining in a massive show of solidarity. with coaches and owners, even some team owners, who doe nate -- donated heavily, i'm talking in the millions, including the president's friend, robert kraft, and the redskins owner,
all following the fire storm the president set off on friday night. >> wouldn't you love to see one of these nfl owners, when somebody disrespects our flag, just say, get that son of a bitch off the field right now. he's fired. he's fired! >> collectively, we felt like we had to, you know, do something. >> only a few times in a man's life where you have a chance to stand up for something you believe in and make a statement. today, i thought that was the chance, and i took it. >> there are no sobs in this league. >> i supported donald trump. i sat back, when he asked me to introduce him at a rally, you know, in buffalo, i did that, but i'm reading these comments, and it's appalling to me. >> i don't agree with it at all. i think that president trump was absolutely right when he said that the players should stand for the national anthem. >> i disagree. they should be able to protest how they feel is necessary. >> i want to point out, the president called the nfl players
sons of bitches, yet when he referenced the protesters at the neo-nazi event back in charlottesville -- >> many, many fine people. >> joining us now, live, former nfl defensive end marvin washington, who played for the new york jets, 49ers and the denver broncos during his 11-year career. also, former seattle seahawks player and army green beret nate boyer, who served multiple tours in iraq and afghanistan. nate, marvin has the home-court advantage so we'll start with you. you talked to colin kaepernick, into kneeling instead of sitting on the bench, as he's done for several weeks. talk us through the argument that president trump makes, that if you don't stand, you're standing against the united states of america. >> yeah, first of all, i didn't talk him into it. that was a conversation that we make to the middle ground together. that was between him and me. we sat down for a couple hours, discussed our perspective and
definitely our feelings toward the anthem, the flag and our background that led us to feel that way. kind of came to that decision together. but, like i said before and i'll say again, i will always stand because of what it means to me. the men and women who lay down their lives for what that piece of cloth represents. however, that piece of cloth also represents everyone's right in this country and the freedoms to express yourself how you feel. when you're not pleased with something, in our country, you have the ability to speak out against it or to take a knee against it or do something in protest in some way, as long as it is peaceful. i'll always support that. so i support the rights 100%. >> marvin, just for historical perspective, when you played, you didn't have to stand. that was not something that players necessarily did. they didn't always come out for the national anthem. some cases, they were in. some cases, they didn't stand. >> of course. it depends how the game went.
i don't remember being out there for the national anthem. this is something that's come on ae ce ece recently. i think 2009 when the nfl paid the department of defense to promote -- >> the department of defense paid the nfl. >> the department of defense paid the nfl. this is not about disrespecting the soldiers and flag. rosa parks didn't sit down because she didn't like the transportation system. this is about civil rights. my dad is buried in a veteran cemetery, and he joined the service when he was 17 years old during world war ii. he didn't have his full rights back here at home. so this is not about me disrespecting the flag or whatever. it is about these players expressing their first amendment right to freedom of speech and freedom of expression. my dad and the veterans like him will fight for him to either kneel or stand. >> here's something that puzzles me. newt gingrich earlier today said
it is impossible for multi-millionaires to be oppr s oppressed. if they're feeling so oppressed, they need a shrink. newt gingrich doesn't realize abraham lincoln didn't fight to free slaves because it was affecting him personally. can you use your position to help those who don't have a voice? >> i think you should. sports and politics have been around since the inception of time. african-american players, since 1947, trying to integrate the game of basketbaeball. for him to say that, he acts like the owners own the players, when they own the team. i understand the players get paid a lot, but they're making the owners a lot of money, also. so i don't believe that. for newt gingrich to say that, i think, is ridiculous. he needs to have empathy and sympathy for what people of color are going through in this country. >> nate, i think something interesting that you said, that you have fought, you've been in afghanistan, a place where the
taliban do not allow any variance from the official line in terms of self-expression. there are millions of people living under the rule of isis that american soldiers are fighting right now. they will not allow any freedoms of expression of any sort. tell me about your sense of the importance of the freedoms we have to protest peacefully. >> yeah, i mean, that's what makes our country truly great and very special, you know. the anthem and that flag does not represent a person. it represents the entire nation. you know, when i was overseas fighting, the fact that i had to -- we had to put aside some of our differences and cultures and understand that, look, i may not relate to this person that i'm working with and i'm fighting alongside against terrorism, against hatred, but i can sit down and listen to them and understand that at the end of the day, they probably want the same things i do, as far as for their family and everything like that. and you have to be able to work
maybe steph curry could say, i'm not going to spend my time at a celebratory party for someone that doesn't clearly denounce racism. >> i agree with you. but i mean, if he comes at it with that attitude, like, look, i'll come to the white house but i want to sit down and talk, i mean, that's an opportunity. if he gets told no, he's told no. at least it's an attempt though. i don't know. i mean, i'm just -- i'm a huge fan of steph curry. i'm a warriors fan, and he is an intelligent, young man. a lot of people follow him. i think that would be interesting to see what came of that. that's all i'm saying. i totally understand where you're coming from. i'm just saying -- >> steph curry is a leader, example of a father, husband, hard work pays off, is a tough guy to say, guess what, you're not invited anyway. marvin, could you comment on this point that steve mnuchin made, that the players should, quote, do free speech on your own time?
the last time i checked in the united states of america, whether you're at work -- >> you can do free speech wherever you are. >> i'm unclear what doing free speech means. i've never been in a scenario where if you speak respectful from a place of integrity, you can't speech your mind. >> mnuchin is under investigation for mispolice station -- misplacement of federal funds. it's interesting coming from him. but people don't realize, the socially conscious athlete is what i grew up with. i grew up in the '60s and '70s. we had muhammad ali, jim brown, russell. i didn't look up to politicians. i looked up to sports stars. they can bring attention and focus to whatever issues are going on. i'm glad we're having this conversation right now. it needs to be had. hopefully, it can lead to reform. wh we put our hands up, it's offensive. kneel down, it is offensive. ferguson has reform now in their
come back from the break. plus, we'll explain how america's nuclear codes work and exactly how long it'd take for president trump to pull the trigger. hi, i'm the internet! you know what's difficult?
