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And that could be good. now, look could it lead to bailouts from the federal government. youre not a person and change the bankruptcy law for people and its harder to go bankrupt now. it should be harder for cities and towns. they can raise revenues and raise taxes and dont have to throw up their hands and maybe we cant pay for this, a few years ago. >> gary k. what do you think about this? >> i think tobin and gary b, so right. all roads are going to lead to the taxpayer and the state arbitrari...

Should people in oklahoma, wind up picking up the tab for these guys in harrisburg, i mean, this is a local-- >> theyre not theyre going to pick up the tab in pennsylvania. >> well, fine, i live in one part of pennsylvania and now i can pay for my brother in harrisburg because he made a dopey decision? and the local and the way to do that is bankruptcy. >> do you see, gary b there might be a difference between vallejo and harrisburg? yfrjts he, theres a difference in why the foundation is absolu...

Bears, lets get to it. gary b smith. tobin smith. jonas max ferris, and the economic policy institutes kristin dorsey. welcome gary k will the triple whammy whack the economy back into recession. >> im going to be the the scrooge here, i think so. theres just a lot of things happening all at once that tell me, theres a problem ahead. number one, were looking at european interest rates to skyrocket and theres no absolutely no confidence there, the numbers out of asia now, particularly china have ...

9% unemployment and to think that this is all fear-based. were talking reality here and for me, the unemployment looks to be 12 to 15% and i dont think you can get away with that and when you see grosse pointe woods numbers at 2%, you might as well as be flat because in the numbers, a lot of statistics like inventory that doesnt matter to me that much. i just think, were already on the cusp of it and just think were getting close here with whats happening in europe and nothing getting done here....

>> jehmu, please, im sorry, please, weve got to-- please, im sorry, ill give you all the time i can. gary b, quickly finish, i want to get to matt, too, dont have much time. >> we last had economy killing tax rates back then in the 70s and the economy was dead for nearly 20 years. if jehmu wants that kind of society, great. well then no-- >> ill give you the last word, jehmu, matt. >> and quickly, you talk about hitting the 68% is actually what it could move up to margin marginal tax rate and re...

If were going to choose where to do the plants, do it in areas where they dont cost us money on strikes and dont threaten to strike because that kills the economics of doing business. now, if he we cant argue economics and doing business, theyre going to move. >> i know this is a hot topic and ive got to get to gary b. gary b? >> well, im still going back to jehmus comment how boeing is trampling the middle class. what about the people in south carolina who wouldnt get a job here? boeing trying ...

Everyones pocket. not exactly tax cuts. second of all -- >> yeah. tax cuts -- >> hold on! >> proposals in here was to stop any spending of the excess stimulus money that we still have around. you never came back to address the point since weve had stimulus, the unemployment rate is higher so how can you argue on any front that stimulus spending works? 6>> unemployment was running away before we created stimulus. >> it was lower than 9 1/2%. >> slows unemployment. you have to admit that the rate ...

Shareholder money anyway unless they had something to gain from it and they need stores to grow. thats why theyre doing it. >> i have to go to gary b. gary b? >> well, lets -- ill go with jennifers pointed. well seen stipulate its a bribe. but the fact is cities slowly but surely want wal-mart there. right here in d.c., they want wal-mart in ward 5. reason? they think its going to bring 1,200 jobs. in chicago, they unanimously passed a proposal from wal-mart to open five stores because wal-mart ...

Cape canaveral. atlas five putting them on a trek to the red planet and curiosity will look for evidence that mars may once have been or suitable for life. we have more 30 minutes away. >> brenda: options for bankruptcy over bailout. harrisburg, pennsylvania was trying to do just that, but a judge just blocking the cash strapped city from doing it. and gary b, you say this, no to bankruptcy says yes to more taxpayer funded bailouts? >> exactly, brenda, look, we saw this happen in the hue and cry...

Inflation, and so stay tuned for that. so, toby, you are quite concerned that gary b is wrong, in fact, you might even be using the d word? >> there are many parts of our economy that nr fact in a depression not just home builders and construction. the things related to those industry for 30 and 40 million people in the united states its not a question of recession. the question is are they ever going to get out of that depression. that starts to eat into the economy. and very soft whether its p...