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That also happens a lot in criminal cases. so, you know, what we are seeing is frankly not atypical in a criminal proceeding and in criminal cases, which there are confessions. thats why we have that term, and we use it often. thats why we have the term witnesses, because often there are people who actually observe the crime as it is happening. so hthis is what were seeing with this case. >> im always fascinated in courtrooms when a defendant or their attorney argues, no one would be so stupid t...

Legal standpoint -- theres no way whatever phone calls are out there, that theyre just going to be given up. >> no. >> and we dont even know that the transcript we have seen, the rough transcript of the readout of the call with the ukrainian president -- we dont know how accurate it is. >> no. >> its not a word for word as the president claimed it was. >> one of the deeply weird things about how the whole ukraine scandal has unfolded is that they have objected to disclosing basically any sorts o...