foreign minister threatened the north would shoot down any u.s. bombers if necessary. this is important. u.s. bombers flew as far north and as close to north korea as they've done -- >> in this century. >> this happened this weekend. joining us is nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker. what do you know? >> reporter: ali and steph, this war of words escalates. as you point out, speaking in new york, the north korean foreign minister said president trump declared war over the weekend. let me read you a tweet over the weeke weekend. just heard foreign minister of north korea speak at u.n. if he echoes thoughts of little rocket man, they won't be around much longer. north korea's leader saying that those comments, his other fiery comments, clearly a declaration of war. warning the international community should clearly remember it was the u.s. that
declared war on north korea. really extraordinary language that is coming out, not only of north korea, but from president trump, as well. of course, he gave that speech at the u.n. last week and said that he was prepared to bring about north korea's total destruction if it didn't stop its nuclear provocations. now, of course, those words were also met with tough actions. the ones that you talked about, that show of force, flying military bombers close to the north, but also, of course, the toughest round of sanctions that we have seen yet. north korea has threatened to test fire an intercontinental ballistic missile into open air. if that happens, it'll be the first time a country takes that type of step to test a nuclear weapon in open air since china did it back in 1980. so certainly an escalation here. the question is, how does this all end? president trump has an event here at the white house today, which will be focused on jobs.
undoubtedly, we'll get questions about this. >> we'll be paying very close attention to that. thank you. there's a lot of news. the trump administration is grappling with nuclear issues on two fronts this morning. first, iran's test launch of a new ballistic missile it says is capable of carrying nuclear warheads. condemned by the united nations, the missile test comes less than a week after president trump spoke before the general assembly here in new york. accusing iran of exporting violence, the white house faces an october 15th deadline to certify iran's compliance with the 2015 nuclear deal to congress. the president has claimed iran is in violation of, quote, the spirit of the deal, but has issued the certification as required every three months. meanwhile, the president's newest travel ban includes north korea, part of a ratcheting up of tensions between kim jeong june's regime and the united states. the two leaders have hurt ehurl massive personal attacks at each other, including this, that took
place on friday. >> little rocket man. he may be smart, he may be is that strategic and totally crazy, but no matter what he is, we're going to handle it, folks. believe me. >> this is what is stunning to me. members of the administration and trump supporters would say, follow what he does, not what he says. what about when he says things that causes erratic countries like north korea to say, you've declared war on us. >> it is impossible to separate the idea he tweets and wants his tweets to be taken seriously. >> sean spicer said consider it an official statement. >> he is tweeting things that are separate and apart from american policy as it regards north korea. when you're dealing with things on the fringes, that's fine. but this is a country with nuclear weaponry. we can't really be having these mixed messages. we were discussing this on friday. we said, we'd like to be discussing the other policy, but he threatens via tweet.
it would be irresponsible of us to ignore the tweets. because we've been told, that's policy. >> how do members of the military -- how would a mother, if she had a son or a daughter -- >> posted in south korea. posted in japan. this is serious stuff. coming up, we're going to talk -- looks like someone else has been e-mailing on private e-mails. we're going to be talking about that when we come back. >> amazing. jared kushner, after all that happened, the criticism, remember lock her up? now jared kushner seems to be using private e-mails, even though he is a member of the administration. and we're watching markets this morning. remember angela merkel secured her fourth term over the weekend. the markets have been on a run. facebook and some other social media companies are getting a lot of criticism. stand by. you are watching "velshi & ru e ruhle" live on msnbc. how do you chase what you love
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of a crime. >> hillary clinton is missing 30,000 e-mails. they've been deleted. 30,000. i have watched so many lawyers on so many different networks. i have read so much about the e-mails. folks, honestly, she's guilty as hell. russia, if you're listening, i hope you're able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing. hillary bleached and deleted 33,000 e-mails after congressional subpoenas. if you did that in private life, you'd go to jail. >> lock her up! lock her up! lock her up! >> you got to speak to jeff sessions about that. >> "politico" is reporting trump's son-in-law and senior adviser jared kushner is using his private account to conduct
white house business. "politico" claims he's corresponde corresponded with other officials through a private e-mail account set up during the transition. quote, kushner and his wife set up the private donate before moving to washington. >> fewer than 100 e-mails from january to august were sent to or returned by mr. kushner to colleagues in the white house from his personal e-mail account. these were usually forwarded news articles or political commentary and most often occurred when someone initiated the exchange by sending an e-mail to his personal rather than white house address. joining us now is the "politico" reporter who problem the story, josh dawsey. a personal e-mail address and a private e-mail server, those are two different things. >> correct. we do not know if it was a separate e-mail server here. we do know that in december when they moved to washington, jared and ivanka created a personal
family e-mail account. jared has used that intermittently throughout the last eight months to correspondent with white house officials, others close to the administration, about his father-in-law, while also sometimes using his white house official account. he's used both at the same time. >> do we have a sense of what sort of information was exchanged and whether any was classified? his lawyer said it was mostly articles, which are of little concern. what else do we know? >> i want to be fair. we do not know if there was classified or sensitive information shared on this private e-mail account. lawyers say no. it is -- we're dicki iwe're digo find out exactly what was in there. it's been difficult to figure out, obviously, because it is a private e-mail account and it is not a government account, where you can get records or go through the presidential records act. we're trying to assess what is exactly in there. we know there are hundreds and hundreds of e-mails, corresponding with different
issues. >> the hypocrisy is sticking out to a lot of people. lock her up is based on her using the private e-mail server. the argument could be made, these are people who jared knew personally and they only had this address, but it wasn't just friends and associates outside of the administration. there were e-mails with gary cohn, steve bannon, a number of people who are part of the administration. isn't that the case? >> it was a sharp, potent attack. hillary clinton e-mail server, accusing her of having something to hide. below the table behavior, an fbi investigation. it was one of the president's sharpest tri teak esest critique trail. to be fair, others have done this, as well. we reported today, reince priebus and steve bannon also used a private e-mail account to correspondent to other white house officials. the use is pervasive in the white house, which is ironic after the theme of the campaign
that dominated hillary clinton. >> okay. we should point out then, in the spirit of to be fair, it's to be fair, other people were also exhibiting hypocritical behavior. not that if reince did it, it is okay. it is not okay across the board. >> correct. jared kushner was a top adviser to the president though. he's probably the most well-known official in the white house. his behavior kind of shows how close something like this could get to the president. >> josh, good to talk to you. thank you for your reporting. josh dawsey. >> thanks for having me. >> or the complaints we hear, reporting of those who said jared and ivanka don't follow protocol, behave like they're royals. maybe it is things like this. you go. >> go ahead. >> you. >> stand by. we'll go to capitol hill for an update on obamacare. republicans revised the latest led legislation to get key votes.
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new or worse depression, unusual changes in mood or behavior, swelling, trouble breathing, rash, hives, blisters, muscle pain with fever, tired feeling, or blurry vision. common side effects: dizziness, sleepiness, weight gain, swelling of hands, legs and feet. don't drink alcohol while taking lyrica. don't drive or use machinery until you know how lyrica affects you. those who've had a drug or alcohol problem may be more likely to misuse lyrica. with less pain, i can do more with my family. talk to your doctor today. see if lyrica can help. welcome back to velshi & ruhle. here are the top stories we're watching right now after a weekend in bedminster, new jersey. the president is back at the white house this afternoon. he is going to make a job announcement. jobs, not his job, before hosting a dinner and discussion on tax reform with grassroots leaders. a gun man opened fire at a tennessee church yesterday afternoon, killing one person and injuring six. the suspect, a 25-year-old man,
is in custody on a first degree murder charge. there's no clear motive for the shooting. former new york congress man anthony weiner was sentenced to 21 months in prison for sectioning a 15-year-old girl last year. the sentence was handed down this mornin gmorning. he'll have to register as a sex offender. >> my god. look at the line outside of the hearing room this morning, where the single hearing on the graham/cassidy bill will be held this afternoon. over the weekend, ted cruz voiced his disapproval of the bill in austin. >> right now, they don't have my ve voe vote and i don't think they have mike lee's either. i want to get there. obamacare is a disaster. >> there is work to be done. >> the price to getting there, i believe, is focusing on consumer freedom. >> both cruz and lee are noes, that'd seal the bill's fate, since republicans can only lose
two members. mccain and paul already said they're voting no. if a bill is not signed by the end of the week, the bar goes back to 60 votes to pass a repeal. the congressional budget office hopes to have limited analysis out by today. joining us now, garrett hauck, li haake, live outside the hearing room. september 30th is coming on fast. >> reporter: they thought they had a plan. the idea here on this second draft was to sweeten the pot for alaska. maybe get lisa murkowski back on board. and weaken some of the protections. allow states to be a little more flexible in the plans, which would be something ted cruz, mike lee and some of the conservatives talked about for a long time. this is what they're up against. i want to show you what's going on outside the hearing room. this line started very early this morning. it has built into the hundreds of people running through the
whole senate office building. it is like the rally atmosphere. we've had people chanting. people singing. we've had people doing interviews. every time a democratic senator comes by, the crowd goes nuts. they're pleading with these people to kill this bill. that's what republican lawmakers are going to walk into today. despite those technical changes to the bill, essentially, may be too late. you've already mentioned the two hard no votes, rand paul and john mccain. there's nothing in the changes of the bill over the weekend that will bring them back on board. a lot of these people out here are waiting for susan collins to make her lean no into a no no. potentially at some point today when a cbo score comes out. that could turn this hallway into a party situation here, from a rally situation right now. there is a lot of pressure being placed on these holdout lawmakers in a lot of different ways out here today. it's going to be tough for republicans to put this thing over the finish line. >> they've got some sort of changes to the plan.
obviously the cbo won't have a chance to look at those, though the bottom line is, they'll be some initial cbo measure. that was a sticking point for susan collins in particular. she wanted to see a score before she would make a final decision. >> reporter: right. what you'll end up with is a cbo report that is essentially the bottom line. they'll say whether or not this complies with reconciliation rules. some broad picture of how much it costs. all the finer point analysis that cbo typically does -- we're getting moved by capitol police, trying to keep the hallway clear -- all the stuff that the cbo does isn't going to happen. susan collins, lisa murkowski, some of the other senators have been going to anyone else that can provide them with data. the federal government, the cms, or groups like the kaiser foundation, to try and get those numbers. again, to your point, ali, susan collins is not going to get what she wants from the cbo today. she'll get a couple of lines. not a full report about how this
affects her state or the rest of the country. she has been very clear all along that she wants that kind of information before she casts such a big vote. >> as does john mccain. garrett, i make this point, if there's something one with learn from obamacare, don't jam it through. >> why do we do this? >> instead of saying push it through by september 30th, forget about getting 50. go for 60 votes. go for bipartisanship. >> yup. >> find a long-term solution. >> there's nobody in the country who doesn't think obamacare could use some repair. you can get 60 votes. you can get more if you really -- >> obama says it. >> -- have hearings, listen to people and take input. this is not the way legislation should work. >> the problem solvers caucus didn't start for giggles. they want to create bipartisan solutions. maybe listen to them. forget about september 30th. i think 60 could be easier than 50. next, trump's cabinet is full of millionaires and billionaires. what happens when they're big
spenders with taxpayer money. a new report singles out secretary tom price. weaver goi we're going to break down the hundreds of thousands of dollars he spent on a private jet just since may. we're going to hear president trump's response. kevin, meet your father. kevin kevin kevin kevin kevin kevin kevin kevin kevin kevin trusted advice for life. kevin, how's your mom? life well planned. see what a raymond james financial advisor can do for you. hi, i'm the internet! you knoarmless bowling.lt? you got this, jimmy! you know what's easy? building your website with godaddy. pick a domain name. choose a design.
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our plan, the house republican budget, finally puts a stop to that. so washington uses hard-earned tax dollars in an accountable and effective way. now, we wonder, will the white house and senate democrats be able to say the same thing about their budgets, or will we see more accounting tricks and budget gimmicks and wasteful spending? >> ouch. that didn't age well. that, of course, was health and human services secretary tom price, as a senator from georgia. but a new report found price himself took expensive, private jets more than 24 times since the month of may. five of those trips took place over the span of just three days. he took more trips even after questions were raised, including to oklahoma just last week, which costs more than $50,000 according to "politico."
an hofficial spokesperson said the trip had been already booked. charter aircraft can be used for official travel. take a look at one of the trips. washington, d.c. to philadelphia, pennsylvania. hard to imagine you cannot reasonably get there commercially. in fact, "politico" notes a united flight took off from dulles for philadelphia five minutes before price's charter jet. united booking site shows the flight typically costs about $724 round trip. that's just a little under the $8,000 for 11 people that reported the size of price's group. his private jet, that cost $25,000. that is more than the cost of three round-trip flights for all 11 people. train and car travel would be cheaper. the $25,000 is the cost of two
out of the five trips tom price made that week. there are at least 20 more flights coming to light. this is all on the heels of the scrutiny over treasury secretary, the guy who runs the money, scrutiny over his travel. allegedly requesting a government jet for his honeymoon and accused of scheduling government travel to coincide with last month's solar eclipse. even epa administrator scott pruitt is under fire for travel. $12,000 in taxpayer funded travel from d.c. to oklahoma. spending 43 of his first 92 days in the post in his home state. the price tag so far on the hhs secretary's travel, ready, $400,000. his counterparts in the obama administration, they flew commercial, using private jets to access only remote parts of alaska. secretary price addressed the controversy on fox this past weekend. >> we've heard the criticism.
we've heard the concerns. we take that very seriously. the optics in some of this don't look good, and that's why we, again, have taken this criticism to heart. i don't think there'd be any charter trips until this review is completcomplete. i think it is appropriate. >> and at the white house yesterday, president trump was asked about the private travel. >> using private charter flights as a taxpayer expense? >> who did? >> your secretary mnuchin, secretary price. >> you'll have to ask him about that. i don't know. >> do you think it is appropriate? >> as far as secretary price is concerned, that's different. we're looking into it. >> they're looking into it. the party that calls for fiscal responsibility could take a page from a member of the former administration. you remember vice president joe biden. his famous love of amtrak led to this scene on inauguration day earlier this year. one final boarding of a train on union station to take to biden's home state of del caaware.
what else do you say but wow? >> joe biden was known, people would see him on the amtrak, going back and forth. i don't understand why the president, a, hadn't heard about it because he follows the think mnuchin stuff is different. there was the idea he went to fort knox and did schedule it around the solar eclipse. then he tweeted about it. he tweeted sort of an insulting tweet about the whole idea. this has to be looked at. it's one thing if you don't brag about the fact you're not there to the cut costs, but if you are bragging about it, you have to cut costs. >> manuchin said he needed it fr security reasons on his honeymoon but then was told no, you don't. it's just stunning to simply make the argument in tom price's case, he's taking flights so he can get to see the people. you can see the people in philly if you take the train. >> from new york, i go from d.c.
i can tell you the best deals and when they happen. hurricane maria as it weakens, still a category 1 hurricane. it's threatening portions of north carolina with tropical storm weather it's it's out in the ocean. we can't lose focus on puerto rico and the larger caribbean riddled with massive, massive power loss, flooding, severe agricultural damage, severe infrastructure damage. and cell phones that still aren't working. a dam in puerto rico weakened by maria's punishing winds remains a danger if it fails, 70,000 more people could be at risk. the island's governor urged residents in the area of the dam to evacuate. let's bring in nbc's tammy leitner live in san juan. you've been there almost a week. you're in san juan. many people in puerto rico can't even communicate with their families especially people. vieques. is there any progress? >> reporter: you know, steph, a little bit of progress.
we're seeing a little. i want to show you this debris that people are cleaning out of their businesses, out of their homes. people are just starting to do this. this is going to take days, weeks, months. i'm actually here walking in the bus lane. we've seen a couple buss go by this morning, a little sign of progress. i can tell you limited public transportation started back up this morning at 7:00 a.m. trash pickup started. but take a look at this. this far lane is the line for gas. now, that line each day should be getting shorter. not longer. but we're seeing each day the line gets longer which shows there is very little gas right now for people to get. ali? >> talk to us about what people are going to do there when the airports open. i'm spoken to some who have said. >> they're going to get on the first flight out. >> they're out of there. we could face a mass migration situation. that's 3 million people are uz citizens who could be making the
continental united states their new home. >> reporter: absolutely. absolutely. we've spoken with a number of people that tell me they feel as though they will have no choice. they are willing to abandon their homes, what's left of their homes, their possessions, their family, friends, to leave puerto rico because they feel that the recovery is going to be too long. months and months and months. they don't think they can hold out. a lot of people are head together states as soon as they can get a flight out. >> all right. tami, what is the. >> they'll be able to vote. governor rick scott, they can vote. >> let's talk about assistance from the federal government. we've been talking to fema about the stuff going in there, bottled water, generators, fuel. how is that coming along? >> reporter: very slowly. again did, the gas line, people don't have the basic necessities. they don't have gas. they don't have fuel. people need fuel for generators because they have no power still. there's a complete blackout across the entire island. basic necessities, food, water -- desperate cries for
water. we've traveled to a number of towns. the one plea we keep hearing over and over is we need water. so far the government has not managed to get a large water supply new as normally happens with a catastrophe. we're going on a week here. a lot of people are asking when is the water coming. > this is more serious than florida and texas because you can drive it from alaska to texas. >> i told you last week, what breaks my heart, when i was going from st. john to puerto rico and i was at the port, there was cases and cases of water being sent from puerto rico to the virgin islands. now they need it. tammy leitner, thank you. thank you for staying there and continuing to cover this very important story. in light of that ongoing fight about confederate monuments in this country, we want to introduce to you monumental american who's may be deserving of a statue. >> today it's the author, poet and civil rights activist, maya
angelou. she was born in st. louis in 1928 as a civil rights activist, she worked alongside martin luther king and mam come junior. she also worked as a cook, nightclub dancer, actor and journalist covering the decolonization of africa. her first memoir "i know why the caged bird sings," talked about the abuses she suffered as a girl that launched a literary career that spanned more than 50 years. >> she was nominated for a pulitzer prize, tony award and three grammys for literary recordings. in 2011, she received the medal of freedom from president obama. she died in 2014 at the age of 86. full have a monumental american in mind, tweet us at velshi rhule. what's the secret to turning a no into a yes?
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FlagSomebodySonDaughterASayThe-fieldSomethingDadMulti-millionaireMoreChangenine months away. there is a lot to talk about. let's begin at the white house. kelly o'donnell, we are learning that rob porter, the staff secretary, accused of domestic violence by his ex-wives that he could be out as early as today, is that correct? >> reporter: that's our reporting and the issue is that rob porter offered his resignation and sarah huckabee sanders said there would be an extended time of transition, where he would be able to help facilitate a successor. that has changed in the sense that there has been a lot of controversy around this, a lot of attention drawn to the two former wives of rob porter. the statements they have made publicly alleging verbal abuse, physical abuse and emotional abuse and porter has said that these are smears. he has said that these are baseless allegations and a coordinated campaign against him. we saw a shift, in fact, that at first, members of the white house senior team including chief-of-staff john kelly were very supportive of porter and he
was described as a man of true integrity and character. that has changed with john kelly coming forward to say, that he was concerned about the issue of the photos that have been raised and the reports. there is an issue changing the statements of john kelly who is worked very closely with rob porter over the many months of this administration. why is this so critical? the porter situation is that he does not have a full clearance based on all of the reporting that our team has done. he has daily access to the president. that of course has put him right into the inner circle and these allegations are of a serious nature, especially culturally at this point with the me too campaign and all of the concerns that have been raised. porter says he's not responsible for domestic abuse. his former wives have detailed to first the daily mail.com and confirming their accounts to nbc news. they have said that these
abusive situations did occur and that they reported them to the fbi, which is a standard part of a background check where members of the fbi interview those in the life and family of anyone who is up for clearance especially for a high level job at the white house. so porter denies this. he may be out as early as today based on the changing nature of how this story has been received, how it's been perceived and even changes among those that had been initially supportive of him. >> that's the other question. is i don't kn if there was an issue with his security clearance and if this at least by the fbi some of the accusations here were known, i see you're -- doesn't look like kelly's hearing me. we'll ask somebody else the question. we got other folks joining us who are very knowledge being. joined now by beth reiner. she conducted the interviews
with the ex-wives, and i'm joined by peter baker and our panel, matt welsh, along with catherine ram pel. thanks for all of you for being with us, peter, let me start with you. the big question is politically in the fallout from this, is the question about the chief-of-staff, john kelly, who was initially supportive now you see porter headed for the kpits, the question of what did john kelly know about this and how far back did he know it? >> that's exactly right. our reporting shows that he was told as recently as last fall. in a statement he put out last night, he said he was shocked to learn about the details of this. it's possible he knew the general gist of it without knowing the level detail that came out particularly, that photograph of rob porter's ex-wife. it's been a really interesting and tough week for john kelly,
this on top of the comments he made earlier in the week criticizing at least some immigrants of being too lazy to go about applying for status, the obama era daca program and raising a lot of questions both inside the white house and outside about john kelly as the chief-of-staff. if he didn't know about one of his top people being compromised in the way that rob porter seems to have been, if he's willing to make the kind of comments he made on capitol hill in the midst of sensitive negotiations, what does that tell us about the way he's leading this white house for president trump? >> let's bring beth reiner in. you talked to rob porter's ex-wives, the genesis of this story, let me play a clip here from your interview then ask you a question about it. take a listen. >> during one of these fights we were both yelling at each other. i disengaged and removed myself from the fight to go take a shower.
and rob wasn't finished fighting, i suppose, at that point. he was still angry. so he came and grabbed me by the shoulders here and pulled me out of the shower in a rage. >> so beth, let me ask you about the time line from their standpoint. they're going public now but there's the question here of why these fbi checks are playing out for porter to get him those security clearances for the white house, were his ex-wives contacted, what were they saying then? did they talk to anybody in the white house, were they talking to him before they went public? what's the timeline? >> so rob porter's ex-wives were both contacted by the fbi over a year ago january 2017 as you would expect for a background check of a high level white house aide and they both provided the fbi with a lot of information about his verbal and
physical abuse, colby provided the fbi with the pictures you've seen of her with the black eye, jennie provided the fbi with the protective order she had filed in 2010 and then they -- they did not hear anything until several months later. jennie got a call from rob in september asking about, you know, what had you told the fbi? they're holding up my security clearance. so rob porter knew, you know, as of september and we presume other folks in the white house knew as well that there was a problem with these allegations were causing him a problem in terms of getting a security clearance. >> peter, let me ask you, the position that rob porter occupied, staff secretary, one of those people here they're not exactly sure what the
in this white house, rob porter's probably even more important than the typical staff secretary because john kelly did rely on him so much. porter was seen as one of the few genuinely professional and talented and seasoned people in that white house. i would say if you had to come up with a list of the most important staffers in that west wing he would certainly be on any list like that. for this to happen is a big blow to this white house and you're right. he had been very close to john kelly as an ally and a right arm of his, so you can see that the chief-of-staff clearly, you know, took this in a personal way. >> you mentioned some of those names from past administrations, people harriet myers, george w. bush tried to put her on the supreme court but there was a pushback to that. beth you were going to say. >> sorry. i was adding to answer your question about the time line. both of these ex-wives did not
come forward, so to speak. they were contacted by reporters and i think somewhat reluctantly shared their stories after they knew that this was all coming out. so i just wanted to make that clear as far as the time line. >> let me bring the panel in here. this is i think one of the questions here we find ourselves asking a lot with this administration is would this event have happened in a past administration and i think this is one of those where, you know, look you can have an unfortunate circumstance where you find out somebody's been accused of something. that can happen in any administration. this does seem to speak to a level of some dysfunction behind the scenes there. >> one of the appalling details is that this week john kelly and also orrin hatch basically came out and accused the women, the ex-wives of conducting a vial smear campaign. that's the first instinct that this is a smear campaign even though they weren't making this a campaign at all.
they only came out with this now. they've been interviewed with the fbi last year including the question of do you think that is vulnerable potentially to blackmail. that was a question they said yes, he is because of this path that hasn't been disclosed. so to accuse them just a reflexively of conducting a smear campaign is what we had seen similarly with judge roy moore, with donald trump himself. it's as if -- this is what we'll do. we can weather the storm by doing this. let's step back and call that for what it is. these are two women, ex-wives, and there's a third girlfriend too, an ex-girlfriend who contacted the white house afterwards and say, i think there's a problem with this guy. you should check it out. there was plenty of knowledge there and to go back and try to smear those women of conducting a smear campaign that says something really bad about the cultural of the white house. >> it's an interesting point. you think back to the "access hollywood" tape in the 2016 campaign. i think politically i wonder if the president himself and the
folks around him took a political lesson from that, hey, look, if two, three weeks before the election you can endure that kind of scandal and still win, maybe we don't have to worry about anything we're hit with. >> even if there is evidence, even if there are photos, if there is a video with audio in which donald trump himself is acknowledging that he likes to or is able to grab women by the genitals, they think they can get away with it. this is an administration that has defended neo-nazi, an accused child molester and now multiple wife beaters. one of the nominees last year for the cabinet for the labor secretary was also accused of abusing a spouse. so this is not some anomaly. this is a pattern for them. all they care about is just circling the wagons and saying we're going to charge forward and we're going to just deny and gas light the american public even when there is photographic evidence or video evidence proving otherwise. >> okay. peter baker, beth reiner, thanks
to both of you. matt and katherine are saying with minimum throughout the hour. all eyes are turning to the u.s. senate first today. there's where lawmakers are getting ready to vote on a budget deal that would fund the government for the next two years. not so fast. the fate of that bill is very much up in the air when it comes to the house where it's also going to have to pass. the sticking points for both parties as that shutdown clock keeps ticking. ♪ one is the only number ♪ that you'll ever need ♪ staying ahead isn't about waiting for a chance. it's about the one bold choice you make, that moves you forward. ( ♪ ) the one and only cadillac escalade. come in now for this exceptional offer on the cadillac escalade. get this low-mileage lease on this 2018 cadillac escalade from around $879 per month. visit your local cadillac dealer. on the only bed that adjusts on both sides to your ideal comfort, your sleep number setting.
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back now with a live look the house floor. that's the outside of the capitol hill right now but on the house floor inside that building there is going to be lots of drama today before that, though, on the senate side, the senate expected to prove that two year budget at some point today. that will then kick off the drama on the house side. leadership trying to make that senate vote happen as soon as possible. what happens in the house, this is an uncertain question right now. democrats are upset that this agreement does not address the issue of immigration and the status of the dreamers. conservatives say all the new spending would blow a big hole in the deficit. the vote will be narrow at best. also lawmakers have about 14 hours to get all of this done or the government shuts down again. casey hunt is on capitol hill that's where the drama is. the house side here. you've got objections you can look at from both sides. democrats saying what about the dreamers. republicans saying what about all this spending. the bottom line, 218 votes,
what's the status right now? can they deliver that? >> reporter: steve, at this particular point in time it does look like the moderate middle is going to win the day over the objections of both the left and the right. of course nancy pelosi taking to the house floor yesterday, a historic eight plus hour speech, the longest in at least a century from what we could figure out. she told her members or rather told reporters but sends a signal to her members this morning at a press conference where she said she will vote against the budget deal. that was a surprise considering that she was involved behind the scenes in these negotiations, not necessarily a surprise in the context of that floor speech, but the critical thing that she also said, she was asked if she is whipping against the budget deal so essentially is she going to go to all the members of her conference and say, don't do this and nancy pelosi is very good at holding her conference together and she
we'll be tracking any unexpected developments here but right now and this is steve a pretty rare thing or has become a pretty rare thing, this bipartisan budget deal is on track because the reality is, congress can do things when both parties are on board. steve? >> we got the shutdown clock ticking away in the lower right. main it won't get to zero this. >> reporter: i think everyone is still scarred from weeks ago. >> thank you for that. with us now is lonnie chen now the director of domestic policy at stanford university. matt and katherine still here with me. lonnie let me bring you in from a republican standpoint. we talk about this budget deal and to go back in time here and to put this into perspective, what's happening here when we talk about this increased domestic spending is that the limits that were put in place when republicans got control of congress after the 2010 midterms, that pea party upriding was taking place, that
big standoff and ryan and obama. they put all these -- all these limits went in place then they are now being lifted. the deficit just next year alone, it looks like it'll jump up another trillion dollars. when you think back to that time in the tea party and you will all the concerns about the deficit, how is this acceptable? >> well, i guess all the fiscal hawks have flown away. it's pretty clear that fiscal discipline is not the paramount value for republicans in congress any more. there are some republicans in the house who are holding firm. i think there's a few in the senate who are saying, we can't possibly sign off on the increased spending. a lot of republicans liked the increased spending on the defense side of the ledger but they had to agree to these massive spending increases on the domestic discretionary side of the ledger. what you're seeing as you noted earlier is a $1.2 trillion deficit in 2019 and deficits that may be over $2 trillion by the time we get to 2027 if the
trump tax cuts are made permanent. this is a lot of spending and it's really against character and form but i guess we're in a day and age in washington where fiscal discipline, fiscal responsibility, those values don't matter as much as any more. >> i wonder just to go back, we see this tea party movement, that label was so prominent, we don't say tea parties much any more, it seems to me what we used to call the tea party in a lot of ways became the trump base. did we misunderstand back then what was really animating the tea party when we said it was all about spending and deficits? >> that's a great point. what we actually saw was that many republican voters are much more comfortable with larger government than we thought. for many, many years republicans were out there arguing for the need for a restrained central government when, in fact, a lot of voters were really saying, look, in theory we like the idea of smaller government but in reality, there are all these things government does that we
like maybe more than we thought. i think it's very difficult also to overstate the role that obamacare played in that 2010 wave. that continues to be an animating force. the sheer notion of fiscal discipline, the notion that government has to restrain spending. that is something that is more of a talking point than actual reality. >> let me bring my panel in here. on this question of the size of government, government spending, was there less of an appetite there on the right all along for that? >> this is the death of the tea party. the final ceremonial could have finn through the stake, stake through the heart of the tea party one of the animating things back then was the mythical trillion dollars deficit figure. my god, a trillion dollars deficit, are we really going to do this? this happened of course after the bailout and the stimulus. that's a big thing to swallow there. people were talking -- this is a sign that we have to put a curb
donald trump. they thought we were the craziest people in the room. >> we have to remember that part of the reason we'll have a trillion dollars deficit this year is also because of tax cuts. it's not only on the spending side. it's also on the tax side where we're being fiscally reckless. republicans care about deficits only when there's a democrat in the white house. an important thing to remember, by the way, is not only should we dare about the thakt that we'll have a trillion dollars deficit right now and probably $2 trillion down the line, we shouldn't care about it only because its hypocritical. it's also supremely ill timed. it's just doesn't make sense. what you want to do is you want to have greater government spending during the great recession, during when you're on the brink of falling into the precipice of a depression. when the tea party was animated was the time when actually it would make more sense from that perspective to spend more money
to go into greater deficits. right now is exactly the opposite time. it's the wrong time to do this. >> the interesting thing, we throw all these different numbers around for people. in the first 200 years of this country's existence, the entire debt that was wracked up, you total up the deficit every single years for 200 years the entire debt was about $1 trillion. we're now talking bay one year deficit of trillion dollars. that's how fast this stuff has accelerated. thank you for joining us. u.s. officials they are sounding the alarm about russian election meddling just months away from the midterm elections. what we are learning about the kremlin's interference in 2016 and the odds that something similar could happen this year? . but imagine something new. at invisalign®, we use the most advanced teeth straightening technology to help you find the next amazing version of yourself.
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at a summit come on the heels of our nbc news exclusive that the russians successfully hacked into the voter registration rolls of several states just prior to the presidential election. here's senior investigative correspondent cynthia mcfadden. >> reporter: a senior intelligence official with direct knowledge of the top secret report says several states had their voting registration system successfully compromised by the russian government. this after u.s. officials had previously revealed 21 states were targeted. we asked homeland security's chief of cybersecurity about that secret document. >> i can't talk about classified information publicly. we saw targeting of 21 states and an exceptionally small number of that 21 were actually successfully penetrated. >> reporter: the fear, russia would remove voters names from the roles creating chaos, potentially swinging the election. >> we were able to determine
that the scanning and probing of voter registration databases was coming from the russian government. >> reporter: jay johnson was dhs secretary when these russian intertrugss were taking place. u.s. intelligence knew by the summer of 2016 the hacking originated from russia. two months later, they told the public. >> should you have done it before october 7th? >> any time you make a difficult national security decision, somebody says, why did you do that and somebody else says, why didn't you do it sooner? >> reporter: it turned out voters names were not removed in 2016 but what about this year? >> my worry is that since that time a lot of states have done little to nothing to actually harden their cybersecurity. >> i would not agree with that assessment. i would say they have all taking it very seriously. >> reporter: nbc news reached out to those 21 states. california and texas, among others, saying their voter system was never attacked. >> i stand by the list. this was a snapshot in time with
visibility that the department had at the time. >> again, our cynthia mcfadden with a troubling report. catherine, there's a disconnect here in terms of the response. ultimately it is up to these individual states to be managing their voter rolls, to be managing election security. the role at the federal level, the role for the president, what should that be here? >> they're very conflicted at this point because this president is invested in the idea that there was no russian meddling in the election. he has said this multiple times despite the fact that our intelligence agencies and other officials at homeland security, et cetera, have said, yes, russia tried to meddle, they did meddle on facebook and elsewhere and apparently with our voter rolls, at least they attempted to. the roll of the white house is complicated because from the president's perspective, it's important to play this down but from the perspective of the democracy of our republic it's
important to be very aggressive and make sure that this does not happen again but how do you do that? how do you straggize and before looking when there's this state of denial that there was any foreign influence or attempted foreign influence within our election. >> people i think are familiar with this but when this subject is raised, when he's asked about it, this is how the president talks about this question of russia interference. >> i think it's important we just continue to say to russia, if you think we don't see what you're doing, we do see it and you need to stop. >> those who would threaten americans experiment in democracy, if you challenge us it will be your longest and your worst day. >> yes, russia did meddle in our elections. >> this threats not going to go away. the russians have been at it a long time and they'll continue to be at it. >> i believe that president putin really feels and he feels strongly that he did not meddle
in our election. what he believes is what he believes. what i believe is that we have to get to work. >> you saw members of the administration saying, yes, russia meddled then you have the president not wanting to that way. with trump too, in his mind at least it seems this cannot be separated from democrats saying you're not a legitimate president. >> keep in mind that the president created a presidential commission on election integrity last year. this is a contested election. there are these incredible allegations that russia is trying to hack into voter roles and other things like that, so what was this commission about? it wasn't about this. it was about looking for illegal immigrants. trying to prove the baseless conspiracy theory that donald trump didn't get or hillary clinton got 3 million votes from illegal immigrants. it was run by chris coback who's the biggest conspiracy theorist
in america. so his mind seems to be operating on i'm going to prove this thing about my own personal fortunes which have -- from his point of view russia has nothing to do with that. it's remarkable that they had a chance to take a role or look into that and they went into the opposite direction. >> the wording that former president bush used there was interesting. russia meddled. now whether that affected the election is another question. so he's making an effort to say, i'm not immediately connecting whatever interference happened to the fact that trump won. those folks in the administration who want to talk about this as we just showed in that clip, is there a way for them to present it in a similar way that would get the president publicly to take it more seriously? >> i think it's very challenging. trump makes everything about him. he makes a gold star widows tragedy about him. he makes the military about him. that's how -- that's his lens through which he sees the world,
whether things are good or bad for him. it's going to be very challenging to get him to say publicly what all of these members of his administration have been saying is we need to take this threat seriously. he's going to feel insecure and feel like, well, if you're cuesing russia of meddling in our elections, that's casting doubt on the legitimacy of myself, of my own presidency. >> it should be pointed out that george w bush is the right way to talk about it. they talked about the election got hacked. that's not accurate. >> we are just a few hours away from that senate vote on that big bipartisan spending deal that would keep the government funded and forestall a shutdown. key groups are fighting against it including the freedom caucus. a member of that caucus warn davidson, he is going to way in. stay tuned. which is why we're helping to replenish the mighty rio grande
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still be no. >> i just think it's a bad deal. i think it's unfortunate that this is where it goes. >> this spending bill is a debt junky's dream. >> i'm not only a no, i'm a hell, no. >> he is a hell, no on this. i'm joined by warren davidson of ohio. let me ask you, are you also a no on this? >> i'll be voting no on this bill. i agree. it's just too much spending. there's no shortage of good ideas up here. there's a lot of good causes but the amount of money to pay for it is not unlimited. we need to show some fiscal discipline here. >> if you think that no vote is going to end up mattering because the speak of the house paul ryan was on with hugh hewitt and his radio show and he said, we, we the republicans, have the votes we need on this. do you think that assessment is correct? >> i assume the speaker and the whip have an accurate whip count
before they did the deal. i think they had to know what it was going to take to get this across the finish line or they wouldn't have been able to commit to a deal. i assume they have it but i assume that there will be a pretty large number of republicans that vote no on it. >> the fact, though, the speaker, the house speaker and paul ryan of course his issue, one of his major issue at least in the past has been taming budget deficits, cutting spending, austerity, that type of emphasis in the past. this agreement would see the deficit just next year alone exceed a trillion dollars. what is happening in a republican party that a few years ago when it first won control of the house nearly forced a shutdown over the issue of government spending that now many of your colleagues, including the speaker are willing to support a trillion dollars deficit next year. >> you point out a real disconnect between what our brand has been and certainly what the speaker's brand has been. people have really dealt with that all year.
the house passed a more discipline plan back in september and we've been in cr after cr. we did increase spending for the military in part because of just the real readiness issues we faced over the past year. unfortunately, we've had more training fatalities than combat fatalities in a year where we had a fair bit of compat. i think it's, you know, readily apparent to the american public that we got readiness issues and we've got ships crashing into one another out in the ocean. that goes to understaffing and our crews and lack of crews. we wanted to get the money to our military. it's been held up in the senate largely over daca. the house senate bill over just this week that funded our military but held the line on nondefense spending, unfortunately when it came back from the senate it's got a lot more of everything. it's not that they're bad causes, we do really have a constraint in terms of how much things we can pay for. >> the question there you
mentioned, the status of the dreamers, the folks brought to this country by their parents years ago have been living here. the senate working on some legislation. let me ask you from your standpoint to get permanent legal protection for the dreamers enshrined in law, are you asking for concessions in return and what are those concessions? >> i think the house bill that's got the most traction is bob goodlatte's bill and i'm taking a look at that. that spans a large cross section of republicans. we're hoping that some democrats will see that as the vehicle that will move in the house. the senate's working on a different path. i'm pushing to make sure the federal law which is the only body of law on immigration states don't have state jurisdiction over immigration, that states are clearly premted in their actions related to immigration by federal statute. it does good things, like, you
know, deal with -- deal with the border security issues. not just a wall but overall security reforms there like the ability to return people to come here illegally at the border. the ability to address chain migration and shift to a more merit based system and it ends the visa lottery. >> warren davidson from ohio. a no vote on that budget agreement. thank you for joining us. >> thank you. former vice president joe biden sitting down for a one-on-one interview with our own andea mitchell and weighing in on that latest scandal to hit the white house. that is next. a little to the left. 1, 2, 3, push! easy! easy! easy! (horn honking) alright! alright! we've all got places to go! we've all got places to go! washington crossing the delaware turnpike?
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come in now for this exceptional offer on the cadillac ct6. get this low-mileage lease on this 2018 cadillac ct6 from around $549 per month. visit your local cadillac dealer. moments ago, in a one-on-one interview with andrea mitchell, former vice president joe biden weighed in on white house staff secretary rob porter's pending departure from the white house. he is the white house aide who resigned yesterday amid allegations of domestic abuse. here's what biden told andrea mitchell within the last hour. >> how do you explain his access to the president of the united states and the chief of staff, frankly, in the last 24 hours,
describing him as a man of personal integrity? >> i can't explain it. it is long past due that he's departed. if you look at it from the perspective of one thing, the fbi didn't think he should get a permanent security clearance. >> they had to know that. >> sure they knew that. they still did it. look, the culture is changing, and thank god, but not fast enough. the idea that this would happen in the oval office. now, i don't know. i heard when i was briefed on the way in when the president found out about it, he said, go. if that's the case, the president never knew about it, good for the president for saying that. >> how could the president not know one of his closest advisers did not have a top security clearance? what does that say about the president and this white house? >> oh, andrea. look, i'm having enormous difficu difficulty understanding how
this white house functions. >> again, that's joe biden just in the last hour with our own andrea mitchell. joining me is national political correspondent for the "washington post." also, my panel is back with me. karen, we've been talking this hour, obviously, about the situation with rob porter. one of the questions here, you see andrea raising it, too, is the question of who knew what and who knew it when inside the white house. specifically with john kelly. do you think that this scandal calls into question at all john kelly's status as chief of staff? >> i think it does. i think the questions are going to continue. right now, it looks like there are only two options here. either this was a case of massive mismanagement, or they knew this and decided it didn't matter. >> let me ask you, too, changing gears here, we have some reporting -- and you wrote a column about this -- the
democratic congressional campaign committee are going to announce today 101 republican targets in their battle to get control of the house in 2018. that would be the largest battlefield democrats are envisioning in a decade, since they were sort of the house majority back under nancy pelosi. you were writing this week about some of the potential worry spots for democrats, even though the landscape looks favorable. what do you see the worry spots to be? >> one big one is that the assumption that donald trump and his unpopularity is going to do all their work for them. i talked to a number of democrats who are concerned that the democratic message, they have not honed their own message. there is also a downside to this extraordinary number of democratic candidates that we see this year. it is probably going to be a record. that means that we're going to have to -- we're going to have to see them go through some messy, potentially rocky primaries ahead, too. that could also weaken their
hand. the target list is not so -- it is not determinative. meaning, by this fall, they probably will not be spending money in over 100 districts. but this is sort of an early cut on places where they do see some potential. the big lesson, i think, democrats have learned in, for instance, virginia, is that they really need to be looking at a broad field. some of their opportunities may not be in obvious places. >> interesting. you see all the special elections, and some are so obscure, but it is showing high democratic energy. if you have that in the mid-terms, who knows what it could lead to. thank you for the abbreviated visit. thank you, all, for being with us this hour. you can see much more from former vice president joe biden's interview we just showed you a clip of. that'll be on "andrea mitchell reports" tonight at noon eastern only on msnbc. we'll be right back with today's
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